Recent WY Wolf News - Not good!

[BigFin]

Not really wanting to get into this discussion, but TOPGUN, you need to look closer at WY elk draw this year.

In the high dollar general tag draw, you are correct. The odds were 88.90%.

BUT, if you look at the remaining people who did not draw in the high dollar PP draw who were then thrown into the high dollar random draw, everyone one of them drew.

With that, the draw odds for the high dollar general tag in WY was 100% this year, between the PP draw and the random draw, whether you put it as first, second, or third choice.

Carry on guys.

"Hunt when you can - You're gonna' run out of health before you run out of money!"

 

[TOPGUN]

BigFin---You got me on that one! BuzzH has had me so pissed off today I failed to look at that draw before I went to the cheaper Draw. You and Buzz are correct IF a person wanted to part with over $1000 for a tag, which I'm not. I apologize to Buzz for my error and appreciate it for you stepping in and clarifying things! Thanks much because when I'm wrong I will readily admit it, but I'm not going to carry on any more in regards to what this thread started out discussing, LOL!!!

 

[4100fps]

Better to be pissed off, than pissed on.




I wanted to take a scalp,but the kill was not mine.

 

[TOPGUN]

Hey 4100fps----Good one! Are you talking from experience, LOL!!!

 

[feduptwo]

LAST EDITED ON Feb-25-11 AT 09:58PM (MST)[p] Buzzh,

If your right and I am wrong how do you explain grizzlies. No reasonable group can say this species isn't recovered, and all the states went along with every issue required by the USFWS. Public safety is a major concern, and even then eco terrorists held us hostage using an activist court to block delisting.
The ESA is a tool for extreme environmental groups and the judges and politicians that are in their pocket. It has nothing to do with endangered animals. I wish it was as easy as you preach.

 

[4100fps]

Your right about the Grizzly bear being recovered. The people that live with the Grizzly have far more apathy when dealing with them. I think if we had a half the people screaming de list the Griz, that we do the wolf, you would see more of a push to get him off. The genetic thing is far more of a concern with Grizzlies also. They don't have the genetic connectivity that wolves do. Their getting close to that IMO.




I wanted to take a scalp,but the kill was not mine.

 

[BuzzH]

feduptwo,

You wont be getting any arguement from me that a limited grizzly season is warranted.

I also agree with 4100fps, there is a genetic connectivity problem as well...not much genetic exchange in the Yellowstone population.

I think the grizzly seasons will be held again in MT at least...with WY's track record on the wolf issue, I wouldnt bet on it happening there.

 

[feduptwo]

4100fps, BUZZH

Genetic connectivity is a code word for another enviromentalist excuse.
There are plenty of species that have a lot less area to roam and a lot smaller population base than the grizzlies of the Greater Recovery area. If it is really a concern, trade Canada a few grizzlies every couple of years with the money raised from hunting. Antelope island, and Santa Clara Island mule deer seem to be doing just fine with no genetic connectivity.
Montana will not hold a hunt any sooner than Wyoming will. Judge Malloy put grizzlies back on the ESA. The only hope is a revamp of the ESA where wildlife management is turned over to states, and biologists without extremist agenda's.
BuzzH talks about Wyoming's track record on wolves but we have met and exceeded every recovery goal that has been asked of the state. Once again, it has nothing to do with recovery of a species and all to do the reasons I've listed in previous posts.

 

[4100fps]

I hope you commented on the Grizzly recovery effort. Buzz and I aren't' the final decision makers. IMO, I really don't think that a million acres for Grizzly population is enough. The reason wolves have exceeded all recovery goals is because they are still protected there. That's a no brain er. We have more problems than just Griz. Wolverine, and Fisher are next. I'm not sure either is warranted, although they are doing some studies to determine populations right now. I caught 3 Fisher in Western Montana in the last 2 years, and know of several more. I see Wolverine tracks every year. The lone one caught in my district was trapped, not all that many miles from were I live.


I wanted to take a scalp,but the kill was not mine.

 

[eelgrass]

genetic connectivity. LOL That means one wolf pack whos range will run roughly from Miami Florida to Seattle Washington. Any wolf outside that range will be fair game. LMAO!

Eel

 

[feduptwo]

I did comment on the grizzly plan, multiple times. The last time I checked Judge Malloy doesn't have a comment inbox, at least for sportsmen and people without an agenda. These bears were off the esa, listed as protected. The activist judge put them back on.
I agree a million acres isn't nearly enough. Good thing just in yellowstone there is 2,219,789 acres. The Yellowstone grizzly bear recovery area is 9200m2 or 5,888,000 acres.
I also agree that the reason wolves are over objective by 150% or so is that they are protected. If they were off the list and we were hunting them I believe in 10 yrs we would have them whittled down to about objective where maybe our moose populations could start to recover. The truth when these wolves start getting shot at there going to be very hard to control with sportsmen. Just ask our neighbors to the north.
As far as Martin, and Wolverines; Why can the esa be used to establish a population in areas that we have no evidence we ever had a sustainable population. Wolverines and Martin are thriving in North America, just not in the southern end of the Rocky's that is very marginal habitat for those species. You could also include the Lynx in this conversation.