Significant restrictions are being proposed in 2024 Novembers RAC's

[slamdunk]

I’m on board with increasing are age class.

There are only two options for that without cutting tags even further, hence the entire ongoing arguments in this thread.

 

[elkassassin]

I Still Say Giving The OPPOR-F'N-TUNISTS A Few Units To Destroy Would Be A Good Plan!

When They Enter The OPPORTUNIST'S Program They Are Locked In It For Life!

Give Them 2 or 3 Tags Annually!

Let Em Hunt 6 Months Out Of The Year!

Let Them Kill Anything From FAWNS On Up To Their Trophy Class Of OPPORTUNITY Bucks!

When Them Units Are F'D Up Don't Come A BAWLIN!

Just Keep Your OPPORTUNITY & Keep On Hunting!

 

[quest]

I think it’s a fine line to get there and not all units are created equal. Pine Valley unit well that’s a yes. Just hear me out… the 4 point thing would work if its rotated every other year not on going for 3+. We can give those young bucks a year or two. The whole idea is to increase the age factor not to wipe out all 4 points.

 

[elkassassin]

And Start Enforcing The APR's (If You're Gonna Have Them?)

Make A Few HELL-F'N-RIGHT Examples & I Guaran-Damn-Tee You Alot Of The BS Would Stop!

No,You'll Never Stop It All!

I think it’s a fine line to get there and not all units are created equal. Pine Valley unit well that’s a yes. Just hear me out… the 4 point thing would work if its rotated every other year not on going for 3+. We can give those young bucks a year or two. The whole idea is to increase the age factor not to wipe out all 4 points.

 

[slamdunk]

How Bout We Grow Some More Deer So We Can Offer More F'N Opportunity?

Instead Of:

Let's YANK The Magnified Scopes Off Of SmokePoles,Study It For 5 GAWD-DAMNED Years,And See If That Fixed The DRATville Deer Herd!

Then When They See That Didn't Fix The Deer Herd They Can Say:

Well,We Tried!

Let's Go To STUPID SHHITT Plan # 567 & Try That For 5 Years & See If That Fixes It!

HINT:

It Won't And Not Any Of These Other STUPID SSHITT Plans Is Gonna Fix It Either!

Gonna Take Some Major CHANGE To Try & Turn It Around!

These proposals aren't designed to grow more deer, we all should know that.

Want more deer, heck yes we do.

Figure out a new version of 1080, keep Doe's off the streets and stop the late season depredation killings.

 

[quest]

I don’t like the idea of harvesting does and goes against the grain if you want to grow more deer. There was a video awhile back on whitetail deer and they found out that does contribute more to antler growth than buck deer.

 

[slamdunk]

I don’t like the idea of harvesting does and goes against the grain if you want to grow more deer. There was a video awhile back on whitetail deer and they found out that does contribute more to antler growth than buck deer.

100%

 

[quest]

We could open some units early like September for rifles hunters it would make it a hard hunt do to the weather but I think you could issue more tags because of the lower success rate. What do you think?

 

[slamdunk]

We could open some units early like September for rifles hunters it would make it a hard hunt do to the weather but I think you could issue more tags because of the lower success rate. What do you think?

In my mind that would be worse.

Better weather, more accessible areas, bucks could still be in bachelor groups, easier to find.

But maybe I'm wrong...

 

[quest]

You may have point

In my mind that would be worse.

Better weather, more accessible areas, bucks could still be in bachelor groups, easier to find.

But maybe I'm wrong...

 

[quest]

I don’t like late hunts it’s seems to me we hammer the heck out of our deer. I’m ok with more opportunity for bow hunters the success rate is so low. It’s good for the younger generation.

 

[quest]

What’s going on with the coyotes it seems the more we hammer them the more they have bigger liters. I think I’ve had to much caffeine today anyway carry on

 

[slamdunk]

What’s going on with the coyotes it seems the more we hammer them the more they have bigger liters. I think I’ve had to much caffeine today anyway carry on

They are an absolute infestation for sure.

Even with the best coyote hunters today using all the fancy tech available, the dog numbers are extremely high.

 

[Elkrunning-Scared]

If the whole state went to APR everyone could have a tag.
The harvest success would drop tremendously.

The youth could harvest whatever and if it starts getting out of hand and the youth can’t keep it in check, then they can start managing and issuing tags on each unit 4 point or less for adults and keep it in check.

It’s not really that hard.

 

[quest]

I wish we had the nasty stuff in the past that kept coyotes in check but it was to good killing everything that ate it.

 

[quest]

If the whole state went to APR everyone could have a tag.
The harvest success would drop tremendously.

The youth could harvest whatever and if it starts getting out of hand and the youth can’t keep it in check, then they can start managing and issuing tags on each unit 4 point or less for adults and keep it in check.

It’s not really that hard.

It all sounds good but there’s other that just want to hunt a buck they don’t care how big it is they just want to get out there.

 

[notdonhunting]

Since hossblur won't answer i open it up to anyone that wants to answer, and please explain your reasoning.
Do you believe making recurve and long bows the only legal means hunting deer during the Archery?

 

[quest]

Since hossblur won't answer i open it up to anyone that wants to answer, and please explain your reasoning.
Do you believe making recurve and long bows the only legal means hunting deer during the Archery?

Who are you asking?

 

[quest]

I’m sorry I read that wrong your talking to anyone. So I’ll give my two cents MAYBE in some units where the deer herds are really struggling. It’s not in it for me to take away someone preferred method of take. I hope I didn’t step on anyone toes.

 

[Elkrunning-Scared]

It all sounds good but there’s other that just want to hunt a buck they don’t care how big it is they just want to get out there.

Right! Do you realize how many tags they would be issuing for 4 point or less after two or 3 years. I think that will accommodate the hunters that don’t really care what they harvest as long as they fill there tag.

The 4 point or more and it has to be 4 point on both sides or more you could issue a ton of tags and still have way low success.

 

[quest]

That why I think they should rotate it every other year on 4 pionts

 

[Elkrunning-Scared]

That why I think they should rotate it every other year on 4 pionts

I think that wouldn’t be very productive I’m on board with every 2 years. Then they can adjust it for the health of the herd.

 

[hossblur]

I’m hossblur?

I thought I was Bux and Dux???

Now I’m really confused.

Neither one of us hunt

 

[quest]

My thoughts was to take the stress off 4 points the next year and give others hunter’s that just want to hunt.

 

[Betterluckythangood]

How many points are you guys thinking it would take to draw such a unit, currently? How about five years down the road? How many points then? Or are you talking about statewide?

 

[quest]

I think it will be easy to put in the first year after that I don’t know? It worries me if we concentrate on just 4 points we’re going to just wipe out most of the progress me made. How are they going to keep the buck/doe ratio if they don’t harvest smaller bucks? These are questions that we need to ask maybe slamdunk can answer?

 

[ktg]

The whole idea is to increase the age factor not to wipe out all 4 points.

Think about what a 4 point or better restriction does. It forces everyone with a tag to hunt only 4 points. The result is there will be fewer 4 points left after the season than there would have been under an any buck rule. Admittedly, there will be more 2.5 yr old deer to hunt, but odds are that 99% of them will be killed. A buck over 2.5 yrs old will be rare.
If you change that to "...not wipe out all the 2 points", then you're accurate.

 

[ktg]

They are an absolute infestation for sure.

Even with the best coyote hunters today using all the fancy tech available, the dog numbers are extremely high.

I spent 13 days hunting in Arizona this year. In those 13 days, I averaged seeing a coyote a day. They didn't care that I was there. Had one at 10 yards.
On the other hand, in Utah, I see maybe 1 or 2 coyotes a year and they're usually hundreds of yards away on a dead run. If that's an infestation, Arizona is overrun. I don't know if people just don't hunt them there or what.

 

[elkassassin]

Now This I'd Like To See!

A SURPLUS In The DRATville Deer Herd!

HINT:

You'll Never See The F'N Day!

If the whole state went to APR everyone could have a tag.
The harvest success would drop tremendously.

The youth could harvest whatever and if it starts getting out of hand and the youth can’t keep it in check, then they can start managing and issuing tags on each unit 4 point or less for adults and keep it in check.

It’s not really that hard.

 

[quest]

I spent 13 days hunting in Arizona this year. In those 13 days, I averaged seeing a coyote a day. They didn't care that I was there. Had one at 10 yards.
On the other hand, in Utah, I see maybe 1 or 2 coyotes a year and they're usually hundreds of yards away on a dead run. If that's an infestation, Arizona is overrun. I don't know if people just don't hunt them there or what.

Pine Valley was loaded with them this year as far as seeing them every day probably not. I think they move down with the deer when they migrate to NV. I don’t hunt them but I’m hoping the word gets out and maybe someone can make some money if that still offer that program?

 

[hogg_65]

Change it to Non Typical Bucks Only for the APR.

Buck must have horizontal cheater's on both sides and a spread of 30" wide or more to be legal to kill on Utah general hunts.

All bucks must be checked by utdwr biologist within 48 hrs of harvest.
No pictures of said Bucks are allowed to be posted on social media platforms until checked and verified by utdwr biologist.

That should put more bucks on the landscape.

 

[elkassassin]

LMAO hogg!

I'll Go Along With Your Plan!

Let's See How Many Others Will?

30"+!

Cheaters!

I'm In!

Most Hunters Have Never Seen Bucks Like You're Talkin On General Units!

HELL-F'N-RIGHT!

Change it to Non Typical Bucks Only for the APR.

Buck must have horizontal cheater's on both sides and a spread of 30" wide or more to be legal to kill on Utah general hunts.

All bucks must be checked by utdwr biologist within 48 hrs of harvest.
No pictures of said Bucks are allowed to be posted on social media platforms until checked and verified by utdwr biologist.

That should put more bucks on the landscape.

 

[slamdunk]

I spent 13 days hunting in Arizona this year. In those 13 days, I averaged seeing a coyote a day. They didn't care that I was there. Had one at 10 yards.
On the other hand, in Utah, I see maybe 1 or 2 coyotes a year and they're usually hundreds of yards away on a dead run. If that's an infestation, Arizona is overrun. I don't know if people just don't hunt them there or what.

Seeing them has never been a simple task, especially where they are heavily hunted like everywhere in Utah.

We have some of the best coyote hunters in the west right here, Al Morris, Tom Austin (both of whom work for FoxPro) and John Bair, just to name a few.
These guys kill hundreds of dogs a year right here under our noses.

I'll retract my "infestation" comment.
It is extreme, but a coyote is a cockroach, and when you see those, you have an infestation.

 

[elkassassin]

The Harder You Hunt Them The Smarter They Get!

 

[hogg_65]

LMAO hogg!

I'll Go Along With Your Plan!

Let's See How Many Others Will?

30"+!

Cheaters!

I'm In!

Most Hunters Have Never Seen Bucks Like You're Talkin On General Units!

HELL-F'N-RIGHT!

How many legal Bucks get killed in Utah with those APR restrictions?

Is that aggressive enough to put more bucks on the landscape?

Will that surplus of Bucks after 2 years, get all the does bred and bred early?

Who would complain not being allowed to shoot a 2pt?

 

[elkassassin]

How many legal Bucks get killed in Utah with those APR restrictions?Not Many For Several Years!

Is that aggressive enough to put more bucks on the landscape?That's A Perty Damn Good Start!

Will that surplus of Bucks after 2 years, get all the does bred and bred early?Probably So!

Who would complain not being allowed to shoot a 2pt? Oh We have Some Of Them On Here!

I Can Hear The OPPOR-F'N-TUNISTS BAWLING Already!

 

[slamdunk]

Who would complain not being allowed to shoot a 2pt?

A hell of a lot more than you realize, probably the majority of GS hunters.

 

[hogg_65]

A hell of a lot more than you realize, probably the majority of GS hunters.

So continue cater to that majority?
I say APR restrictions like what I proposed above is better than:
Tag Cuts.
Unit/Season closures.

 

[elkassassin]

I'd Let Them PISSCUTTER Pounders Pound Sand For A Few Years!

 

[hogg_65]

They would be able to hunt deer.
They just couldn't shoot that MOTL looking at them on the side of the road.

 

[slamdunk]

So continue cater to that majority?
I say APR restrictions like what I proposed above is better than:
Tag Cuts.
Unit/Season closures.

With the utmost respect, we are into this thread 638 posts now.
There isn't much that hasn't already been tossed around, debated or argued over.

No one on here can physically do anything to these proposals, we are simply a chat forum.

If you're serious about being heard, the RAC's are there for us all, as are emails to the committees, rac members and wildlife board.

 

[Bux n Dux]

So continue cater to that majority?
I say APR restrictions like what I proposed above is better than:
Tag Cuts.
Unit/Season closures.

The current APR proposal just makes for a banner youth hunt. A tag in your pocket does no good when the majority of the bucks alive in the unit aren’t legal by definition.

 

[elkassassin]

With the utmost respect, we are into this thread 638 posts now.
There isn't much that hasn't already been tossed around, debated or argued over.

No one on here can physically do anything to these proposals, we are simply a chat forum.

If you're serious about being heard, the RAC's are there for us all, as are emails to the committees, rac members and wildlife board.

And No Matter What The RAC's Decide The WB Can & Will Over-Ride It!

 

[elkassassin]

True!

But Are We Gonna Give Them A Chance To Mature A Bit?

Or Not?

The current APR proposal just makes for a banner youth hunt. A tag in your pocket does no good when the majority of the bucks alive in the unit aren’t legal by definition.

 

[slamdunk]

True!

But Are We Gonna Give Them A Chance To Mature A Bit?

Or Not?

It's getting too many thumbs down.....Kamala wins
"Four More Years"
6 in this case

 

[elkassassin]

DAMN It PUNK!

I Was Already In A Bad Enough Mood & You Had To Mention That!

JUDAS!

It's getting too many thumbs down.....Kamala wins

 

[hogg_65]

With the utmost respect, we are into this thread 638 posts now.
There isn't much that hasn't already been tossed around, debated or argued over.

No one on here can physically do anything to these proposals, we are simply a chat forum.

If you're serious about being heard, the RAC's are there for us all, as are emails to the committees, rac members and wildlife board.

Agree with you slamdunk
Nobody has taken the APR to that extreme on this thread.
Thought I would throw something on the wall with the rest of you.
I will continue to do surveys and respond to the dwr rac proposals and watch/attend the racs right along with you.
Also watch the board do as they please.
Then read all the MM chatter and post sparingly.

 

[slamdunk]

Agree with you slamdunk
Nobody has taken the APR to that extreme on this thread.
Thought I would throw something on the wall with the rest of you.
I will continue to do surveys and respond to the dwr rac proposals and watch/attend the racs right along with you.
Also watch the board do as they please.
Then read all the MM chatter and post sparingly.

Lol....that's all we can do, my friend

 

[elkassassin]

You Need to Post More Often hogg!

And I Quote:

Watch The Board Do As They Please!!!!

Agree with you slamdunk
Nobody has taken the APR to that extreme on this thread.
Thought I would throw something on the wall with the rest of you.
I will continue to do surveys and respond to the dwr rac proposals and watch/attend the racs right along with you.
Also watch the board do as they please.
Then read all the MM chatter and post sparingly.

 

[elkassassin]

Am I Enhancing My Odds On Any 2025 Permits Yet?

 

[quest]

I’m definitely not a talker when it comes to these rac meetings but maybe someone on here could do that slamdunk hmmm ?

 

[hossblur]

I Still Say Giving The OPPOR-F'N-TUNISTS A Few Units To Destroy Would Be A Good Plan!

When They Enter The OPPORTUNIST'S Program They Are Locked In It For Life!

Give Them 2 or 3 Tags Annually!

Let Em Hunt 6 Months Out Of The Year!

Let Them Kill Anything From FAWNS On Up To Their Trophy Class Of OPPORTUNITY Bucks!

When Them Units Are F'D Up Don't Come A BAWLIN!

Just Keep Your OPPORTUNITY & Keep On Hunting!

Deal.

And, everyone who wants tag cuts, gives up deer hunting

 

[Bux n Dux]

True!

But Are We Gonna Give Them A Chance To Mature A Bit?

Or Not?

Not if the kids get to shoot anything with antlers

 

[elkassassin]

Did You Not COMPRE-F'N-HEND?

So 2 Or 3 Tags Isn't Enough For You Per Year?

Hunting For 6 Months Out Of The Year Isn't Enough For You?

Getting You COVETED Guaranteed Tags Every Year Isn't Enough For You?

Killing Any Deer You Wanna Kill Isn't Enough For You?

PLEASE SPLAIN JUST WTF WOULD SATISFY YOU?

Deal.

And, everyone who wants tag cuts, gives up deer hunting

 

[elkassassin]

Ya!

They Need To Start A YOUTH ONLY Unit Or Two As Well!

They Just Can't F'N Stand Not To Kill The PISSCUTTER Bucks!

QUALITY/MATURE BUCK Units Are Not For Everybody!

Let Them OTHER/OPPORTUNISTS Have A Piece Of Their Own F'N Pie & Let Them Manage Them Units As They DAMN Well Please!

After They FRICK Em Up,Don't Come A BAWLIN!

Not if the kids get to shoot anything with antlers

 

[hossblur]

Hossblur,
Do you really think it is a good idea to only allow recurve and long bows as archery equipment?

A good idea? Statewide or single unit?

I think bow success rates are pretty low to start with, so while there are tweak, I'm not sure long bows just yet.

 

[hossblur]

He does, in the name of "opportunity." You know, on the one unit that they are proposing restrictions to recurve and long bows that they are removing from the general season units and making it LE again.

You know....opportunity! He'll show up with his long bow ready to go on that tag that will still be there, though!

You should pick up a bow. As the spokesman for oppurtunists, you should try your hand at the hunt that gives the most oppurtunity.

I did. Just for that reason. Got my boys involved because it's easy to see that in the future, that's where the most tags will be, thus the most oppurtunity.

Pick one up, it will make you less likely to cry about the injustice of losing your 20x

 

[hossblur]

What's become abundantly clear is Tristate version of "oppurtunity" is shared by quite a few people.

Somehow, dudes believe oppurtunity, means license=buck. Bess obviously does. I'm starting to believe Vanilla does as well.

Oppurtunity simply means you get a tag. And frankly, ANY tag is better than sitting home. Whether you kill I'd up to you.

I picked up a bow at 40 because it was easy to see, archery is where the oppurtunity is headed.

I love the old stories, I tell them too. But I don't live in old Utah. My stories about hunting foothills, got replaced with three car garages and swimming pools.

My stories of watching big bucks migrate off the west side of Sanpete to the desert got replaced with i-15 and continued bumper to bumper.

My story about the one weekend we hunted in St George got replaced by one of the fastest growing cities in the US.


But what also was a story, my open sight side hammer muzzy shooting #11 and pistol powder with 390 gr slugs, got replaced with a CVA Accura complete with scope, 777, and powerbelt.

My story of the 99c Savage .308 with open sights, is now a scoped 06'.

We can continue to pretend it's Utah 1960 or we can accept it's 2024.

Our deer herds won't get bigger. We can fight to maintain them, but they won't get bigger. Our towns will. Our roads will, our rzr will.

So. We can either throw up our hands, load up a Lapua with a 30x gps guided and get to ending hunting.

Or. We can hunt.

As apparently one of the few true oppurtunists in here, I'm obviously in the minority. I'll take the tag. Because any tag, is better than golf.

 

[Elkslayer2015]

If the whole state went to APR everyone could have a tag.
The harvest success would drop tremendously.

The youth could harvest whatever and if it starts getting out of hand and the youth can’t keep it in check, then they can start managing and issuing tags on each unit 4 point or less for adults and keep it in check.

It’s not really that hard.

I 100% agree on this. The hard part is getting people on board.

I seen a pic yesterday on a flat bed trailer of 8 hunters and 8 dead deer and the biggest one was a 3x3 the rest were dinky 3x2 and 2 points and 1 spike. two of the hunters was youth the rest were adults.
The funny thing about all of this is they complained to my buddy they didn't see any big bucks and they wasn't going home empty handed, my buddy told them well if you let them walk they will have a chance to get bigger. The dad laughed and said let them walk for someone else to shoot. by the time we draw this tag again they will all be dead, I guess it took them 4 years to draw.
The dad makes a valid point and the only way to stop this is APR.

 

[Elkslayer2015]

What is a good buck to doe ratio for a healthy herd Slam?

 

[Vanilla]

What's become abundantly clear is Tristate version of "oppurtunity" is shared by quite a few people.

Somehow, dudes believe oppurtunity, means license=buck. Bess obviously does. I'm starting to believe Vanilla does as well.

Oppurtunity simply means you get a tag. And frankly, ANY tag is better than sitting home. Whether you kill I'd up to you.

I picked up a bow at 40 because it was easy to see, archery is where the oppurtunity is headed.

I love the old stories, I tell them too. But I don't live in old Utah. My stories about hunting foothills, got replaced with three car garages and swimming pools.

My stories of watching big bucks migrate off the west side of Sanpete to the desert got replaced with i-15 and continued bumper to bumper.

My story about the one weekend we hunted in St George got replaced by one of the fastest growing cities in the US.


But what also was a story, my open sight side hammer muzzy shooting #11 and pistol powder with 390 gr slugs, got replaced with a CVA Accura complete with scope, 777, and powerbelt.

My story of the 99c Savage .308 with open sights, is now a scoped 06'.

We can continue to pretend it's Utah 1960 or we can accept it's 2024.

Our deer herds won't get bigger. We can fight to maintain them, but they won't get bigger. Our towns will. Our roads will, our rzr will.

So. We can either throw up our hands, load up a Lapua with a 30x gps guided and get to ending hunting.

Or. We can hunt.

As apparently one of the few true oppurtunists in here, I'm obviously in the minority. I'll take the tag. Because any tag, is better than golf.

Too long, didn’t read after the bolded part. But you 100% know this isn’t true. So it makes me wonder who got to you? Give us the money trail Hossy!

Also, I don’t own a 20x, but good try! Enough swings and a miss from you in this thread to have a perfect game with 27 strike outs.

 

[Keystone]

Its wild to read Vanilla.

Vanilla, the entire state, short of maybe box elder archery, is limited entry now. I realuze not for LL holders, but the rest of us have to put in actual applications, and build points and cross fingers. So a few higher age class bucks on units we hunt every 3rd year and getting worse, is a positive

 

[hossblur]

Too long, didn’t read after the bolded part. But you 100% know this isn’t true. So it makes me wonder who got to you? Give us the money trail Hossy!

Also, I don’t own a 20x, but good try! Enough swings and a miss from you in this thread to have a perfect game with 27 strike outs.

Winchester, Marlin, Henry.

Obviously this is a scheme by them to dominate the hunting world.

 

[Vanilla]

Its wild to read Vanilla.

Vanilla, the entire state, short of maybe box elder archery, is limited entry now. I realuze not for LL holders, but the rest of us have to put in actual applications, and build points and cross fingers. So a few higher age class bucks on units we hunt every 3rd year and getting worse, is a positive

And the fact that I do NOT have to wait in line and would benefit from these things more than most, yet I’m still against them, ought to tell you something.

Enjoy your every 5-6 years hunting in the future I guess. Because that’s where you are headed. (If you’re lucky)

I won’t force anyone to help themselves. Believe what you want, but I’ll be here saying I told you so when it’s all said and done, and nobody will be able to say I didn’t try.

 

[Keystone]

And the fact that I do NOT have to wait in line and would benefit from these things more than most, yet I’m still against them, ought to tell you something.

Enjoy your every 5-6 years hunting in the future I guess. Because that’s where you are headed. (If you’re lucky)

I won’t force anyone to help themselves. Believe what you want, but I’ll be here saying I told you so when it’s all said and done, and nobody will be able to say I didn’t try.

You benefit either way. Thats just reality.

we were headed to 5-6 the day before these proposals.
Ive read you a lot. You hold a LL but think you represent us avg guy. You are supposedly against the backroom, yet you suport SFW.. You dont like the idea of these units pushing pressure to other units, yet youve listed all the units youve done that to.

Seems like you want it both ways on everything so you can always say "i told you so"?

 

[Vanilla]

I support SFW?

Haha!

Good hell. Nobody cares about actually telling the truth anymore. And I thought politicians were bad.

And just so we are clear: I don’t speak for anyone but myself. I represent nobody. So I don’t claim to represent anyone but my own views.

Keep swinging. I don’t care. You can make me the boogie man if it makes you feel better about yourself. I’m done trying to convince people not to cut their own throats.

 

[hossblur]

I support SFW?

Haha!

Good hell. Nobody cares about actually telling the truth anymore. And I thought politicians were bad.

And just so we are clear: I don’t speak for anyone but myself. I represent nobody. So I don’t claim to represent anyone but my own views.

Keep swinging. I don’t care. You can make me the boogie man if it makes you feel better about yourself. I’m done trying to convince people not to cut their own throats.

How much have you spent on expo lotto tickets in the last decade?

How much since it started?

 

[Betterluckythangood]

We definitely don’t need any more units going to LE if that is the end game

 

[hossblur]

I support SFW?

Haha!

Good hell. Nobody cares about actually telling the truth anymore. And I thought politicians were bad.

And just so we are clear: I don’t speak for anyone but myself. I represent nobody. So I don’t claim to represent anyone but my own views.

Keep swinging. I don’t care. You can make me the boogie man if it makes you feel better about yourself. I’m done trying to convince people not to cut their own throats.

$9.7 million raised from show passes, auctions, tag sales


Tell me again you don't support them?

Does your money go somewhere else as part of the $5 tickets? Because everyone else's goes to $fw.

 

[Vanilla]

How much have you spent on expo lotto tickets in the last decade?

How much since it started?

Less than $250.

Less than $250.

 

[Vanilla]

Does your money go somewhere else as part of the $5 tickets? Because everyone else's goes to $fw.

I get the point you’re making, and I’ve publicly acknowledged that even my low level of applications is a form of hypocrisy, but if you’re going to argue this point this strongly, be accurate. You simply have been objectively wrong in just about every single post you’ve made on this thread, and definitely on the ones you’ve tried to target at me.

Yes, a portion of my $5 application does go to somewhere other than SFW. Multiple other places, actually.

 

[slamdunk]

What is a good buck to doe ratio for a healthy herd Slam?

I believe the objective is 12-15 per hundred on any given unit to be considered "healthy".

Someone may clarify....

 

[hossblur]

I get the point you’re making, and I’ve publicly acknowledged that even my low level of applications is a form of hypocrisy, but if you’re going to argue this point this strongly, be accurate. You simply have been objectively wrong in just about every single post you’ve made on this thread, and definitely on the ones you’ve tried to target at me.

Yes, a portion of my $5 application does go to somewhere other than SFW. Multiple other places, actually.

"Be accurate". You handed money to $fw to put on the expo, as they see fit.

I didn't "target" you, I called bullshit.

I knew a model 70 came sighted so your opener was bullshit.

I knew you had hunted a couple units, so I called bullshit on your pressure comment

I truly was floored it took 6 pages for you to reveal who Oz was behind the curtain. I kept pushing hoping you had some new info, you didn't.

You do support sfw, there's no grey area, you do, or you don't.

My total is $0.

Yes, I used 20x as a smear, I don't know what scope you have.

 

[elkassassin]

I'll Clarify!

12-15 Is Low!

But What's Even Worse Is The Genetics/Age Quality Of Them 12-15 Left To Do The Breeding!

Yes!

For The UMPTEENTH F'N Time I Know Not All Of Them Doing The Breeding Need To Be Big But It Sure Would Be Nice If More Of Them Were Packing Better Genetics!

I believe the objective is 12-15 per hundred on any given unit to be considered "healthy".

Someone may clarify....

 

[elkassassin]

"Be accurate". You handed money to $fw to put on the expo, as they see fit.

I didn't "target" you, I called bullshit.

I knew a model 70 came sighted so your opener was bullshit.

I knew you had hunted a couple units, so I called bullshit on your pressure comment

I truly was floored it took 6 pages for you to reveal who Oz was behind the curtain. I kept pushing hoping you had some new info, you didn't.

You do support sfw, there's no grey area, you do, or you don't.

My total is $0.

Yes, I used 20x as a smear, I don't know what scope you have.

What I Laugh At Is Some Of The Boneified Rifle Hunters Would Accept A Rule Change Of Dropping The LONG RANGERS Rifles Scopes Clear Down To A 9X Scope!

GAWD I Hope They Can Still Hunt/Shoot With Only A 9X!

 

[hossblur]

Now here's a reality, one you don't face, not personal, just reality.

What I Laugh At Is Some Of The Boneified Rifle Hunters Would Except A Rule Change Of Dropping The LONG RANGERS Rifles Scopes Clear Down To A 9X Scope!

GAWD I Hope They Can Still Hunt/Shoot With Only A 9X!

Notice who is being consistent.

I supported sights on muzzy. I support them on rifles.

Kinda funny seeing all the voices suddenly arise now that it's their thing.

A Cabela's bottom shelf 3x9 is $150-200?

A gunsmith is $100 do drill and tap? $50 for sights?

So of course the financial hardship of sight s is too harsh. A 9x, they can deal with

 

[elkassassin]

Now here's a reality, one you don't face, not personal, just reality.


Notice who is being consistent.

I supported sights on muzzy. I support them on rifles.

Kinda funny seeing all the voices suddenly arise now that it's their thing.

A Cabela's bottom shelf 3x9 is $150-200?

A gunsmith is $100 do drill and tap? $50 for sights?

So of course the financial hardship of sight s is too harsh. A 9x, they can deal with

They Could Also Deal With Having Any GAWD-DAMNED SCOPE The Wanted On Their Rifles/Long Rangers With The Sky Being The Limit On Price!

 

[elkassassin]

I'm Perty Sure Nilly Is Joining The StickFlipper Crowd For The OPPORTUNITY!

Gonna Be Funny Seeing Him Packing A Fred Bear!

 

[elkassassin]

Here You Go Nilly & Others!

Here's A Starter Bow!

Pristine Vintage 1965 Bear Archery Tamerlane Recurve Hand-Signed by Fred Bear | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Pristine Vintage 1965 Bear Archery Tamerlane Recurve Hand-Signed by Fred Bear at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

 

[hossblur]

I'm Perty Sure Nilly Is Joining The StickFlipper Crowd For The OPPORTUNITY!

Gonna Be Funny Seeing Him Packing A Fred Bear!

He should.

He can come suck at it like me.

 

[Betterluckythangood]

What I Laugh At Is Some Of The Boneified Rifle Hunters Would Accept A Rule Change Of Dropping The LONG RANGERS Rifles Scopes Clear Down To A 9X Scope!

GAWD I Hope They Can Still Hunt/Shoot With Only A 9X!

This clearly illustrates how deep the hideous tentacles of certain industries colluding together reach into the halls of power and influence. I don’t blame the scope manufacturers or the rangefinder manufacturers individually, it’s only the combination of both. I also fully support capitalism, and don’t want to put anyone out if business or cost them a job, but a line has been crossed

 

[elkassassin]

That Wind Keeps Up It's Gonna Be CHILLY For This Afternoons Hunt!

 

[quest]

With 22% success rate making hunter’s go down to a 3x9 doesn’t make any sense it’s bad enough we don’t want to make it worse.

 

[Big_Rip]

I think they should have mandatory reporting and if you kill a deer you have a one year wait to apply. If you didn’t kill a deer you automatically get a tag for the next year. Maybe some people would rather hunt next year than shoot a two point.

 

[Vanilla]

Hoss, you asked for “a name,” but don’t mistake me giving you exactly what you asked for and nothing more as the only contributing factor here. I’ve laid out a lot for you here, you’re going to have to finally turn on your brain to get the rest.

And I did some math. I’ve given SFW $81.25 in my lifetime. I’ll send you the equivalent in tissues to dry your tears over that.

You can split them with Keystone if he needs some as well. I’ll support the two of you to the same level. That seems fair, and I’m a fair guy!

And we can go to 9x. I’ve got at least 3 of em. But then we need to ask ourselves “Why?” Who wants this and why will it benefit them? Then I have to ask if I care if those people are benefitted to the detriment of everyone else. I think you know the answer.

Again, turn on your brain Hossy! It ain’t hard to figure it out.

 

[elkassassin]

Hey Nilly?

You See The Starter Bow I Posted?

Hoss, you asked for “a name,” but don’t mistake me giving you exactly what you asked for and nothing more as the only contributing factor here. I’ve laid out a lot for you here, you’re going to have to finally turn on your brain to get the rest.

And I did some math. I’ve given SFW $81.25 in my lifetime. I’ll send you the equivalent in tissues to dry your tears over that.

You can split them with Keystone if he needs some as well. I’ll support the two of you to the same level. That seems fair, and I’m a fair guy!

And we can go to 9x. I’ve got at least 3 of em. But then we need to ask ourselves “Why?” Who wants this and why will it benefit them? Then I have to ask if I care if those people are benefitted to the detriment of everyone else. I think you know the answer.

Again, turn on your brain Hossy! It ain’t hard to figure it out.

 

[hossblur]

Hoss, you asked for “a name,” but don’t mistake me giving you exactly what you asked for and nothing more as the only contributing factor here. I’ve laid out a lot for you here, you’re going to have to finally turn on your brain to get the rest.

And I did some math. I’ve given SFW $81.25 in my lifetime. I’ll send you the equivalent in tissues to dry your tears over that.

You can split them with Keystone if he needs some as well. I’ll support the two of you to the same level. That seems fair, and I’m a fair guy!

And we can go to 9x. I’ve got at least 3 of em. But then we need to ask ourselves “Why?” Who wants this and why will it benefit them? Then I have to ask if I care if those people are benefitted to the detriment of everyone else. I think you know the answer.

Again, turn on your brain Hossy! It ain’t hard to figure it out.

"Sweetheart, I've spent $82 at the whorehouse. To show I don't support hookers, I'll give you $82 to look away"

Here's an idea

You spend the next, however many years you've donated, not donating?

Don't talk, do.

For 2 damn years we heard EXACTLY the same stupid lines, that you now embrace. 2 years. Not a single thing you are spewing, didn't get thrown at the wall during that one.

And what did we learn?

Muzzy tags sold out. All the "end of hunting" , "personal agenda" bullshit, and they sold out. Proving, DUDES JUST WANT TO HUNT.

 

[twopointdn]

What's become abundantly clear is Tristate version of "oppurtunity" is shared by quite a few people.

Somehow, dudes believe oppurtunity, means license=buck. Bess obviously does. I'm starting to believe Vanilla does as well.

Oppurtunity simply means you get a tag. And frankly, ANY tag is better than sitting home. Whether you kill I'd up to you.

I picked up a bow at 40 because it was easy to see, archery is where the oppurtunity is headed.

I love the old stories, I tell them too. But I don't live in old Utah. My stories about hunting foothills, got replaced with three car garages and swimming pools.

My stories of watching big bucks migrate off the west side of Sanpete to the desert got replaced with i-15 and continued bumper to bumper.

My story about the one weekend we hunted in St George got replaced by one of the fastest growing cities in the US.


But what also was a story, my open sight side hammer muzzy shooting #11 and pistol powder with 390 gr slugs, got replaced with a CVA Accura complete with scope, 777, and powerbelt.

My story of the 99c Savage .308 with open sights, is now a scoped 06'.

We can continue to pretend it's Utah 1960 or we can accept it's 2024.

Our deer herds won't get bigger. We can fight to maintain them, but they won't get bigger. Our towns will. Our roads will, our rzr will.

So. We can either throw up our hands, load up a Lapua with a 30x gps guided and get to ending hunting.

Or. We can hunt.

As apparently one of the few true oppurtunists in here, I'm obviously in the minority. I'll take the tag. Because any tag, is better than golf.

You’re not alone. I will take any weapon and easy draw tags over no tag any day in my home state. In the two general units I have hunted recently I believe there are areas that don’t get hunted. My buddy is a good hunter and he took his son into a good area and seen nothing during his son’s hunt. Five days after the deer hunt ended I was in the same area hunting elk and what did I see “bucks”. They are there and that is why I don’t bye the “all the two points get shot under no restrictions” or under APR’s “all the four points get shot at two years old” stuff. There are simply areas people don’t hunt that will save the bucks. They make changes every year, life goes on. Utah provided a lot of opportunities to hunt, especially for youth. With the current regulations my kids will not go a year without a deer tag in their pockets. I can’t say that for myself but they will have a tag which gives them opportunities. With the muzzleloader scope changes they made last year you would have thought it was the end of the world but there was still a muzzleloader hunt this year. It will be interesting to see how all this works out but regardless life goes on.

 

[elkassassin]

Now Start The Restrictions On The Other Weapon Types!

Oh And Listen To The WHINING & BAWLING That Goes With It!

You’re not alone. I will take any weapon and easy draw tags over no tag any day in my home state. In the two general units I have hunted recently I believe there are areas that don’t get hunted. My buddy is a good hunter and he took his son into a good area and seen nothing during his son’s hunt. Five days after the deer hunt ended I was in the same area hunting elk and what did I see “bucks”. They are there and that is why I don’t bye the “all the two points get shot under no restrictions” or under APR’s “all the four points get shot at two years old” stuff. There are simply areas people don’t hunt that will save the bucks. They make changes every year, life goes on. Utah provided a lot of opportunities to hunt, especially for youth. With the current regulations my kids will not go a year without a deer tag in their pockets. I can’t say that for myself but they will have a tag which gives them opportunities. With the muzzleloader scope changes they made last year you would have thought it was the end of the world but there was still a muzzleloader hunt this year. It will be interesting to see how all this works out but regardless life goes on.

 

[elkassassin]

What's become abundantly clear is Tristate version of "oppurtunity" is shared by quite a few people.

Somehow, dudes believe oppurtunity, means license=buck. Bess obviously does. I'm starting to believe Vanilla does as well.

License = Buck Huh?

Well?

It helps To Have A License If You're Gonna Take A Buck!

License Doesn't Always Mean A Buck In This Family!

I'm Trying My Best To Get Them 6 Months Worth Of Hunting Deer In Like You Claimed Before JAN 31st!

Looks Like I'll Be A Little Short Again As Like Always!

BUT DAMN THE F'N OPPORTUNITY!

Oppurtunity simply means you get a tag. And frankly, ANY tag is better than sitting home. Whether you kill I'd up to you.

I picked up a bow at 40 because it was easy to see, archery is where the oppurtunity is headed.

I love the old stories, I tell them too. But I don't live in old Utah. My stories about hunting foothills, got replaced with three car garages and swimming pools.

My stories of watching big bucks migrate off the west side of Sanpete to the desert got replaced with i-15 and continued bumper to bumper.

My story about the one weekend we hunted in St George got replaced by one of the fastest growing cities in the US.


But what also was a story, my open sight side hammer muzzy shooting #11 and pistol powder with 390 gr slugs, got replaced with a CVA Accura complete with scope, 777, and powerbelt.

My story of the 99c Savage .308 with open sights, is now a scoped 06'.

We can continue to pretend it's Utah 1960 or we can accept it's 2024.

Our deer herds won't get bigger. We can fight to maintain them, but they won't get bigger. Our towns will. Our roads will, our rzr will.

So. We can either throw up our hands, load up a Lapua with a 30x gps guided and get to ending hunting.

Or. We can hunt.

As apparently one of the few true oppurtunists in here, I'm obviously in the minority. I'll take the tag. Because any tag, is better than golf.

 

[ktg]

I've gone almost entirely to archery. Restrict archery any more and I'll just go back to rifle. 9x scope doesn't restrict me on a rifle, but if you take compound bows out, well, archery tags will be undersubscribed, which I'm sure the recurve guys will love. How do we restrict them?

 

[elkassassin]

My Kids first Bows Were Made Out Of Some 1-1/4 200 PSI Poly Pipe With Some Heavy String!

Would That Work?

I've gone almost entirely to archery. Restrict archery any more and I'll just go back to rifle. 9x scope doesn't restrict me on a rifle, but if you take compound bows out, well, archery tags will be undersubscribed, which I'm sure the recurve guys will love. How do we restrict them?

 

[Vanilla]

"Sweetheart, I've spent $82 at the whorehouse. To show I don't support hookers, I'll give you $82 to look away"

Now I’m understanding the hurt better. You feel cheated on. I’m sorry. PM me the address where I can send those tissues!

APRs are dumb. They don’t “work,” and we already know they don’t work.

Weapon restrictions in the name of opportunity when the WB is just going to keep cutting the tags are also dumb.

Grow more deer. Everyone gets what they want. Except the uber selfish minority groups that are pushing these things and convincing some it’s just the evil SFW that is at fault, when those groups will never be satisfied. Ever. They will always take.

But carry on. My position has been and is still clear. These proposals are bad news. I hope they don’t pass.

Get well soon Hossy! I promise I didn’t cheat on ya. But that $81.25 was certainly worth my Pauns tag! (Now go off on that one!)

 

[ktg]

My Kids first Bows Were Made Out Of Some 1-1/4 200 PSI Poly Pipe With Some Heavy String!

Would That Work?

That would work with the requirement of flint tip.

 

[elkassassin]

You WHAT?

Got A F'N PAUNS Tag For 81.25?

JFP!

Ya!

I Already Knew That!

Don't Feel Bad Nilly!

I've Donated Enough To Cover You!

Now I’m understanding the hurt better. You feel cheated on. I’m sorry. PM me the address where I can send those tissues!

APRs are dumb. They don’t “work,” and we already know they don’t work.

Weapon restrictions in the name of opportunity when the WB is just going to keep cutting the tags are also dumb.

Grow more deer. Everyone gets what they want. Except the uber selfish minority groups that are pushing these things and convincing some it’s just the evil SFW that is at fault, when those groups will never be satisfied. Ever. They will always take.

But carry on. My position has been and is still clear. These proposals are bad news. I hope they don’t pass.

Get well soon Hossy! I promise I didn’t cheat on ya. But that $81.25 was certainly worth my Pauns tag! (Now go off on that one!)

 

[Vanilla]

You WHAT?

Got A F'N PAUNS Tag For 81.25?

JFP!

Ya!

I Already Knew That!

Don't Feel Bad Nilly!

I've Donated Enough To Cover You!

Actually, that was the first time I ever entered the expo lottery. I was walking in to man a booth that the Utah Stream Access Coalition had there, and had a $20 in my wallet, so I applied for 4 hunts. So technically, it cost me $20.

Then I spent the entire day signing people up for the organization and telling them how SFW was trying to screw them in stream access!

But boy do I support SFW! I’m cheating on Hossy with hookers, apparently. That’s almost as good as getting internet bullied. Not quite, but almost.

 

[slamdunk]

No, we've never tried an APR on a restricted quota unit.
Correct me if I'm wrong.

They failed before because it was used on "come one, come all" basis.

This APR proposal is a totally new beast.

Whatever the success rates were on say Bookcliffs with unlimited tags, apply it now with limited tags.....THEN we'll compare notes.

 

[elkassassin]

So?

Not to Change The Subject!

But What's The Rules On Streams & Rivers In DRATville?

As Long As I'm Standing In The River Can I Cross Through Private Property Or Not?

Actually, that was the first time I ever entered the expo lottery. I was walking in to man a booth that the Utah Stream Access Coalition had there, and had a $20 in my wallet, so I applied for 4 hunts. So technically, it cost me $20.

Then I spent the entire day signing people up for the organization and telling them how SFW was trying to screw them in stream access!

But boy do I support SFW! I’m cheating on Hossy with hookers, apparently. That’s almost as good as getting internet bullied. Not quite, but almost.

 

[elkassassin]

I Don't Have An Issue With APR's!

But.......................!

They Need To Be Enforced!

And The Consequences Should Be So Stiff Not Many Would Chance It!

No, we've never tried an APR on a restricted quota unit.
Correct me if I'm wrong.

They failed before because it was used on "come one, come all" basis.

This APR proposal is a totally new beast.

Whatever the success rates were on say Bookcliffs with unlimited tags, apply it now with limited tags.....THEN we'll compare notes.

 

[Vanilla]

So?

Not to Change The Subject!

But What's The Rules On Streams & Rivers In DRATville?

As Long As I'm Standing In The River Can I Cross Through Private Property Or Not?

Unfortunately, no…that is not the current state of the law.

But, the battle continues.