Wyoming draw question

WapitiBob · Jan 22, 2011

I want to ensure I don't draw my 1st choice but, I have to apply in the special draw to get my 2nd choice. 2nd choice in the cheepie side of the draw won't get it done.

If there is a hunt that has tags for the cheap side but not the special side, and I list that special side hunt as my 1st choice, will the draw "elevate" my 2nd choice to my 1st, therefor screwing my plans to keep my points?

Tag quotas aren't decided until after the app period, so I can apply to a unit that will "eventually" have no tags available.

PleaseDear · Jan 22, 2011

Geez.....................I see what your asking though.

I would call 'em and ask for sure....

But I would think your 1st choice stays 1st choice and then 2nd stays 2nd choice.....

I would not think they would be able to alter your appl. by upgrading your choice selection.

Call 'em---interesting question--307-777-4600

Robb

WapitiBob · Jan 23, 2011

With my luck they'll issue 1 tag and then I'd be hosed.

TOPGUN · Jan 23, 2011

LAST EDITED ON Jan-23-11 AT 01:23PM (MST)[p]No; you only lose your PPs on a first choice draw, regardless of whether you pay the regular price or go into the Special higher priced drawings. They will not move your 2nd or 3rd choices "up" like you are asking. You did lose me though because there will be tags in the Special draws first as compared to the other draws the way the percentages of tags are set up by statute. If they did what you mentioned,they would have one mass of disgrunteld, armed hunters on their doorstep! However, what you are mentioning would seem to be pretty risky because, even though you can look at what has happened in past draws, it doesn't mean that is what will happen in 2011! It would be my luck to apply as a 1st choice with 4 PPs in a unit that I figured would take max PPs and draw that, thus losing my PPs, instead of getting the second choice I really wanted and keeping my PPs. That is one thing that I feel is wrong with the drawing method being used. I think you should be able to decide what year you want to activate and place your PPs into use for your first choice so you don't lose them in a year where you want to hunt somewhere else and not chance losing the PPs. The only way you can do that right now is to not apply in the draw and buy a leftover tag in July. That's what I've been doing and will do again this year in order to have absolutely no chance at losing my PPs. The only way that works though is because there are a lot of unsold tags where I have been hunting. I buy a PP during the summer and then buy my leftover tag in September. What you are talking about doing if you have a decent number of PPs presents a real problem and chance of losing your Points.

buckspotter7 · Jan 23, 2011

Every year you see several units on the drawing odds sheet that have no tags, but have 1st, 2nd, or 3rd choice applicants. Tags or no tags, you should be fine. You'll get your 2nd choice and keep your points. Unless there are tags in your 1st choice and you are lucky or unlucky enough to draw it.

sasquatch · Jan 24, 2011

Hey TOPGUN, quick question...PM sent. Thanks.

TOPGUN · Jan 24, 2011

LAST EDITED ON Jan-24-11 AT 01:08PM (MST)[p]Buckspotter7---The reason you see that once in a while is when there are so few tags issued in a unit that by the time the higher priced tags and the PP tags are allocated in a unit there aren't any left in the remaining random draws that come last. That is why you occasionally see people that have applied for that cheaper draw and there are no tags available. The reason for that is that the total number of tags issued in the draw is not known until the application period has come and gone. It is not because guys are stupid and apply for no tag, LOL!!! However, I have seen where a dummy or two has applied and drawn a tag with several PPs in a Region where no PPs are required to draw and there are hundreds of tags left after the draw every year. That is not too friggin smart!!!

Sasquatch---PM received and one sent back at ya---MIKE

WapitiBob · Jan 24, 2011

The hunt I looked at had only a cpl tags issued on the cheap side, none in the special side.
Could it be there were no applicants on the special side so those tags went to the cheap side?

Yes, it's a risky move but with max points the worst odds I can find will be about 15% on the special side.
My alternatives are to apply for 60 and hope I don't get drawn or just wait and by some 30 tags as leftovers. The unit I wanted is unobtainable in the cheap side of the draw as a 2nd choice.

ColoradoOak · Jan 24, 2011

>Could it be there were no
>applicants on the special side
>so those tags went to
>the cheap side?

Yes, that is possible. But it would show those tags under "quota", and show zero "issued", in the special draw odds.

TOPGUN · Jan 24, 2011

If the Special did not show any tags and the Cheap side did, it was either a mistake made by someone who entered the data or nobody entered the Special Draw. In the latter scenario the tags in that draw would automatically go into the other draw you mentioned. I also agree with ColoradoOak in that they should have shown the tag quota in the Special Draw and no applicants resulting in 0 issued, but again, someone may have made a booboo! I just hope if you do what you are talking about that you get your second choice and retain your points. If I were you, I would definitely have that first choice unit all mapped out and be ready to go there if your plan doesn't work! Good luck man!!!

WapitiBob · Jan 24, 2011

Tag quota was zero as were the applicants.
if I put in with my wife my point avg will drop but she doesn't hunt yet. Dam, $500 goat seems a little steep.

TOPGUN · Jan 25, 2011

Cripes, I thought you were talking about doing that for elk or deer! If you just want a good goat, buy leftover tags for unit 7 up west of Newcastle and buy another point this summer during the PP application period! There is plenty of Federal land and over 12,000 acres of WIHA private property open to the public. The goats are there, as I was all over that area last year the second week of the season and most hunters were gone. Just get off the roads a mile or more and you can kill a good one and not worry about losing your points!

WapitiBob · Jan 25, 2011

7 is way to far for me to go. Casper is my limit.

I hunted 30 last year and the goats just weren't there. We killed what we saw but I'm looking for something better quantity wise.
I have been looking at the "usual suspects" around Casper.

You were correct on the tags going to the special draw first, then the leftovers dropping down to the regular draw. I called today and nobody applied to 85 Special so the 1 tag went to the regular draw. My options are now limited to the two I mentioned above.

kilowatt · Jan 25, 2011

Only 148 miles from Casper to Newcastle which would take 2 hours of driving.
I drive from CALI and that would not stop me if that was where I could go for a Antelope like said above.

Brian
http://i25.tinypic.com/fxbjgy.jpg[/IMG]

npaden · Jan 25, 2011

One thing that has always confused me on the Wyoming draw is the Random draw vs. the Preference Point draw.

If you have a preference point are you only eligible for the preference point draw or do you drop down into the random draw if you don't have enough points to draw in the preference point draw?

Thanks, Nathan

TOPGUN · Jan 25, 2011

LAST EDITED ON Jan-25-11 AT 06:23PM (MST)[p]kilowatt--That's what I thought as soon as I read his response, but I guess it's different strokes for different folks, LOL!

npaden---The way Wyoming works their draws is that the more expensive Special draws and the PP draws go first. Anyone who is in any of those draws and does not draw a tag is then placed in the cheaper random draw for a second chance at a tag. The only way you lose your PPs is if you draw your first choice in the initial draw that you apply for.

canyoncrosser · Jan 26, 2011

I need help. I want to hunt a unit that if I applied as my first choice in the special I would have 100% chance odds.

However, I have 3 points and do not wish to burn them on this unit.

Do I stand a chance on a second choice or do they look at everyones first choice first?

I plan on putting in for the toughest unit to draw as my first choice.

TOPGUN · Jan 27, 2011

You would be putting in for the Random Regular PP Draw. If you put in for a unit you don't want to draw as a first choice with your 3 PPs, they will draw all the way down through the people starting with 5 PPs this year and keep going through those first choice applicants until the tags are exhausted. Therefore, if not enough people put in with more PPs than you have for the allotted tags, you could possibly draw that license you don't want when they start drawing from those like you with 3 PPs. They would go the same route with the unit you want to put as your second choice and if there are still tags left after the first choice applicant list is exhausted, then people like yourself that listed it as their second choice wiil be drawn until the tags are exhausted. The big problem with trying to do what you are talking about is that people can change their choices from year to year. I assume you have looked closely at the draw odds from the last couple years in the Regular PP Draw for the units you want to put in for. You have to remember that anyone with even a fraction of a PP will draw a tag as their first choice before you get a chance with your 3 PPs as your second choice. In case you haven't looked at all those odds you need to do so. Send me a PM with the animal and units for your two choices if you need help and I'll PM you back after I look them up!