B
BomberBlackies
Guest
Just wondering what happened to our far left leaning liberal linguist? After he got his butt totally whooped, haven't heard or seen any of his hateful messages. Whats up?
Cornhusker
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 3,900
Well I for one miss T. I didn't always agree with him but I liked the guy as I do most people on here I hope he shows back up.
T
TFinalshot
Guest
sorry, i've been away busy with a sheep project. . .
H
huntindude
Guest
Wow, that ram second from the left is great.
Sounds like you've been having more fun than you would have around here listening to neocon nonsense anyway.
Sounds like you've been having more fun than you would have around here listening to neocon nonsense anyway.
D
drannan
Guest
I for one like having many points of view to think about. Especially when they are thought out, and well stated. I don't think anyone is completely liberal or conservative, and I like having something in common (hunting) with people I can respectfully debate ideas with. It also helps when they frequently post some really amazing pictures!
T
TFinalshot
Guest
Yea, I agree with you drannan, I am glad there's diversity here on MM! Thanks for checking out my photos too. Here's a couple I took while I was MIA. . . beats sitten around at home waiting for someone to post an opinion i disagree with. . . LOL
BTW, check out
www.glacierparkphotographer.blogspot.com
BTW, check out
www.glacierparkphotographer.blogspot.com
202typical
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 3,123
I missed T as well. I always respect his comments and enjoy the debate.
Nice pics T.
Glad to have you back in the mix. Dude and I have about worn each other out. LMAO
By the way I am in chapter 4 of the David Boaz book you recommended. I like it a lot.
"Thanks climate PhD 202" - TFinalshot Feb-05-08, 02:16 PM (MST)
Nice pics T.
Glad to have you back in the mix. Dude and I have about worn each other out. LMAO
By the way I am in chapter 4 of the David Boaz book you recommended. I like it a lot.
"Thanks climate PhD 202" - TFinalshot Feb-05-08, 02:16 PM (MST)
D
drannan
Guest
Man! More incredible pictures! I tried the glacierparkphotographer link and it wouldn't work......maybe a prob on my end, who knows.
T
TFinalshot
Guest
LAST EDITED ON Mar-12-08 AT 04:58PM (MST)[p]sorry about the link, in my attempt to be tricky, (i'm a computer dumb dumb) I screwed it up and now I'm trying to get it back on line.
I think it's back online, you can check it now. . .
Tony
I think it's back online, you can check it now. . .
Tony
D
drannan
Guest
Now it's working, and it's worth looking! I could look at the "flathead river" and the "lake mcdonald" pictures for hours! Thanks for re posting the link.
B
BomberBlackies
Guest
WOW, top notch first class photography! What does that second sheep from the left score? Looks like a bone and crotch to me.
D
drannan
Guest
HAHAHA!! LMFAO!!
T
TFinalshot
Guest
funny, i'm never worried, but if it were legal, id have to start packing just so that I could shoot some idiot when he pulls a gun on me or a bear. . .
T
TFinalshot
Guest
LOL - Hardway, unless I've misunderstood you, your comment is EXACTLY representative of the reason I do not believe there should be allowed guns in our national parks - people (you) cant differentiate between carrying a weapon and using it.
Legally carrying a gun and poaching are two completely different things, in fact, I doubt there ever will be allowed a hunting season in Glacier Park, therefore, if that RAM were to get shot, it would be poaching no matter if the law allowed weapons carry in the Park or not. . .
I'll repeat it again, if you shot that ram, and it was in Glacier Park it WOULD be poaching, period. . . .
If I missed your point, I'm sorry. Please explain what you meant.
Legally carrying a gun and poaching are two completely different things, in fact, I doubt there ever will be allowed a hunting season in Glacier Park, therefore, if that RAM were to get shot, it would be poaching no matter if the law allowed weapons carry in the Park or not. . .
I'll repeat it again, if you shot that ram, and it was in Glacier Park it WOULD be poaching, period. . . .
If I missed your point, I'm sorry. Please explain what you meant.
T-F,Dont over analize it. I was just givin eel a hard time. I dont want anyone to think that I will EVER support any form of gun control. Poaching is wrong and is illegal, no matter what piece of ground your on. Poachers are criminals and will continue to break the law regardless of further regulations and laws. The anti-gun wackos should re-direct there funding into enforcing the laws that are already in place instead of trying to get new one's passed that only cost the tax payer more and still do not get enforced.
It is every law abiding citizens right to protect themselves however thet see fit. You pick whats best for you, and I will decide for me.
P.S., Great pics. Glad to have ya back.I think Dude was starting to get overwhelmed
"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
It is every law abiding citizens right to protect themselves however thet see fit. You pick whats best for you, and I will decide for me.
P.S., Great pics. Glad to have ya back.I think Dude was starting to get overwhelmed
"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
T
TFinalshot
Guest
". . . re-direct there funding into enforcing the laws that are already in place instead of trying to get new one's passed that only cost the tax payer more and still do not get enforced."
this is the other reason we dont need a NEW law for our national parks. The one we now have works great, we should enforce it and stop waiting money trying make NEW laws! ;-)
this is the other reason we dont need a NEW law for our national parks. The one we now have works great, we should enforce it and stop waiting money trying make NEW laws! ;-)
Again I have to explain, I was'nt refering to unconstitutional laws that infringe on law abiding citizens rights. The law itself that pertains to the national parks is one of these laws and should have never passed. It violates our 2nd amendment rights and should be overturned. It will all be settled soon when the supreme court rules on the DC gun ban and re-affirms what the 2nd amendment truly means.
"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
T
TFinalshot
Guest
LAST EDITED ON Mar-16-08 AT 09:22PM (MST)[p]so by this time next year you should be able to carry a glock 18 into the federal capitol building, that would interesting. . .
Do you support hunters safety courses?
Do you support hunters safety courses?
>Do you support hunters safety courses?
>
Very much so. Education is a very effective tool and is essential in preventing firearm related accidents and also teaching proper ethics. Although like many other things, we as a country have to mandate it. If parents did the job they should it would'nt be needed. Like most on here, by the time I was 12 my grandfather and father had already taught me a 100 times more than you can learn in a classroom in 8 hours.
"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
>
Very much so. Education is a very effective tool and is essential in preventing firearm related accidents and also teaching proper ethics. Although like many other things, we as a country have to mandate it. If parents did the job they should it would'nt be needed. Like most on here, by the time I was 12 my grandfather and father had already taught me a 100 times more than you can learn in a classroom in 8 hours.
"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
I
isayNUNYA
Guest
I don't think they should allow T-final in the park with his purse. He might go crazy and hit someone with it.
---------------------------------------
"I needed a cheesy signature saying like everyone else"
---------------------------------------
"I needed a cheesy signature saying like everyone else"
T
TFinalshot
Guest
LAST EDITED ON Mar-18-08 AT 09:16AM (MST)[p]
if youre in favor of Hunter Safety, and all but one state now requires it, youre in favor of both government intrusion and gun control because without the course you cant hunt. . . go figure.
I wonder about you guys that like to pound your chest about the limits our government puts on our "rights" under the 2nd amendment, but in the same breath you agree to support and even advocate gun control by advancing hunter gun courses and more regulations thereby diminish our rights; by supporting a law that makes it legal to get a license to hunt if ONLY you first pass a government sponsored gun/hunter safety course, you are supporting gun control . . .
Instead of calling me names why dont you explain how it is that you can justify, tell me why it's okay to say NO gun control, but then say, "but in some cases it's okay."
Where's the limits?
if youre in favor of Hunter Safety, and all but one state now requires it, youre in favor of both government intrusion and gun control because without the course you cant hunt. . . go figure.
I wonder about you guys that like to pound your chest about the limits our government puts on our "rights" under the 2nd amendment, but in the same breath you agree to support and even advocate gun control by advancing hunter gun courses and more regulations thereby diminish our rights; by supporting a law that makes it legal to get a license to hunt if ONLY you first pass a government sponsored gun/hunter safety course, you are supporting gun control . . .
Instead of calling me names why dont you explain how it is that you can justify, tell me why it's okay to say NO gun control, but then say, "but in some cases it's okay."
Where's the limits?
I
isayNUNYA
Guest
T-final people like you should not be allowed to be in possesion of a fire arm. Your a nut job basket case.
---------------------------------------
"I needed a cheesy signature saying like everyone else"
---------------------------------------
"I needed a cheesy signature saying like everyone else"
Hunting and the 2nd amendment are two different things. You can legally own a firearm without passing a hunters saftey course since they dont have anything to do with each other. Nice try, but your reaching a little far now. Hunting is a PRIVELEGE and owning a firearm is a RIGHT.
"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
T
TFinalshot
Guest
I'm sorry friend, if you dont see the connection you have really no reason to argue gun control or government intrusion. hunter/gun safty is just the tip of the ice burg, next comes licensing, registration, tracking, and more rules. If you buy hunters safty laws, you buy infrigment and gun control, just be man and admit that there are limits. . .
Hunter safty is most certainly about gun control, again if you cant see the connection you have nothing to fear, there is no conspiracy and there's no one plotting to take your guns.
Hunter Safty laws were enacted by the government to regulate who's in the woods shooting animals. it is an infrigement on our rights, state F&W laws also have gun regulations i'm sure youre okay with that too right?
If youre all for no regulations on CC, then it's okay to pack a glock 18 into the whitehouse or the capitol, or a bank, or the local court house right?
Hunter safty is most certainly about gun control, again if you cant see the connection you have nothing to fear, there is no conspiracy and there's no one plotting to take your guns.
Hunter Safty laws were enacted by the government to regulate who's in the woods shooting animals. it is an infrigement on our rights, state F&W laws also have gun regulations i'm sure youre okay with that too right?
If youre all for no regulations on CC, then it's okay to pack a glock 18 into the whitehouse or the capitol, or a bank, or the local court house right?
RELH
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 17,557
Hardway to argue with Tfinal on the right to carry, is arguing with a closet anti gunner, no way to win, not worth the time. He has the same attitude that has shown for a lot of other so called anti gunners, Ok for me to have a gun and pack, but not you peons who do not have the intelligence to possess firearms.
RELH
RELH
T
TFinalshot
Guest
Perhaps RELH, and HARDWAY, and D13er, and who ever else, you would like to address post 28. I think it is relevant to the discussion.
Like I said, I have a CC permit and plenty of guns. people should be allowed to carry but, in my book there are limits.
Please address post 28; you look even more like fools just posting ridiculous comments about me. . .
Like I said, I have a CC permit and plenty of guns. people should be allowed to carry but, in my book there are limits.
Please address post 28; you look even more like fools just posting ridiculous comments about me. . .
D
drannan
Guest
Post #28 is relevant. Because there should be a distinction between POSSESSING FIREARMS, and HUNTING. Owning, Possessing, and Carrying firearms, is a RIGHT. However, The Government, and Private Property Owners, DO have the RIGHT to place SOME minimal restrictions on the right to keep and bear arms.
I hate that even though I'm a cop, many private properties do not allow cops to carry off-duty. I cannot go to most sporting events at big sports arenas, and I can't carry into some stores. (sometimes I forget.)
The Government has lost lawsuits restricting gun possession during archery seasons, and I feel it SHOULD LOSE a lawsuit about carrying in National Parks, ect. (Tf's purse is fine.) This is because keeping and bearing arms is a RIGHT, However, THE GOVERNMENT IS ALLOWED TO RESTRICT WHAT YOU DO IN CERTAIN AREAS. Like no hunting in National Parks, no rifle hunting during archery season, ect.
It's a cop-out, due to lack of money, that they have tried to restrict firearms possession instead of enforcing poaching laws and any other laws people break while carrying firearms.
Tfinal's post #28 is about HUNTING. The Government CAN regulate hunting, who hunts, where they hunt, what they hunt for, and make sure people have had a hunters safety course. It is NOT a part of gun control. It is trying to teach people hunting ethics, begining hunting techniques, woodsmanship, field game care, and yes, GUN SAFETY. Unlawful Government "gun control" is banning people ANYWHERE, from possessing guns in their own homes! It is NOT a reasonable restriction on our RIGHT to keep and bear arms.
I hate that even though I'm a cop, many private properties do not allow cops to carry off-duty. I cannot go to most sporting events at big sports arenas, and I can't carry into some stores. (sometimes I forget.)
The Government has lost lawsuits restricting gun possession during archery seasons, and I feel it SHOULD LOSE a lawsuit about carrying in National Parks, ect. (Tf's purse is fine.) This is because keeping and bearing arms is a RIGHT, However, THE GOVERNMENT IS ALLOWED TO RESTRICT WHAT YOU DO IN CERTAIN AREAS. Like no hunting in National Parks, no rifle hunting during archery season, ect.
It's a cop-out, due to lack of money, that they have tried to restrict firearms possession instead of enforcing poaching laws and any other laws people break while carrying firearms.
Tfinal's post #28 is about HUNTING. The Government CAN regulate hunting, who hunts, where they hunt, what they hunt for, and make sure people have had a hunters safety course. It is NOT a part of gun control. It is trying to teach people hunting ethics, begining hunting techniques, woodsmanship, field game care, and yes, GUN SAFETY. Unlawful Government "gun control" is banning people ANYWHERE, from possessing guns in their own homes! It is NOT a reasonable restriction on our RIGHT to keep and bear arms.
T
TFinalshot
Guest
Okay, im still confused do you support legal carry of a glock 18 into a the federal capitol, or a federal/state/local court room, a bank . . . etc. . . . .???????????
RELH
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 17,557
I'll answer that one. I can accept restrictions for not carring into the capitol building and courts for the protection of our Gov. leaders and judges Ect. But I also expect them to liable for my protection if they deemed it fit to not allow me to carry and protect myself.
I do not accept any restriction on a CCW for a bank, that is one place that you may need your gun.
As for hunter safety courses, they are in place to insure proper safety and training for hunters and I do not think you can call it a restriction on your right to bear arms.
The restriction on national parks is a out right violation of the right to carry and needs to be removed.
And you are still a closet anti-gunner with your views about citizens not being allowed to carry in a national park where crime is getting out of control due to lack of enforcement on the part of the feds.
RELH
I do not accept any restriction on a CCW for a bank, that is one place that you may need your gun.
As for hunter safety courses, they are in place to insure proper safety and training for hunters and I do not think you can call it a restriction on your right to bear arms.
The restriction on national parks is a out right violation of the right to carry and needs to be removed.
And you are still a closet anti-gunner with your views about citizens not being allowed to carry in a national park where crime is getting out of control due to lack of enforcement on the part of the feds.
RELH
T
TFinalshot
Guest
Okay, youre for gun control. we agree. . .
D
drannan
Guest
RELH is dead on again! Emotions run very high at court houses (parents of victims when judges give crooks 1,001 chances,ect)and I think like RELH the courthouse needs to provide for everyones security once inside.
It is out and out stupid to even bring up banks! I had 3 bank robberies on monday alone, and I can say I've heard about and been to several hundred. NOT ONE was carried out by someone with a concealed permit! Holy Crap thats silly. I can however say that most robberies are not super dangerous, sometimes customers don't even know the bank they're in is getting robbed. However, I've talked to witnesses inside banks where shots were fired and they DESERVE to have had some way to defend themselves! Instead they had to sit tight and do the LIBERAL thing......HOPE things would turn out ok, and that they would not become another innocent victim.
Please post any stories of someone with a concealed permit robbing a bank! I think you could search all day and not find one. I'm ready and willing to stand corrected. I for one am for gun control. WE ALREADY HAVE IT!! Felons cannot possess guns, kids cant buy guns, you cant have a silencer or even most machine guns. LETS ENFORCE THE LAWS WE HAVE! (Thats the standard response from any common sense conservative to a good hearted, but uninformed and inexperienced liberal trying to add another needless law.)
It is out and out stupid to even bring up banks! I had 3 bank robberies on monday alone, and I can say I've heard about and been to several hundred. NOT ONE was carried out by someone with a concealed permit! Holy Crap thats silly. I can however say that most robberies are not super dangerous, sometimes customers don't even know the bank they're in is getting robbed. However, I've talked to witnesses inside banks where shots were fired and they DESERVE to have had some way to defend themselves! Instead they had to sit tight and do the LIBERAL thing......HOPE things would turn out ok, and that they would not become another innocent victim.
Please post any stories of someone with a concealed permit robbing a bank! I think you could search all day and not find one. I'm ready and willing to stand corrected. I for one am for gun control. WE ALREADY HAVE IT!! Felons cannot possess guns, kids cant buy guns, you cant have a silencer or even most machine guns. LETS ENFORCE THE LAWS WE HAVE! (Thats the standard response from any common sense conservative to a good hearted, but uninformed and inexperienced liberal trying to add another needless law.)
T
TFinalshot
Guest
okay, so the "solution" is to put two paid armed guards at EVERY bank, train them on what an authorized permit looks and feels like, and have them search, with a metal detector, EVERYONE that enters the bank.
If they did that today, they would reduce the risk of ever being robbed, so, why have they not done it already? I'm fine with a guy who has as permit to enter a bank with his gun so long as it's a legal permit and everyone entering gets searched. Who's going to be the gate keeper at every bank?
If they did that today, they would reduce the risk of ever being robbed, so, why have they not done it already? I'm fine with a guy who has as permit to enter a bank with his gun so long as it's a legal permit and everyone entering gets searched. Who's going to be the gate keeper at every bank?
D
drannan
Guest
I can't believe you would require the guards to know what the permits "feel" like.....j/k
That is a solution. The problem is that banks are private property and once again, the Government should not force them to do that. In my previous post, I said I think it's stupid for the bank to limit CCWS, but they are private property and I think they have the right to pick who and what they allow on their property.
Thats the free market...some smart bank mgr will maybe decide to advertise his back as CCW friendly, I bet he gets robbed a lot less!
Don't think I want citizens to try to stop a bank robbery, I don't! As a cop I would never try to stop anything unless someones life was at stake, and thats what I expect from other people. My only point is that people should be able to protect themselves if they want that responsibility.
That is a solution. The problem is that banks are private property and once again, the Government should not force them to do that. In my previous post, I said I think it's stupid for the bank to limit CCWS, but they are private property and I think they have the right to pick who and what they allow on their property.
Thats the free market...some smart bank mgr will maybe decide to advertise his back as CCW friendly, I bet he gets robbed a lot less!
Don't think I want citizens to try to stop a bank robbery, I don't! As a cop I would never try to stop anything unless someones life was at stake, and thats what I expect from other people. My only point is that people should be able to protect themselves if they want that responsibility.
T
TFinalshot
Guest
LAST EDITED ON Mar-19-08 AT 02:53PM (MST)[p]if your a cop, you know how easy it is to produce fake documents, and a gun carry permit would be very easy to reproduce with todays technology, i'm a photographer with few computer skills but I could it, thus the reference to "look and feel" of ID cards. . . I'm sorry if you miss understood my reference.
I should mention, the reference to fake ID is directed at crooks, I'm not worried about an honest legal citizen making a fake CC id, but a crook would to to the trouble in a hart beat, well, half a heart beat if he thought it would get him in the door, then what, now you just let a crook in AND meant while your scanning, at a huge expense every person that comes into the bank, and for what? you see, this is orbiting argument, there is no end. . . there just are places that guns done belong, banks federal buildings, national parks and court houses are among them. . .
I should mention, the reference to fake ID is directed at crooks, I'm not worried about an honest legal citizen making a fake CC id, but a crook would to to the trouble in a hart beat, well, half a heart beat if he thought it would get him in the door, then what, now you just let a crook in AND meant while your scanning, at a huge expense every person that comes into the bank, and for what? you see, this is orbiting argument, there is no end. . . there just are places that guns done belong, banks federal buildings, national parks and court houses are among them. . .
D
drannan
Guest
Well I knew what you meant about "feel" of the permit, but still thought it was funny. I think you worry too much about regulating the good guys in fear of something, not sure what. I don't care if good people, permit or not carry in a bank. I can't believe the fear of crooks forging CCW permits is worse then them carrying in guns NOW, without having to "fake" any paperwork.
I'll let this go. I like battin' this whole gun issue around, I care about it, and I'm open to new ideas.
I'll let this go. I like battin' this whole gun issue around, I care about it, and I'm open to new ideas.
RELH
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 17,557
Tfinal;
Your whole argument about firearm restrictions in banks is full of holes. Lets say the bank does decide to restrict firearms in their bank. Even go to the added expense of employing a guard at the door with a portable metal scanner to scan all customers.
At this point you and all other anti-gunners will say this is a safe place to bank at.
Now here I come along, I am going to rob that bank and screw them and their anti carry rules. I walk up to the door and I whip my 45 auto out on the guard at the door and take him hostage and proceed to terrorize the whole bank into following my orders by firing a shot into the ceiling. Demand the tellers to empty the drawers and fill the sachel. If they are not fast enought, I pop a round in their direction. when 90 seconds are up, I make my exit before the cops get there in response to the silent alarm that went out when I popped that first round off into the ceiling.
In the event that bank robber starts shooting customers or employees, I want to be armed in order to fire back when he makes the mistake of concertrating his attention elsewhere and I will get a fatal shot into him.
If you and anyone else trys to take that right from me, my answers is. "Go to Hades" I am not complying with your stupid rules. You can comply all you want, I am not stupid enought to follow suit.
RELH
Your whole argument about firearm restrictions in banks is full of holes. Lets say the bank does decide to restrict firearms in their bank. Even go to the added expense of employing a guard at the door with a portable metal scanner to scan all customers.
At this point you and all other anti-gunners will say this is a safe place to bank at.
Now here I come along, I am going to rob that bank and screw them and their anti carry rules. I walk up to the door and I whip my 45 auto out on the guard at the door and take him hostage and proceed to terrorize the whole bank into following my orders by firing a shot into the ceiling. Demand the tellers to empty the drawers and fill the sachel. If they are not fast enought, I pop a round in their direction. when 90 seconds are up, I make my exit before the cops get there in response to the silent alarm that went out when I popped that first round off into the ceiling.
In the event that bank robber starts shooting customers or employees, I want to be armed in order to fire back when he makes the mistake of concertrating his attention elsewhere and I will get a fatal shot into him.
If you and anyone else trys to take that right from me, my answers is. "Go to Hades" I am not complying with your stupid rules. You can comply all you want, I am not stupid enought to follow suit.
RELH
eelgrass
Long Time Member
- Messages
- 31,940
I'm taking RELH with me when I go to the bank!
I'm also taking a gun with me when I go to the National Park. see this story:
http://www.monstermuleys.info/dcforum/DCForumID5/11690.html
"Fortunately, another adult ? P.J.?s uncle ? in the party had brought a handgun along and had left it in a vehicle that was parked nearby."
Eel
I'm also taking a gun with me when I go to the National Park. see this story:
http://www.monstermuleys.info/dcforum/DCForumID5/11690.html
"Fortunately, another adult ? P.J.?s uncle ? in the party had brought a handgun along and had left it in a vehicle that was parked nearby."
Eel
