yet another bullet question....

[travishunter3006]

So in discussion today about how to pick the right bullet...etc. I heard my friend say that its the hydrostatic shock that does all the damage and that the bullet itself doesn't do the "killing". He went on to talk about "knock down" power blah blah blah....


this bit about the hydro-whatever shock is something i have heard alot. My question is: If it really is the hydrostatic shock that kills the animal and that shock is created by the speed and twist of the bullet, then why would it be important for the bullet to expand at all??

I have my own opinions on this but before i say anything i want to hear what some of the more savy fellows have to say.






It was a big bodied 2 point. (this is my signature)

 

[justr_86]

Thats a whitetail bess....


I like energy transfer to help knock them down, the bullet does need to expand and make a bigger hole to cause a hemmorage.. little bit of everything is needed from both sides of your arguement.

 

[never_catch]

I thought hydro-static shock was the look on the face of a cop after being punched??

~Z~

 

[TOPGUN]

Good topic Travis because it ties in directly with what was being debated on the .243 thread that some people forgot about or don't know. A bullet does kill by HS, where an arrow bleeds an animal out unless you booboo and hit it in the spine or head, which shouldn't be attempted. The 30-06 round that tore my buck's heart in half this Fall killed him immediately by HS, as well as immediate, massive blood loss. A bullet produces tissue damage to the area where the impact occurs, as well as producing remote wounding and incapacitation through a hydraulic effect in the liquid filled tissue and a lot of people want to call that "knock down power". It is in a sense, but most experts in the field don't like to use that terminology. Anyway, there is plenty of scientific evidence that HS can produce remote neural damage and incapacitation more quickly than blood loss effects. This is where the speed, size of the bullet, and it's penetration/expansion capabilities come into play. That .243 you were thinking about the wife using on elk will not have nearly the energy or bullet weight upon impact to impart the physical or HS damage that a bigger caliber will. Hence, there is a good chance an animal that big will escape and die a slower death due to bleeding, rather than immediate shock to put it down within sight with a bigger caliber. The quicker that animal goes down and dies the more humane the kill and less likelihood of losing him.

 

[CAelknuts]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-27-11 AT 08:36AM (MST)[p]Hydrostatic shock plays a major role in killing an animal. There was recently a great discussion over on Accurate Reloading about this topic, and the original poster is one of the people associated with Cutting Edge Bullets. They're a new maker of premium bullets and have quickly gained a following among those who hunt dangerous game. One of the things I remember was their explanation of some of their banded solids, where the bullet has bands (the opposite of cannelures) that creat 'super-cavitation' as the solid goes through the animal and does far more damage than a solid would normally create. The fellow was citing data from studies they have done in the development of their bullets. Super cavitation and hydrostatic shock are essentially the same thing, though perhaps on different scales of magnitude. It's a good read and anyone interested would do well to find that thread over on AR.

 

[BuckSnort]

It's gonna be a long winter....

Disclaimer:
The poster does not take any responsibility for any hurt or bad feelings. Reading threads poses inherent risks. The poster would like to remind readers to make sure they have a functional sense of humor before they visit any discussion board.

 

[BIGJOHNT]

I learned alot on the subject from a video called Deadly Effects " What bullets do to bodies" Its about 2 hrs long and goes into alot of the hydrostatic shock, bullet weight and other myths about bullets. It's about killing people not animals, but it still applys here.
Anyone else see it ? I have it on 8 mm. It is still avalible if you seach it.

 

[Zeke]

Bullet upset equals tissue displacement.... BUT..... you need the energy, sectional density, and bullet construction in sufficient quantities to reach THROUGH the vitals.

This "shock" which you're talking about is also described as the "primary" wound channel. What we see when we walk up on a downed animal is the "secondary" wound.

The primary wound is anout 10X bigger and is caused by the bullet speed and expansion etc.

Here is where we need to balance bullet penetration with controlled upset for optimal performance on big game.

Clear at mud?

Zeke

 

[TOPGUN]

Well said Zeke!

 

[travishunter3006]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-27-11 AT 05:49PM (MST)[p]I'm glad you picked up on where I was going with this TOPGUN. The size and speed and SD of the bullet itself all play a factor in what actually kills the animal.

Makes sense.

Thanks for all the opinions and your expert inside knowledge.




It was a big bodied 2 point. (this is my signature)

 

[mtmuley]

"Hydrostatic Shock". Complete BS. It's a big word that bullet companies coined that don't mean a damn thing. mtmuley

 

[REDDOG]

Loading the bullet backwards creates 2x the 'knockdown...Just one of the many reasons I load my own bullets.

 

[isayNUNYA]

I thought vital tissue destruction caused death???
Were can I buy a box of these hydrostatic shock bullets?

 

[Zeke]

> I thought vital tissue destruction
>caused death???
> Were can I buy a
>box of these hydrostatic shock
>bullets?

You're right NUNYA.

Tissue destruction is caused by bullet upset, the bullet upset causes a hydrolic effect inside the animal. This energy transfer caused the initial (primary) wound to be about 10X larger than the destruction (secondary) that we see on the animals when we retreive them.

Call it what you want. It's the real deal though.

Zeke