3 years probation?

Weak! I've long believed that these types of cases should carry mandatory jail terms. And they didn't even publish their names. So they don't even get a public shaming.
 
These little PISSCUTTER Fines & a Slap on the Hands of Poachers are a real GAWD-DAMNED JOKE!

That the Best the DWR & Attorney's can do?

A Real Deterrent to Poachers now Ain't it?

WAFJ!!!






[font color="redhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMsueOnu0kY
 
So they got fined about ten grand, and a three year waiting period? Less than if they bought an elk hunt in the state? Not to mention they are obvious geniuses, that elk is so distinct did they think no one had seen it before? Why are we plea bargining with dudes that admit? You have them DOA, and you plea bargin? Poaching should carry minimum mandatories to stop LAZY and INCOMPETENT prosecutors from wussing out.


"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
If the money and probation is nothing, go do it. What are you waiting for?


Mandatory minimum sentences?????? Didn't get the public shame????? Listen to yourselves. There is a solid line between justice and vengeance. Try not to blur it.

"Vengeance is mine."
 
A lot of truth in this post: Play by the rules and you will spend 1-16 years to draw the tag, $5-8K for a guide, and then have a FIVE YEAR waiting period to apply again. Or poach, pay $8000 fine and wait 3 years????
 
Their names should be available on the public record through the courts. They sure deserve the shaming. Pretty weak penalties, IMO. How about 200 hr each of wildlife-oriented public service?
 
History doesn't repeat but it rhymes with itself. With that thought in mind and remembering the past posts that are similiar this is how the responses will go.

1. Tristate will come on and respond how unit lines are man made and that the poachers received just punishment.
2. Tristate will come up with and attack on someone about how the crime and punishment were just and attack a poster who thinks otherwise.
3. Tristate will tell us we should privatize all wildlife and land and it would eliminate this type of criminal activity.

With that in mind I will give this advice for those that don't see how this thread will go,and take it myself. Never argue with an idiot they will beat you with experience.

The fine and probation seems light to me carry on.
 
Cornhusker, I agree 100%. Well said about Tripster.

I guess poaching isnt all that bad after all. They are smarter than all of us that try to do it legal. Save time and money!!
 
"Vanilla,

Please explain to these people what "probation" is."

No I will not. You can go to a fake dinner with some made up attorneys, get their opinions of it, and share it with everyone here.
 
You guys have to consider other factors. There is a big push by states not to send non violent offenders to prison due to overcrowding in most state prisons. That somewhat ties the hands of the D.A. and the judge. Also some county jails are overcrowded and would you prefer the poacher in jail or the burglar that broke into your home.
Also some judges have a tendency to not consider game violation crimes as serious as you may want him to consider.

As for myself, I wished that the judge would have revoked their hunting rights for 10 years, including hunting in other states as terms of their probation. That with the 6,000 fine would have been more fair punishment for their violation.

RELH
 
Vanilla,

What are you scared of? Are you scared some of these people will actually learn something about the law?

I think its funny you reference "made up attorneys" when they are what took you to school last time we had a legal discussion. I would rather admit to being strummed by real ones than "made up".

How about this Vanilla, would you like to be sentenced to probation? What would that do for your career? Come on. Educate these guys about probation and how its a slap on the wrist.
 
What am I afraid of? I'm afraid that if I argue with an idiot, I will be mistaken for an idiot. I don't want that.

I leave the legal education to the professionals, like you.
 
Are you calling all these other posters "idiots", Vanilla? Because I am not asking you to argue with me. I asked you to inform these people of what the rules and consequences of probation are and can be.

Be a helper and SERVE some citizens who might be misinformed please.
 
>You guys have to consider other
>factors. There is a big
>push by states not to
>send non violent offenders to
>prison due to overcrowding in
>most state prisons. That somewhat
>ties the hands of the
>D.A. and the judge. Also
>some county jails are overcrowded
>and would you prefer the
>poacher in jail or the
>burglar that broke into your
>home.
> Also some judges
>have a tendency to not
>consider game violation crimes as
>serious as you may want
>him to consider.
>
> As for myself,
>I wished that the judge
>would have revoked their hunting
>rights for 10 years, including
>hunting in other states as
>terms of their probation. That
>with the 6,000 fine would
>have been more fair punishment
>for their violation.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>RELH

I would rather the poacher be in jail than the dude who smoked a blunt. Funny how we worry about guys stealing cars, but kill an elk, worth as much as a car and we can't send you to jail?

As for not keeping the horns, the state will have a big horn auction(they will set the market price for horns, then have the balls to even discuss poaching) and these dudes can buy them back.

Hi Tristate, hope you had a great x-mas. Did you explain to all the kids that Santas deer should be sold to the highest bidder. Or that Santa is a freaking communist for wanting to give joy to ALL girls and boys, not just the ones who daddies are wealthy?

The punishment for poaching should be the same as grand theft auto, only there should also be a weapons enhancement, same as any other crime committed with a weapon.


"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
>Hi Tristate, hope you had a
>great x-mas.

Thank you. What's "x-mas"?


Did you
>explain to all the kids
>that Santas deer should be
>sold to the highest bidder.

No I haven't but they actually are already bought and sold. Reindeer are chattel in other nations. Herded and sold as chattel.

> Or that Santa is
>a freaking communist for wanting
>to give joy to ALL
>girls and boys, not just
>the ones who daddies
>are wealthy?

Actually Santa does not want to give gifts to all boys and girls, just the good ones. Did someone make the naughty list this year?
>
>The punishment for poaching should be
>the same as grand theft
>auto, only there should also
>be a weapons enhancement, same
>as any other crime committed
>with a weapon.

Excellent. Most people convicted of grand theft auto don't get to go to prison either.
 
Hossblur, can you name me a state where they will arrest and send to jail a dude for smoking a joint of Marijuana. Most states it is only a citation, just like a traffic ticket, and a fine. Some states it is not a crime.

RELH
 
>Are you calling all these other
>posters "idiots", Vanilla? Because
>I am not asking you
>to argue with me.
>I asked you to inform
>these people of what the
>rules and consequences of probation
>are and can be.
>
>Be a helper and SERVE some
>citizens who might be misinformed
>please.


Damn, I thought maybe you made a New Years resolution to quit being a jackass. but it looks like a continuation of all your other trolling BS here! Carry on!!!
 
Now Topgun, I want you to go back and read slowly. All I did was the most logical thing I could to help educate some of these people here that have misconceptions about "probation". Out of the above posters Vanilla, according to himself, is the most qualified member on the thread to do so. I asked him to do so and instead he just started talking trash.

Now that you are here you are probably the second most qualified to educate these people about probation. So instead of calling me names why don't you help out and tell these people.

If you were not retired, Topgun, what would three years of probation do to your career? How about now? How could three years of probation change your life now? What kind of risk does it open you up to?

I know its easier to get on here and call someone a jackass than it is to actually educate some people but I would like to see if you can make the effort.
 
Regarding RELH's post on who whould throw a person in jail for smoking a joint? Down in SoUtah they will. Had to bail out a son for that one. The ensuing money making probation guidelines with monthly piss testing and "group" therapy classes were a costly lesson. Yes, for a joint.
 
arrow4me, how long ago was that. In Ca. we used to arrest them many years ago, not today. Citation at worse, no crime at all if they have their medical card. Heck if they have their medical card, they can grow it.
Hope you son wised up and quit using that crap.

RELH
 
Manufacturing or selling any amount of marijuana in Nebraska is illegal, and may be punished with a fine of up to $25,000, at least one year (and up to 20 years) in prison, or both. Selling to a minor; within 1,000 feet of a school; withinin100 feet of a youth center, public pool, or video arcade; or possessing a firearm during the offense increases the applicable penalties. These include a fine of up to $50,000, a minimum prison sentence of 3 years (and up to 20), or both. (Ne. Stat. Ann. ? 28-416.)

I do understand what you are saying RELH and think you are correct however right or wrong we put people in jail for selling a joint not necessarily smoking one. Notice the circumstances that make it a minimum 3 year sentence and the amount of fines. Personally I'd rather see poachers in jail.

I also understand that probation does limit the ability of a person to hold certain jobs or without a huge amount of paper work and a hearing get into today's military. I understand this is what Tristate is reaching toward but many poachers that have been arrested and names posted in my area it really doesn't make a difference to the UP still employs while on probation.
 
Seems pre-meditated to me. They had an any bull tag. Drove to a LE unit with the mindset of killing an elk.


Traditional >>>------->
 
I agree that the sentence seems a little light given the nature of the offense. Unfortunately, what we don't know from the article is whether the charges these "gentlemen" pled to were felonies or misdemeanors. If they pled guilty to felonies then the consequences are much more severe, including the inability to own or possess firearms. I believe that if more poachers were charged and convicted of felonies this would send a message and be a substantial deterrent to future poaching. But what do I know . . . right Tristate?

Hawkeye

Browning A-Bolt 300 Win Mag
Bowtech Destroyer
Winchester Apex .50 Cal
 
LAST EDITED ON Jan-07-15 AT 12:15PM (MST)[p]I think more of this type of violation goes on than we know or hear about.

If this was their first offense, maybe i too would also call for a short stint in the caboose but i've seen where guys got off with a lot less so...

I do hope that they lost hunting privileges, that in itself would seem to be a huge deterrent and pill to swallow.

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
>I agree that the sentence seems
>a little light given the
>nature of the offense.
>Unfortunately, what we don't know
>from the article is whether
>the charges these "gentlemen" pled
>to were felonies or misdemeanors.
> If they pled guilty
>to felonies then the consequences
>are much more severe, including
>the inability to own or
>possess firearms. I believe
>that if more poachers were
>charged and convicted of felonies
>this would send a message
>and be a substantial deterrent
>to future poaching. But
>what do I know .
>. . right Tristate?
>
>Hawkeye


We also have no idea what the terms of the 3 year probationary period are. It could be as simple as the Judge specifying a non-reporting type where all they have to do is stay out of trouble for that time period. If they didn't lose hunting privileges for at least the probationary period, which would also be in effect in all the 40 Wildlife Violator Compact states, they got off very light IMHO.
 
Ya gotta remember!

Where RELH is from they Smoke that Sshitt like Cigarettes!








[font color="redhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMsueOnu0kY
 
Bess, I loved the days when it was a felony to have one joint. During that time I can not remember arresting one person for possession of 1-2 joints. Boy did I get them to dime out what the real bad a$$es were doing. The evidence went to the wind, the suspect went home and I was able to make more felony arrests on Adam Henrys that deserved to be behind bars for property or violence crimes. Those were the good old days to be a cop.

RELH
 
>arrow4me, how long ago was that.
>In Ca. we used to
>arrest them many years ago,
>not today. Citation at worse,
>no crime at all if
>they have their medical card.
>Heck if they have their
>medical card, they can grow
>it.
> Hope you son wised
>up and quit using that
>crap.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> RELH

Nothing personal, but most of us would gladly trade California for a 6 pack of Keystone. Without our dear friends from that state 1/2 the BS we all deal with wouldn't exist so what happens there isn't reflective of what happens in the normal western states.
However that was satyrical, it wasn't literal. I will admit that I don't know the exact number of ounces in The Peoples Republic of California it takes to end up in the pokey, but I do know how many elk you should be able to illegally kill to get there, that number is ONE! Especially if you transport it to another unit to try to cover your tracks, that wasn't some accident, its premeditated.
"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
Somebody please tell Hossblur what "premeditated" means. Hawkeye, come on your a straight shooter and I know you aren't scared like Vanilla. Please help educate Hossblur here.
 
>LAST EDITED ON Jan-05-15
>AT 09:24?PM (MST)
>
>Wow...if that is all they will
>do to me if I
>shoot a bull in the
>wrong unit, maybe it is
>worth it!
>
>http://www.ksl.com/?sid=32996404&ni...in-connection-with-elk-poaching&s_cid=queue-9


I havery always been fascinated with the inner workings of the mob mentality. How a group of generally rational folks can put on the Salem Witch Trials, call for the cruxifiction of the king of kings, hide their identity behind robes and kill a man for the color of his skin. Then I read a post like this and it all makes perfect sense.

4abc76ff29b26fc1.jpg
 
>Somebody please tell Hossblur what "premeditated"
>means. Hawkeye, come on
>your a straight shooter and
>I know you aren't scared
>like Vanilla. Please help
>educate Hossblur here.

Pretty sure it would mean, "hey brother you know that bull we have been watching on the nebo, WE deserve to kill him way more than someone who actually has a tag. So lets go kill him, chop off his head, then transport it out of the unit, onto another unit and tell everyone that it was shot there"

Premeditated: verb, to think out or plan(an action or crime) beforehand. synonyms: planned, intentional, deliberate, preplanned, calculated, etc, etc, etc.

As usual Tri, thanks for your input.


"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
>Somebody please tell Hossblur what "premeditated"
>means. Hawkeye, come on
>your a straight shooter and
>I know you aren't scared
>like Vanilla. Please help
>educate Hossblur here.


What else would you call intentionally shooting it in one unit and taking it to another to cover the violation up genius? To answer your other question posed at me, I would have no idea what would have happened because I have never committed anything illegal to find out then or now, LOL! Obviously if something was done to result in a 3 year probationary term it would have depended on the seriousness of the violation as to the extent of whether I would have even been allowed to continue working. In the OP article link it doesn't even say what the terms of the probation were just like I mentioned earlier. Probation can be an unpaid, non reporting type to the probation office all the way up to a much tighter, severe type where the guy better not even spit on the sidewalk for fear of violating the terms stipulated.
 
>>LAST EDITED ON Jan-05-15
>>AT 09:24?PM (MST)
>>
>>Wow...if that is all they will
>>do to me if I
>>shoot a bull in the
>>wrong unit, maybe it is
>>worth it!
>>
>>http://www.ksl.com/?sid=32996404&ni...in-connection-with-elk-poaching&s_cid=queue-9
>
>
>I havery always been fascinated with
>the inner workings of the
>mob mentality. How a
>group of generally rational folks
>can put on the Salem
>Witch Trials, call for the
>cruxifiction of the king of
>kings, hide their identity behind
>robes and kill a man
>for the color of his
>skin. Then I read
>a post like this and
>it all makes perfect sense.


That post made about as much sense as Tristate asking Hawkeye to clue in Hossblur as to what premeditated means! If I'm reading your post correctly it would appear you're saying you think the two scofflaws paid a big enough penalty. Yes or no?
 
Can any of you show me where there is ANY shred of evidence provided in the article that these two men PLANNED this crime or even knew the bull to exist before the bull was killed???????

Getting rid of evidence or tampering with evidence, or lying to people in no way constitutes premeditation.

I am not saying there was no premeditation here. I am just saying not one of you has any evidence that premeditation occurred. You don't know for what reason these men were in that unit in the first place. You don't know what weapon was used. You don't know ANYTHING that is evidence of premeditation. All you know is these two guys shot an elk and tried to cover it up, both by tampering with evidence and falsifying a document. THATS IT.
 
"I havery always been fascinated with the inner workings of the mob mentality. How a group of generally rational folks can put on the Salem Witch Trials, call for the cruxifiction of the king of kings, hide their identity behind robes and kill a man for the color of his skin. Then I read a post like this and it all makes perfect sense."


1911,

This has pretty much been my point on this thread. You have a bunch of people claiming probation is worth committing crimes and they don't even know what it is. Now they are claiming premeditation and they don't know what it is. What amazes me is at least three of them have legal backgrounds! Their priorities are completely fouled and at least two of them know better but won't correct the others because the crazed mob will fulfill their own selfish agendas.
 
YESS I know, its arguing with an idiot, but I am home with sick kids so next to cleaning up puke, this is what I am doing.

When you illegally kill the elk, that is ONE crime, THEN you cut the head off, leave the body THATS NUMBER TWO. You then decide to transport the head to another unit, YOU KNOW YOU DECIDE AND PLAN BEFORE DOING THE CRIME WHEN TO MOVE IT, HOW, AND WHERE(the very definition of premeditated) to do it is NUMBER 3.

See TRI as usual you have a sliver of an idea or thought, then you try to expand.

You might could argue they were just out cruising around the NEBO, saw this elk and just shot it, without preplanning to do so. So yes the actual illegal kill POSSIBLY could be spur of the moment(I don't believe that to be true, but proof and feeling are different).

Now, why cut the head off? Because you PLANNED TO DO SO. Why not simply run away? Call DWR and claim a mistake? BECAUSE YOU PRE PLANNED, (you know premeditated) what you were doing, how to do it, the animal you were chasing, and how you THOUGHT you could pass it off as coming from another unit.

But lets get real. These boys had watched this bull, planned when to kill it, how to hide the body, what road to take to transport it, where they would CLAIM they shot it, and the lies that would accompany that.

See TRI, they didn't simply illegally kill a bull, had they you might have a point, they killed it, wanton wasted the body, illegally transported it, lied to UDWR, created fraud by tagging it with the wrong tag.

Thanks again for your help TRI.




"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
"When you illegally kill the elk, that is ONE crime, THEN you cut the head off, leave the body THATS NUMBER TWO. You then decide to transport the head to another unit, YOU KNOW YOU DECIDE AND PLAN BEFORE DOING THE CRIME WHEN TO MOVE IT, HOW, AND WHERE(the very definition of premeditated) to do it is NUMBER 3."

Hossblur,

I want you to slow down and read the stupidity of your own words. You actually state in YOUR WORDS that the men "then decided" That means decided after the initial crime was committed AND THEN YOU STATE THAT IS PREMEDITATION! You actually state you know when they thought about it and it was AFTER the crime was committed and in the very same sentence say that is premeditation. Like I said before YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT THE WORD MEANS.
 
Hossblur,
Go feed your sick kids alphabet soup, when they puke it up, try to read it, it will make more sense than anything Tristate is trying to say.

Rut
 
There is a big freaking highway (I-15) that divides the 2 units...how is that not premeditated? Every time a hunter pulls the trigger it should be premeditated...except maybe Tristate.
 
Does anyone besides me find this arguing repetitive, petty, tedious, juvenile, inane, counterproductive, irrelevant, and a distraction from the thread topic?
 
>"When you illegally kill the elk,
>that is ONE crime, THEN
>you cut the head off,
>leave the body THATS NUMBER
>TWO. You then decide to
>transport the head to another
>unit, YOU KNOW YOU DECIDE
>AND PLAN BEFORE DOING THE
>CRIME WHEN TO MOVE IT,
>HOW, AND WHERE(the very definition
>of premeditated) to do it
>is NUMBER 3."
>
>Hossblur,
>
>I want you to slow down
>and read the stupidity of
>your own words. You
>actually state in YOUR WORDS
>that the men "then decided"
> That means decided after
>the initial crime was committed
> AND THEN YOU STATE
>THAT IS PREMEDITATION! You
>actually state you know when
>they thought about it and
>it was AFTER the crime
>was committed and in the
>very same sentence say that
>is premeditation. Like I
>said before YOU DON'T EVEN
>KNOW WHAT THE WORD MEANS.
>

Last time, I have a a cocktail now. TRI, unless you shoot a circular saw, killing the bull and beheading it are 2 seperate actions. YOU DO NOT HAVE TO CUT THE HEAD OFF BECAUSE ITS BEEN KILLED. At the moment that elk hit the ground they had 3 choices.
1. Drive off and leave it
2. Call DWR, claim a mistake
3. Cut of head, cross a interstate highway(the one that connects California and Canada, not a dirt road).

They decided, PREMEDITATED (before commiting the act, see: preplanned)that cutting off the head and transporting it was the choice they would make. They THEN cut off the head and transported it.

The only way your claim would make since is IF they shot said bull, his freaking head flew off, across the freeway. While in flight these boys crossed the freeway, to another unit, stopped, and that head just happened to land in there truck.

This post makes me realize a few things.

1. In breaking down the actions these boys took, they REALLY are criminals. It takes a lot of criminal activity to do what they did. I am even more irritated with the prosecutor.

2. By crossing the interstate freeway system, assuming they did, shouldn't what they did be a federal crime?(Not sure of the law on this one)

3. It is no wonder poaching continues to be a slap on the wrist. Even in a real clear, cut and dry case like this, poachers still have defenders, not just clowns in Texas, but actual thinking people still don't see it for what it most obviously is.

4. I don't worry about my childrens future. My 4 year olds are so much smarter than a succesful taxidermist from Texas, if he can make it, anyone can!!


"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
Do any of yall know what a prefix is? Do any of you know what the prefix "pre" means? Do you? PREmeditated Go learn what it is. Talking about people covering up what they did AFTER a crime doesn't make "premeditation".

Now you want to make it a federal crime because he crossed an interstate??????????


You know some people really shouldn't be allowed to vote and child licensing is looking more appealing all the time.
 
>Do any of yall know what
>a prefix is? Do
>any of you know what
>the prefix "pre" means?
>Do you? PREmeditated
>Go learn what it is.
> Talking about people covering
>up what they did AFTER
>a crime doesn't make "premeditation".
>
>
>Now you want to make it
>a federal crime because he
>crossed an interstate??????????
>
>
>You know some people really shouldn't
>be allowed to vote and
>child licensing is looking more
>appealing all the time.

So your contention is that they shot this elk, then thought "hell lets go haul it over to another unit and try to pass it off", that takes planning. Why go to all that effort?
Why not just take it home? Because they knew someone would see it.
I would bet that if all wildlife was privately owned, such as you favor, the private owner wouldn't allow such a weak plea bargin. Good hearing from you TRI, glad you and twinkies will never go away.
"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
Hoss, I know you have time on your hands, but you can never win an argument with someone who is never wrong, looks down on you, and doesn't respect opinions different than their own.

txhunter58

venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore I am)
 
>Hoss, I know you have time
>on your hands, but you
>can never win an argument
>with someone who is never
>wrong, looks down on you,
>and doesn't respect opinions different
>than their own.
>
>txhunter58
>
>venor, ergo sum (I hunt, therefore
>I am)

Heck, 90% of the time you don't even have to say anything and said people will just attribute statements to you or tell you what you believe.
 
>Heck, 90% of the time you
>don't even have to say
>anything and said people will
>just attribute statements to you
>or tell you what you
>believe.


Pot, meet kettle.
 
>
>>Heck, 90% of the time you
>>don't even have to say
>>anything and said people will
>>just attribute statements to you
>>or tell you what you
>>believe.
>
>
>Pot, meet kettle.


Geez, how'd you know he was talking about you,LOL!
 

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