Why 10x42s?

[BGbasbhat]

In my continuation to my 15x56 vs Spotter thread, I've been thinking about my current setup, or rather what I am saving for my setup to be?

Currently I have Cabela?s Euro 10x42s. I love the glass (especially for the $); but in my trips this fall, I've noticed the standard 10x42s, power vs objective, might not be practical in our western situation. I've read, but haven't tested yet, that the 10x42s on a tripod COULD be as good as 15x56s on a tripod?.. I have a hard time believing this for general mid-long range glassing; but i'm willing to give it a shot.

On the other end of the spectrum, when putting on a few stalks, I noticed the 10x42s had a bit too much magnification/little obj for short-range applications. For example, picking out an antler tine in the brush was easy with the 10x42s at <100yds; but figuring out where it was (i.e. what the tree next to it looked like, or the nearest bush to it) seemed difficult. I found myself finding the antler tine; but getting mixed up as to landmarks around it. Come to think about it, going back to our farm in MO, 10x42s are way over power for Midwest treestand or still hunting as well. The heavy timber there is just as bad as some of the old growth in our national forests.

I know 10x42s seem to be the standard ?first binocular? to buy; but I haven't found its niche. They seem to be decent in short-range and stalking situations, and decent for mid and long-range applications. Am I missing a situation where a 10x42 is ideal?

In my thinking lately, an ideal setup would be:

7x50 ? Would be ideal for short-range glassing, stalks, and heavy timber. It would also be decent for mid-range general glassing.
15x56 ? Would be ideal for mid-range detailed glassing, and long-range general glassing.
20-60x spotter - Would be ideal for detailed long-range glassing and judging.

So, what do you guys think? Maddglasser, MesquiteHunter, RedRabbit and all you glassing fools, what's your guy?s setup? What is a 10x42 great for? Does it have a place in your setup? What am I missing? Input welcomed!!!!




"...I'd rather be tried by twelve than carried by six..."

 

[redrabbit]

To save weight and space over seperate 10x and 15x binos, I purchased the Leica 10+15 Duovids for use in open country like javelina, antelope and coues.

I have a spotter but rarely pack it as the use is too limited vs the weight factor. Handy for near the vehicle though.

I think the FOV is too narrow for 10x for deer and elk in the pines/cedars. Thus I picked up a pair of the Zen ED 8x. (The newer Zen 7x may be a better choice in close cover and short ranges like when stillhunting the timber.)

 

[BGbasbhat]

Great point about the weight. I do realize 3 pieces of glass would be ideal; but not feasible for all applications (backcountry packing). Since you got your Zen 8x, do you think maybe a 15-50x65 spotter could take the place of the 10-15x Leicas? Depending on the area, you would be good for short distances, and be good for longer..?

I realize it will all depend on the type/location of hunting. The 10-15x Leicas are sweet; but you said yourself they aren't very good for close up stuff. I'm just wondering if you could be covered with the Zens and a spotter.





"...I'd rather be tried by twelve than carried by six..."

 

[Frontier]

LAST EDITED ON Sep-17-09 AT 11:36AM (MST)[p] I'm not a glassing fool, but what you name would be wonderful for all types of glassing, especially if someone else carried it for me. The problem you mention with 10 power I do find some people having that same problem, but everyone is different and I don't seem to have that up close detail viewing difficulty with my 10X. Maybe an 8X with a spotting scope might be a good compromise for you, but I'm sure you've thought of that already.
You posted just before me, saying exactly what I thought. I think it would work for you.

 

[redrabbit]

Since you got
>your Zen 8x, do you
>think maybe a 15-50x65 spotter
>could take the place of
>the 10-15x Leicas?

No.
Looking through a spotting scope all day with one eye closed or even covered by a patch would be tiring. I would rather have a good pair of 15x binos than a spotting scope, if I was limited to just one.
Most of my glassing is open country, so 15x binos get a good share of the workout. I do use the 10x on a tripod for the close ridges where the 15x FOV is too limiting and the magnification is not needed.
Also, for the open country, I would prefer 10x over 7x or 8x for general use.

 

[rradams]

As you already know, for better or worse, everything is a compromise. I use 10x42 as my primary binoculars (along with a spotter). They are great for sit down glassing and even better on a tripod. However, when I'm hiking and my breathing and heart rate are up the view can be difficult to stabilize. In those situations an 8x or 7x would be a better choice. For my uses (some hiking, lots of stationary glassing) the 10x are a better fit.

 

[mesquitehunter]

I would add to this post but Doug hit it spot on.Doug's advice is worth it's weight in gold.

 

[3blade]

>I would add to this post
>but Doug hit it spot
>on.Doug's advice is worth it's
>weight in gold.

which post is Dougs? thanks

 

[BGbasbhat]

Good post rradams. One thing I'm definitely going to have to try is putting my 10x42s on a tripod, and see if they are anywhere near the 15x56s I used for an antelope hunt.
What type of spotter do you have to team up with your 10x42s? If I take away the initial discomfort of using one eye for a spotter, I would think the spotter could cover the 15x56 realm, and leave the short stuff up to some 8x or 7x.

"...I'd rather be tried by twelve than carried by six..."

 

[redrabbit]

Doug's advice is worth it's
>weight in gold.

Thanks. When should I expect an armored truck from Fort Knox? ;-)

 

[redrabbit]

BG,

Maybe if you could detail the types of hunts, terrain, how much hiking/backpacking in for the hunt vs closeto vehicle, glassing distances, and % spent at each, we might be able to give you a better recommendation.

From reading your posts, I am thinking you would need a 7x with a wider FOV for the timber (7x50 would be too heavy IMO),your 10x would do fine for general more open country use, but you need a stronger glass for longer distances. I still think extended periods of glassing with a spotter is the wrong way, btdt. Maybe a Swaro 15X with a doubler for checking distant deer may work better, but most people do not care for the doubler's image quality.

Doug~RR

 

[BGbasbhat]

Like you guys had said in my 15x56 vs spotter thread, I am finally getting it through my thick head that a glassing setup is relative (rradams..). I've only been out west for 4 years, so I'm finally disproving to myself that some good 10x42s and a 20-60x80 spotter is what you need. That doesn't seem to be the case for everybody?. But who knows, maybe other people are coming to this realization also?... ?.and wouldn't you know it, just in writing the below situations, I think I've convinced myself of what would be ideal for me?.but then again, you guys know more than I do, so input is welcomed!! So here are most of the situations I hunt in. I've done a bit of bivy hunting; but I would say most of the time I am back at camp at night.

Scenario #1:
Environment: Arizona desert (saquaros, creosote, palo verde, prickly pears, etc.)
Animal: Deer
Hunting technique: Spot & Stalk
Glassing realm: <3 miles
Glassing technique: general spotting, picking apart bushes vs antlers, no judging or scoring necessary (don't care about score, and no point limitations in AZ)
Glassing duration: Sunup to sundown unless going on a stalk or changing positions
Travel: 3-5 miles hiking round trip
Camp Style: Truck camp

Scenario #2:
Environment: Arizona rim country (pines, scrub oak(I hate this stuff btw), transition to P/Js)
Animal: Elk, deer, turkey, bear
Hunting technique: Calling or still hunting
Glassing realm: <300 yards (usually <150)
Glassing technique: short distance and detailed due to thicker cover. Considering the distance, judging/scoring is easy enough not to be a factor.
Glassing duration: Very limited due to thicker cover. Usually just glassing to make sure not to jump anything or to see where the animal is bedded.
Travel: 3-5 miles hiking round trip
Camp Style: Truck camp

Scenario #3
Environment: Missouri timber and farmland (oak and pine timber split up by smaller 5-30 acre crop fields)
Animal: Deer
Hunting technique: Tree stand, still, blind hunting
Glassing realm: <300 yards (usually <150)
Glassing technique: short distance and detailed due to thicker cover. Considering the distance, judging/scoring is easy enough not to be a factor.
Glassing duration: Very limited due to thicker cover. Usually just glassing to make sure not to jump anything or to see where the animal is bedded.
Travel: <1 mile
Camp Style: Barnhouse

Thanks again everybody, and I look forward to your responses....


"...I'd rather be tried by twelve than carried by six..."

 

[mesquitehunter]

Well RR's advice is right on Que' once again. He has a wealth of info if one is willing to learn.

BG my hunting scenario is like the first you mentioned. But I very rarely walk more than 1 mile to my vantage point or hill to set up and glass. So weight isn't a big factor me. By the time I'm getting tired I'm sitting on my ass glassing. Most of the country we hunt is flat very flat and we may glass out to 3+ miles. So I rely on my 15's for the greater distance. I wouldn't recommend just being limited to 10's in that situation. But if that's all you have fine. Once we do a stalk down in the flats I rely on my spotter on the hill to give me directions to the deer. I don't even take my binos on the stalk. But if your by yourself you should stick to the hillier stuff and use 7's or 10's should you do a stalk. It's easier to stalk deer in the hills when you have no spotter. In the flats if you have no spotter forget it.

 

[fatrooster]

7 or 8 power bino's are definitely better in the timber and much easier to hold steady than 10 power and even easier to hold steady than 15 power. I guess thats why most people like to start out with 10 power, because it is in the middle between the 8 power and 15 power. 10 power can be used handheld with good results and with great results on a tripod where 15's are hard to hold steady by hand but are awesome on a tripod. 8 power is great handheld and are good on a tripod but sometimes lack the distance power needed in the West. So we get back to the idea of 10 power being in the middle again and touching into both worlds. Most people only owne one bino so choose the 10 power. But if you love optics like many people on this site do then you want to owne a little bit of everything. I still think that the spotter and 10 power bino is the best setup that a person could owne if he could only have two items of optics therefore covering a wider range of visibility although the spotter does create eye fatigue. Nevertheless, either way is effective and you are way ahead of the game learning and using optics considering you came from the East. When I came to Nevada from Florida it took me about 7 years before I learned about optics but when I did my whole world of hunting took a drastic change for the better. fatrooster.

 

[BGbasbhat]

Yep, I appreciate all your guys' help. I've been obsessed with hunting since growing up in MO, so I'm trying to experience all I can here in AZ. Like you mesquitehunter, desert and high scrub hunting is how I hunt the majority of the time.

With regards to your reply, 90% of the time, I'm by myself. Having said that, your response is exactly what I was thinking. A directing spotter is great; but usually I spot something from a hill, pick out some landmarks, check the wind, and make my move. The issue that I've had lately, is once I get to those landmarks, the 10x seem overpowered for the situation. Usually the vegetation is thick, and I just need some additional detail to find the landmark or antler tine I'm looking for.

All in all, I'm thinking the 10x42s just aren't fitting into my hunting style. Trading them in for 15x56s, and follow up with some 7x50s I think might be the ticket....



"...I'd rather be tried by twelve than carried by six..."

 

[Foreman4x4]

LAST EDITED ON Sep-18-09 AT 11:04PM (MST)[p]It's a sickness I tell ya, a sickness!....

My arsenal currently consists of:

15x56 Vortex Kaibab's
10x42 Leica Geovid's
7x42 Swarovski SLC's
8x30 Swarovski SLC's
62mm Minox Spotter w/21-42x eyepiece
Cabela's 65" Professional carbon fiber tripod

 

[hornhunter247]

LAST EDITED ON Sep-18-09 AT 11:51PM (MST)[p]herse my setup, 10x43 minox hg, vortex skyline ed spotter and full size tripod. when your looking for a certain class animal the spotter is priceless! I hike as far as 15 round trip miles and don't want to waste time or miles moving to a different vantage point to try to see if one animals the size im looking for. yes its heavy but worth the weight when you need that one look! the 15's don't always cut it. I don't know how many times I've glassed a buck 2+ miles out, hiked a mile and a half to find out he looked better from a ways off, then had to turn around and hike back to my perch to glass some more! very rarely now! as for the 10x there just a good all around choice in magnification. I don't believe I've ever found an animal with my 10's that I couldn't see with some 8x or 7x but a little further out the 10's are better. imo

 

[fatrooster]

BG, another option to consider is using a rangefinder when you get close to your animal while on your stalk. I used it a couple of times when I was closing in from about 80 yards and it worked but I was longing for my bino's. Although I don't really like being without my bino's, some of you other guys might feel that the rangefinder with 7 or 8 power using one eye is suffiecient. Just another idea for you to think about. fatrooster.

 

[Foreman4x4]

LAST EDITED ON Sep-19-09 AT 12:04PM (MST)[p]BGbasbhat,

If you've never done so, try a 7x42 such as the Swarovski SLC or Leica Trinovid or Ultravid. The view through them is simply amazing! I read once where a guy said it's like looking through a picture window, and that's about the best description I can give.

 

[BGbasbhat]

Nice setup hornhunter. I do understand that it's a PITA to get up and move, then move back when you find out it's a dink. Hopefully, I'll get to that point someday. Right now, I'm just trying to get some more meat in the freezer and blood on my bow!
Like you said, I'll have to take a look through some 7x or 8x to see how they compare with the 10x. Good advice though,".. don't believe I've ever found an animal with my 10's that I couldn't see with some 8x or 7x.." I'll take that into account



"...I'd rather be tried by twelve than carried by six..."

 

[BGbasbhat]

Good idea about the rangefinder fatrooster. It sure would be nice to have a 7x50 bino with a rangefinder (I'll have to check out Leica for that). But, just using an 8x rangefinder for the stalks might be appropriate.



"...I'd rather be tried by twelve than carried by six..."

 

[dwalton]

Two days ago, I spotted the top two inches of a Cali bighorn's horn in the sage at 75 yards. No problems with my 10X42's, I would say they are the ideal power for general western hunting (although as I get older, I've noticed I'm not as steady as I used to be).

 

[az_chocolab]

I started out with 10x42's (Nikon Monarchs) and then purchased some big eyes, Swaro 15x56's. After having the 15's, I noticed how lacking the monarchs were and also started noticing that while I was looking through them, I wasn't really seeing much while hand holding them due to how much the shook. They shook too much for hand-held use for me.

I figured with most (if not all) of my long range glassing I'd have my 15's, so I decided to go with Leice 8x42 Geovids for around the neck binos. I think these are great for my use. 8x can be held much steadier (by me at least) and also give me a bigger FOV for glassing closer stuff. When hunting in thicker timber, the 8x is great. The 8x42 also provides great low light performance. The combination of 8x and 15x has served me well so far.

I'd love to save up and get a quality pair of 8x32's for scouting trips and/or backpack hunting, but first I'll save up for a good lightweight spotter.

Friends of mine who don't have big eyes glass with 10x42's on tripods and do darn well with them. They are able to glass up the animals, but just not make out the detail that I can with the 15's. As has been said before, a big factor in glassing is knowing how and where to look.

 

[BGbasbhat]

great post az_chocolab. My thoughts exactly. I'm gonna swing over to Cabela's today to check out some 8x42s or even 7x50s. Those 8x42 BRFs would be ideal...but, that price tag is a bit steep for me.



"...I'd rather be tried by twelve than carried by six..."

 

[NMRaptor]

I like these because you get a little more magnification without compromising weight while maintaining a similar degree of light gathering and clarity. I agree with hornhunters comment about seeing game with the 10x that couldn't be seen with an 8x. 8x and 10x are basically the same but I'd take the extra 2x magnification because of the general terrain I hunt. I compliment my Swaro 10x42 SLC's with a 20-60x60 Nikon Fieldscope III. This setup allows me to first locate animals and then size them up to determine if they are potential shooters.
-Raptor