Here comes Utah again for publc lands

Keystone

Keystone

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Heard a commercial on radio this morning g for Utah taking federal lands.

Now I know why.

Keep in mind, Schultz and Adam's are developers, and Cox has big ideas for housing.

One only need ask, how does Utah pay for management of 18 million acres if they don't sell it?

www.fox13now.com

Utah sues federal government for control of 18.5 million acres of land

The state of Utah is filing a lawsuit against the federal government, seeking control of more than 18 million acres of land.
www.fox13now.com www.fox13now.com
 
They know nobody will read the Utah Transfer of Public Lands Act.

It literally codifies the selling of public land.

There's not a single word saying they won't sell public land in the Act. Not one.
 
State Government Fighting Federal Government!

There Oughta Be A Bunch Of Wasted Money On That Deal!

And If The State Gets It They'll Start Selling It!
 
Current BLM cost per acre managed is $6.53/ac. $6.53 x 18.5M ac = $120,805,000 cost of current management. Over the last decade the Federal O&G lease revenue from UT was roughly $190,000,000/yr.

Assume some of this revenue was from FS land and not BLM but safe to say the vast majority is BLM. Math on covering BLM land management costs is a pretty easy win. FS land not so much. But that is not what this lawsuit is about.
 
Why is it always Utah pushing this issue, better get the checkbooks out, I have a feeling it will go to “friends and family” first if this passes… it’s just nuts though, leave the public land alone
 
If this happens Utah will become like Texas when it comes to hunting. All private land and the only way to hunt is to pay a lease. This state has turned into a chithole. As soon as my youngest kid graduates High School I'm outta here like a cat shot in the AZZ!
 
Well, I told yall they still wanted them. My only reply is this. Fight for them, contact your legislators, contact the spineless Governor that is Spencer Cox. Contact the speaker of the House Mike Schultz. Contact Stuart Adams the Senate President. I would say it’s more worth fighting for than even 10 years ago. Some of you like the things the current Supreme Court has done, they may very well be willing to entertain putting your public lands in a situation to actually be sold now with a ruling given the make up. The state of Utah has sold around 65% of the state lands it was given at statehood. The state of Utah has proven the only way it can make a profit off of the land it has is to sell 65% and counting with a couple land auctions a year. If you think they won’t sell your lands or are better at managing them, just consider they’ve sold 65% of the lands they’re required to make a profit off of and sell thousands more of those acres every year. If the state of Utah could make money off of managing lands, why is the only way they’ve made money been by selling 65% of their assets they were given at statehood? Don’t kid yourself, your hunting spots are up for auction if the greedy ******* developers and Real Estate folks in the legislature ever get their hands on them.

IMG_1529.jpeg
 
You Voted For Cox!

But Now He's Spineless?

UN-F'N-BELIEVABLE!

Oneye said:
Well, I told yall they still wanted them. My only reply is this. Fight for them, contact your legislators, contact the spineless Governor that is Spencer Cox. Contact the speaker of the House Mike Schultz. Contact Stuart Adams the Senate President. I would say it’s more worth fighting for than even 10 years ago. Some of you like the things the current Supreme Court has done, they may very well be willing to entertain putting your public lands in a situation to actually be sold now with a ruling given the make up. The state of Utah has sold around 65% of the state lands it was given at statehood. The state of Utah has proven the only way it can make a profit off of the land it has is to sell 65% and counting with a couple land auctions a year. If you think they won’t sell your lands or are better at managing them, just consider they’ve sold 65% of the lands they’re required to make a profit off of and sell thousands more of those acres every year. If the state of Utah could make money off of managing lands, why is the only way they’ve made money been by selling 65% of their assets they were given at statehood? Don’t kid yourself, your hunting spots are up for auction if the greedy ******* developers and Real Estate folks in the legislature ever get their hands on them.

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elkassassin said:
You Voted For Cox!

But Now He's Spineless?

UN-F'N-BELIEVABLE!
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He’s spineless. He gives at every turn, and I will admit I actually really regret ever voting for him and never will again. However, as far as we may disagree on many things, the current makeup of the Supreme Court makes the selling of federal public lands more plausible than it has ever been, and we may be far apart on many things, but I’ll fight like hell in lockstep with you to ensure our public lands are never transferred and sold. We can agree management could be better, but management doesn’t matter once there’s a no trespassing sign at out favorite public hunting spot. We beat Jason Chaffetz trying to sell them, but truly, this is plausible given the Supreme Court makeup, more now than before, and hunters better be ready to fight for BLM and Forest Service lands or you will watch some of your spots sold within your lifetime.
 
Having known Shultz over 30 years, I wouldn't waste an email. He's already getting new Castle Creek realtor signs printed as we speak.

The real fear isn't the Utah delegation. The real fear is that the left, who are in charge, have found their cash cow in renewables on BLM. The old check on Republican land grabbing with the D, is over. Lots cheaper to get that land from Utah than the feds.
 
Not quite that easy. The other side wants to put windmills and solar farms all over the west as well.

Developed for houses, or developed for solar farms. Either way it's developed.

The left knows it's easier to buy off the D and beauracracy in DC. The right knows it's easier to buy off the R in SLC.
 
They’re actually using our tax dollars to run tv ads over this?…….just putrid truly. They’re using your tax dollars to run ads as a PR campaign to steal your public lands.
 
hossblur said:
Not quite that easy. The other side wants to put windmills and solar farms all over the west as well.

Developed for houses, or developed for solar farms. Either way it's developed.
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I agree for the most part, however there are certain places solar farms make sense, although not a lot of places, however…there is a public comment period and avenue with the BLM.
hossblur said:
The left knows it's easier to buy off the D and beauracracy in DC. The right knows it's easier to buy off the R in SLC.
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We’ve seen how quickly the state actually sells public lands. BLM and Forest Service lands as opposed to SITLA lands are largely still very much in tact and open to us all. State lands? Higher fees, lower access, and sold.
 
elkassassin said:
Vote Em out?

By Voting For Them?

And Then Later Say You'll Never Vote For Them Again?

SWEET GEEZUS!
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I’m sorry but you realize Phil Lyman was the other guy in the primary right? Cox won’t get my vote again, even in a primary after his last 40 days. He won’t get it this November either. Cox or Lyman in regards to public lands? That’s just a false choice.
 
Oneye said:
They’re actually using our tax dollars to run tv ads over this?…….just putrid truly. They’re using your tax dollars to run ads as a PR campaign to steal your public lands.
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Meanwhile they went into special session today to put a ballot initiative on your November ballot so they can ignore Utah citizens after the Utah Supreme Court told them they couldn’t. I don’t think people grasp quite how out of control and high on its own power Republicans in the state legislature are.
 
The lawsuit only asked a constitutional question. It’s a question that has been asked for decades. Governor Matheson (democrat) ran bills on this back in the early 1980s (article in Rangelands). Representative Brian King (democrat candidate for Utah governor) has even supported putting it before the courts to get this question answered so we can stop talking about it (January 12, 2022 during the Federalism Commission meeting). We need to get this question answered so we don’t kick the can down the road for another 50 years.
 
D_Hoyt said:
The lawsuit only asked a constitutional question. It’s a question that has been asked for decades. Governor Matheson (democrat) ran bills on this back in the early 1980s (article in Rangelands). Representative Brian King (democrat candidate for Utah governor) has even supported putting it before the courts to get this question answered so we can stop talking about it (January 12, 2022 during the Federalism Commission meeting). We need to get this question answered so we don’t kick the can down the road for another 50 years.
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lol. They want your public lands to develop them. I’ve been interacting with one of Cox’s closest campaign people on Twitter. They want your BLM lands to develop them into housing, this is not a secret. Their end goal is 100% to sell and develop these lands. Don’t let yourself be fooled. Utah’s House Speaker and Senate President both have development and Real Estate incentives to do so. They want them to turn them into homes and business and sell them for cabin communities. They are not asking a simple question and they’ve made clear their intentions.
 
So Who You Writing In?

Oneye said:
I’m sorry but you realize Phil Lyman was the other guy in the primary right? Cox won’t get my vote again, even in a primary after his last 40 days. He won’t get it this November either. Cox or Lyman in regards to public lands? That’s just a false choice.
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D_Hoyt said:
The lawsuit only asked a constitutional question. It’s a question that has been asked for decades. Governor Matheson (democrat) ran bills on this back in the early 1980s (article in Rangelands). Representative Brian King (democrat candidate for Utah governor) has even supported putting it before the courts to get this question answered so we can stop talking about it (January 12, 2022 during the Federalism Commission meeting). We need to get this question answered so we don’t kick the can down the road for another 50 years.
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Roe was the law once and Citizens United wasn't. Roberts' Court has proven to be itching to rewrite law, not simply answer questions.

Cox tipped his hand when he said, "The time is right." This isn't a fact-finding mission or simply the search for an answer, they were waiting for the right Court to change the law so they can take and sell public land.
 
Not a chance that there's even a small minority of Utahns who support their tax money being burned to find out if Mike Shultz can get his hands on some cheap land.

Oneye is correct, and it's the flaw of Cox, he's spineless.
 
I think we all forget how quickly governments go back on their words. Hell 130 years ago we made all sorts of promises to the natives… and then whoops, we moved the goal posts. So yeah if we give the land over to the developers I’m sure it will go great. You know they will only sell a little… well maybe a little more… and you know what we are out of BLM so we want the NF now. Only these chunks that we deem “useless” ope they will be gone too… worst part is those C suckers will absolutely not flood the market so Joe and Joan can grab some land, it will be slowly played out and I’d bet anything prime will be sold in a back room before it ever hits the auction block.
 
grizzly said:
Roe was the law once and Citizens United wasn't. Roberts' Court has proven to be itching to rewrite law, not simply answer questions.
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You talk about this like this is something new, but you know better. Not everyone knows better, but you do.

constitution.congress.gov

Table of Supreme Court Decisions Overruled by Subsequent Decisions | Resources | Constitution Annotated | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

A table of Supreme Court decisions in which the Court overturned a prior ruling. The table contains only cases where the Court explicitly stated that it is overruling a prior decision or issued a decision that is the functional equivalent of an express overruling.
constitution.congress.gov constitution.congress.gov
 
As for the lawsuit, it’s been decades in the making so I say get it over with. I know what the result of the state gaining control is, and I don’t like it. I’m not certain the state will gain control, but I think I’m with D_Hoyt in being tired of the rhetoric, so let’s get an answer.

I’ve long felt that hunting and fishing as I knew it would not be available to my grandchildren for one reason or another, but the prospect of what the future could be after something like this is pretty depressing.
 
Take it and lock it in a conservation easement for 1000 years, I'm on board.

But hundreds of square miles of Castle Creek and Adams Company apartment complexes, I'm a hard no.

Imagine if the State took that money and invested in county's were there is land for homes but no industry to support families.
 
Vanilla said:
As for the lawsuit, it’s been decades in the making so I say get it over with.
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And the proponents know a decade ago, they would've lost. They finally have the Court to give them their victory; hence, "The right time," from Cox.
 
Have to love how tge house speaker Schultz "represents " Hooper area while living in Morgan County.

I'm sure our friends at sfw will stand with tge avg hunter against this😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
 
I'm all for Utah taking over federal lands. Possibly even national parks. Utah proved they were more efficient at running Zions than the feds were during covid.

I vehemently disagree with any selling off of our public land. Force the state to sign a conservation lease or change the state constitution to lock it up.

As far as taxes and federal funds are concerned, there are several ways to make money with federal land recourses that won't permanently destroy them. Logging national forests was how the forest service sustained itself for decades before environmental waco's took over. Some drilling and mining leases would easily offset the cost of federal funds. Utilizing the land to its fullest potential would benefit everyone. Not just the few special interest groups that control our federal agencies.
 
DBLung said:
I'm all for Utah taking over federal lands. Possibly even national parks. Utah proved they were more efficient at running Zions than the feds were during covid.

I vehemently disagree with any selling off of our public land. Force the state to sign a conservation lease or change the state constitution to lock it up.

As far as taxes and federal funds are concerned, there are several ways to make money with federal land recourses that won't permanently destroy them. Logging national forests was how the forest service sustained itself for decades before environmental waco's took over. Some drilling and mining leases would easily offset the cost of federal funds. Utilizing the land to its fullest potential would benefit everyone. Not just the few special interest groups that control our federal agencies.
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Are we as hunters a "special interest"?
 
Keystone said:
Are we as hunters a "special interest"?
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If you as a hunter believe that land shouldn't be multiple use, then yes. Some hunters are clueless to what/how public land can contribute to everyone. Somehow any grazing is over grazing etc.
 
grizzly said:
And the proponents know a decade ago, they would've lost. They finally have the Court to give them their victory; hence, "The right time," from Cox.
Click to expand...

Maybe, but again, you talk about this as if it’s something new. You know better.

This issue and conversation pre-dates my lifetime, and I’m no spring chicken anymore. It is time, only because it has never been addressed previously.

It would make me laugh if SCOTUS refused to hear it.
 
hossblur said:
Not a chance that there's even a small minority of Utahns who support their tax money being burned to find out if Mike Shultz can get his hands on some cheap land.

Oneye is correct, and it's the flaw of Cox, he's spineless. This would Be A 1st,Right?
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Vanilla said:
Maybe, but again, you talk about this as if it’s something new. You know better.

This issue and conversation pre-dates my lifetime, and I’m no spring chicken anymore. It is time, only because it has never been addressed previously.

It would make me laugh if SCOTUS refused to hear it.
Click to expand...
I misunderstood what you were saying was new. If you're referring to the Sagebrush Rebellion of four decades ago, I agree.

SCOTUS will hear it, and likely rule for the plaintiffs... if I had to place money. I hope I'm wrong.
 
DBLung said:
I'm all for Utah taking over federal lands. Possibly even national parks. Utah proved they were more efficient at running Zions than the feds were during covid.

I vehemently disagree with any selling off of our public land. Force the state to sign a conservation lease or change the state constitution to lock it up.

As far as taxes and federal funds are concerned, there are several ways to make money with federal land recourses that won't permanently destroy them. Logging national forests was how the forest service sustained itself for decades before environmental waco's took over. Some drilling and mining leases would easily offset the cost of federal funds. Utilizing the land to its fullest potential would benefit everyone. Not just the few special interest groups that control our federal agencies.
Click to expand...
Enjoy watching your lands get sold then. The state of Utah charges higher fees on state lands, has stricter rules, and sells them. Grazing on federal land? $1.35. Grazing on Utah land? $6-$11. The DWR pays $2 million a year, and taxpayers pay the state land board $1million a year for you to have the right to hunt or recreate on state lands. Also, the only way the state has found to make money off roughly 65% of the state lands it was granted at statehood, was selling them. The state of Utah cannot afford to "manage" these lands, they want to sell them. Period. My lord some of them are saying it out loud.....
 
DBLung said:
If you as a hunter believe that land shouldn't be multiple use, then yes. Some hunters are clueless to what/how public land can contribute to everyone. Somehow any grazing is over grazing etc.
Click to expand...
The land IS used for multiple use, in fact conservatives voted against giving conservation an equal seat at the table for grazing permits. Federal lands FAVOR mineral developers and grazers.
 
Vanilla said:
Maybe, but again, you talk about this as if it’s something new. You know better.

This issue and conversation pre-dates my lifetime, and I’m no spring chicken anymore. It is time, only because it has never been addressed previously.

It would make me laugh if SCOTUS refused to hear it.
Click to expand...
The court is new, and has proven it will rule in ways prior courts never would have. Maybe we have a chance of your latter statement considering Trump Jr. and Trump himself are on record as being ANTI-transfer. However, hunters and hunting groups need to get loud about this.
 
grizzly said:
I misunderstood what you were saying was new. If you're referring to the Sagebrush Rebellion of four decades ago, I agree.

SCOTUS will hear it, and likely rule for the plaintiffs... if I had to place money. I hope I'm wrong.
Click to expand...
What's new is a court that has proven it will rule in ways courts never would have. "The time is right."
 
Oneye said:
I agree for the most part, however there are certain places solar farms make sense, although not a lot of places, however…there is a public comment period and avenue with the BLM.

We’ve seen how quickly the state actually sells public lands. BLM and Forest Service lands as opposed to SITLA lands are largely still very much in tact and open to us all. State lands? Higher fees, lower access, and sold.
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There is not one place that solar makes any sense, not one!

Or windmills for that matter…
 
Them F'N Wind Mills At The Base Of The Blues There By Monticello/Blanding Are Some Real EYE SORES!

Several Of Them Not Turning!

I'd Guess The Big Birds Would Perch On The Ones Not Turning & Fly In To Some That Are Turning!
 
hossblur said:
Yup.

On private land
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Yeah, I’m fine with that, lots of rooftops, sure private lands and buildings, however, there are places in this state on public lands they make sense too. Although I agree with others on windmills, I’m not pro-windmill under nearly any situation on public lands.
 
Stuart Adams and Mike Schultz are having themselves a hell of a time screwing over Utah voters and tax payers recently. They tried to put a lie on all our ballots to enshrine themselves more power(Amendment D), that the courts told them they were being deceitful to voters so it will be left on the ballot but not count due to their lying language, and now they are the tie breaking votes, to waste our tax dollars in the efforts to steal our public lands from us. These two dudes suck, and the legislature sucks, but these two are a special kinda suck.

www.ksl.com

Utah Legislature votes to join lawsuit on federal lands

The state Legislature's Management Committee voted Tuesday to file a friend of the court brief before the U.S. Supreme Court in support of the Utah Attorney General's lawsuit filed in August over 18.5 million acres of
www.ksl.com www.ksl.com
 
Utahns continue to put these guys into office. Mike Lee has been chasing Utah's public lands for years. Utah cannot afford the cost of wild land fire suppression in the state. To cover those massive costs they'd have to sale off a ton of public lands, lands may of us hunt. I don't see any scenario where Utahns change their voting strategy, but it could come at the loss of a ton of public land if they continue down the path they're on.
 

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