SFW yay or nay

wileywapati

Very Active Member
Messages
1,808
As requested in another thread.

Simple yes or no.

For me no.

Don't trust them the bad outweighs the good.




"The future is large scale auction tags.
The majority of the tags should go up
for auction anually. It MIGHT even be
good to allow second sales of auction
tags as in outfitters purchasing tags
and then re-selling them to the public."
TRISTATE 8/17/2012
 
JUDAS!

H!

F'N!

PRIEST!








[font color="red"]From My Smokin Cherry Red Hot Barrel & My Dead Cold Hands I Shall go down Fighting for American Pride & Rights!
I Know I'm Out Numbered by Pusssies & Brainwashed Democrats that'll Throw Their Hands in the air & I know I can't Lick the U.S. Military by Myself when they Turn on us but I'll make
you one Guarantee,They'll be Enduring a Situation where I Hope to Hell All Americans become True Americans once again & Stand up for their Rights!
 
The damage is done. They already have too many of your tags. The bad already outweighs the good, unless you are big$$.
 
So.... Uh.....

That's a yes for the CAT.

Fresh off the SFW CATnip.

LMAO!!!! CAT!!'




"The future is large scale auction tags.
The majority of the tags should go up
for auction anually. It MIGHT even be
good to allow second sales of auction
tags as in outfitters purchasing tags
and then re-selling them to the public."
TRISTATE 8/17/2012
 
The way I see it , even if ,we approve or not, they are doing more positive things than any body else. YES. Disclaimer: being a non resident with a butt hole opinion may bot qualify for this question.
 
Come on ww!

Fix the Deer Herd!

And We'll make you a Rich Man!

Tell me again what other organizations are doing/have done with any Size to it?

I knew if I Posted about the SFW Planting a Tweety Bird I'd get my Ass Chewed!:D

I Told several of you to Step up to the Plate years ago!

But Nobody Listened!

PEAYDAY figures a Legal way for TARDS & Mormons to Gamble & Everybody that didn't/Hasn't Pulled a Tag is Pissed about it!












[font color="red"]From My Smokin Cherry Red Hot Barrel & My Dead Cold Hands I Shall go down Fighting for American Pride & Rights!
I Know I'm Out Numbered by Pusssies & Brainwashed Democrats that'll Throw Their Hands in the air & I know I can't Lick the U.S. Military by Myself when they Turn on us but I'll make
you one Guarantee,They'll be Enduring a Situation where I Hope to Hell All Americans become True Americans once again & Stand up for their Rights!
 
How bout this CAT.

Keep the money. Cans don't grow on trees
Ya know.

Is deer hunting better now than in 94' when
The Capitol was stormed??

Minus weather ups and down not much
But money has changed. Through pick a
Weapon. Through tag cuts. Through the bucks
Give birth theory and now all our eggs our in
The kill the coyote basket. Nothing but loss after loss.

You are correct. If you or I could save our deer
We'd not have to worry about cans or computer
Networks.

Hell CAT we'd be rich enough to move to texASS
And neighbor up with TriLip.




"The future is large scale auction tags.
The majority of the tags should go up
for auction anually. It MIGHT even be
good to allow second sales of auction
tags as in outfitters purchasing tags
and then re-selling them to the public."
TRISTATE 8/17/2012
 
You could be Famous ww!









[font color="red"]From My Smokin Cherry Red Hot Barrel & My Dead Cold Hands I Shall go down Fighting for American Pride & Rights!
I Know I'm Out Numbered by Pusssies & Brainwashed Democrats that'll Throw Their Hands in the air & I know I can't Lick the U.S. Military by Myself when they Turn on us but I'll make
you one Guarantee,They'll be Enduring a Situation where I Hope to Hell All Americans become True Americans once again & Stand up for their Rights!
 
So a bobcat walks into a crowded bar of enlightened souls..........


Please care on I'm excited to hear the punchline.
 
Nay = 8
Yay = 2

One STD and a non vote from 73


CAT I don't want to be famous. Just wanna hunt.



"The future is large scale auction tags.
The majority of the tags should go up
for auction anually. It MIGHT even be
good to allow second sales of auction
tags as in outfitters purchasing tags
and then re-selling them to the public."
TRISTATE 8/17/2012
 
Getting to where you're gonna have to be Famous or Rich to Hunt!

Or maybe both!

Are you really gonna still wanna Hunt when there's nothing left to Hunt?









[font color="red"]From My Smokin Cherry Red Hot Barrel & My Dead Cold Hands I Shall go down Fighting for American Pride & Rights!
I Know I'm Out Numbered by Pusssies & Brainwashed Democrats that'll Throw Their Hands in the air & I know I can't Lick the U.S. Military by Myself when they Turn on us but I'll make
you one Guarantee,They'll be Enduring a Situation where I Hope to Hell All Americans become True Americans once again & Stand up for their Rights!
 
Nay

"I have found if you go the extra mile it's Never crowded".
>[Font][Font color = "green"]Life member of
>the MM green signature club.[font/]
 
There's always something to hunt CAT.

Northern Pintails are / were in trouble just like
Mule deer. Americans are limited, south of the
Border not so much. If saving deer means I never
Pick up the bow again so be it. BUT don't blow smoke
Up my starfish about needing a 25-100 buck to doe
Ratio statewide.

There is a way. People just don't want to do it.
I hunt this success story, either sex for MONTHS
Every year. Habitat is OK, plenty of coyotes and cats
And yet the herd stays stable.




"The future is large scale auction tags.
The majority of the tags should go up
for auction anually. It MIGHT even be
good to allow second sales of auction
tags as in outfitters purchasing tags
and then re-selling them to the public."
TRISTATE 8/17/2012
 
You've never heard me say anything good about their BS Buck to Doe Management ww!

We need to bring Deer Numbers back!

Who the Hell cares if we have a 20 Bucks to 100 Does if there's only 500 head left in the State?

I Ain't Eatin Quackers wiley!

Nope!










[font color="red"]From My Smokin Cherry Red Hot Barrel & My Dead Cold Hands I Shall go down Fighting for American Pride & Rights!
I Know I'm Out Numbered by Pusssies & Brainwashed Democrats that'll Throw Their Hands in the air & I know I can't Lick the U.S. Military by Myself when they Turn on us but I'll make
you one Guarantee,They'll be Enduring a Situation where I Hope to Hell All Americans become True Americans once again & Stand up for their Rights!
 
22 Posts & Zim hasn't Chimed in?

Is He OK?










[font color="red"]From My Smokin Cherry Red Hot Barrel & My Dead Cold Hands I Shall go down Fighting for American Pride & Rights!
I Know I'm Out Numbered by Pusssies & Brainwashed Democrats that'll Throw Their Hands in the air & I know I can't Lick the U.S. Military by Myself when they Turn on us but I'll make
you one Guarantee,They'll be Enduring a Situation where I Hope to Hell All Americans become True Americans once again & Stand up for their Rights!
 
CAT, I got the quacker recipe.

You hit the nail on the head. If a unit shouldn't
Be open close that sumbitch down.

No argument from me.

Worked in your neck of the woods with the Book Cliffs.


"The future is large scale auction tags.
The majority of the tags should go up
for auction anually. It MIGHT even be
good to allow second sales of auction
tags as in outfitters purchasing tags
and then re-selling them to the public."
TRISTATE 8/17/2012
 
Interweb polls are such a good way to hide from reality. What's the percentage in a interweb poll you need to make it translate to the real world?

I'll cast my offical vote of YAY! But I'm easy and always for sale. Show me a better group and I'm in. No shame in this results whore!
 
Posing that question on this site is like taking a poll at a gay pride parade on same sex marriage.
 
Nay

***********************************
Member RMEF, Pope & Young Club, NRA, UWC & DP Hate Club
 
Nay

SFW could have supported stream access. Goes to show you that they do not have Sportsman in mind but have the mind of a bloviated rich man. Fact is if they were for the people and increased transparency, they would have my money. It is a tool used by the rich to fund thier fun.

By choosing neither yes or no you still made a choice to stay neutral. I am a firm believer that if your not part of the solution you are part of the problem and SFW is problematic.
 
So BeDawg, if half your members want something and half do not want it, which half do you piss off or do you stay neutral.


Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, It's about learning to dance in the rain
 
Birdman-

Were half of SFW's members pushing to shut down stream access to the general public? I highly doubt that was the case. If that was the case, then SFW is worse off than I thought. I believe that most rank and file SFW members I have met are "average joe" sportsmen who are simply looking to enjoy and preserve our sport, while SFW's leadership often takes positions that run contrary to its general members and the average sportsman. Perhaps I was wrong.

Hawkeye

Browning A-Bolt 300 Win Mag
Bowtech Destroyer
Winchester Apex .50 Cal
 
Yea, But it's not for everyone, and everyone has an opinion.

I wish those SFW banquets didn't sell out so fast. I wonder what the polls would say at them?
 
Take away the tags and see if they still sell out?? Ask the those at the banquets about stream access?
 
NO,


Poor Analogy of the banquet. I know a lot more folks that choose not to attend than attend in Cache Valley. 450 banquet attendees in Cache Valley (not all locals), 13,000 plus licensed sportsman in Cache County. 3.5 percent of sportsman attending I would hardly call that impressive. In fact at my place of employment 80% are licensed hunters and although many have attended RMEF, Mule Deer, Pheasant Forever, NRA and DU banquets in the last year I am not aware of one that attended the SFW banquet. Why is that?

Here again is a problem with SFW they believe as long as they tell themselves it is ok, then it is ok. Growth comes from stretching and going outside of the box not from holding close to the body.

I wonder if they have ever really put a pencil to paper and figured out if the membership growth is significant?

Simply because they chum folks (me included) to walk through a door at an expo or a banquet I don't believe they are catching all the fish.
 
NO,

BUT Bess made a point I hadn't thought of, Peay making it legal for mormons to gamble, NOW THAT IS FUNNY CHIT!!!

BTW, the other day I talked to a member of SFW in leadership. When it came to the stream access point, he pointed out(and I found it interesting who he used for an example) that Deseret doesn't want dudes wading 5 miles into their CWMU, it would be to hard to control. He is right, but interesting that SFW seems to be so concerned with a commericial buisness and not "average joes". Apparently they are now "neutral", howver, and I told him I would serperate the two, THE DON obviously isn't neutral. Cant help but wonder if Capitol Hill, or the DON seperate his personal opinions from SFW?

NO again!


"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
Just for the record Birdman-we own private property on the Duchesne River and I would gladly give up my stream-bed ownership to allow Sportsman the right to participate in fishing public water for public fish. There is no fish in Sportsman for Fish and Wildlife.

Again Birdman, just for the record I guide flyfishing trips in many river drainages here in Utah and therefore have walked many streams. I can honestly tell you it is easy to stay under the high-water mark in 95% of the Rivers. Of those rivers, if I had to trespess and navigate onto the owners property I would be in the wrong and wouldnt do it. How do I know I would not trespass? I have been in this situation fishing in Nevada on the Truckee River and chose not to trespass when the holes got to deep to wade and turned around.
 
The SFW "problem" is very similar to the wolf "problem"

Do we all wish they had never come? You betcha, but they are here to stay. that's a FACT.

Sure, SFW takes tags, nobody said they don't. But so does cars, coyotes, greedy ranchers, and stupid redneck hunters. That's a FACT.

You should put as much energy into managing SFW as you do whining about something that is here to stay. And that's a FACT!

Eel
 
For those of you who seem to be surprised at all the nays on this site. Go on over to the utah wildlife network, or hunt talk and take this same exact poll and you will see an even higher percentage of people who have woke up to SFW's selfish antics.
Mule packer summed it up with showing how such a small percentage of sportsmen in this state belong to this group , yet they ##### and moan and carry on and flat out lie to change hunting regulations for the 95% of us who don't agree with their agenda in the first place. Total b.s. Only in Utah could this storm ever been able to stand on four legs . After all we are the most scammed state in the nation.
 
>As requested in another thread.
>
>Simple yes or no.
>
>For me no.
>
>Don't trust them the bad outweighs
>the good.
>
>
>
>
>"The future is large scale auction
>tags.
>The majority of the tags should
>go up
>for auction anually. It MIGHT even
>be
>good to allow second sales of
>auction
>tags as in outfitters purchasing tags
>
>and then re-selling them to the
>public."
>TRISTATE 8/17/2012


+1

NO


www.unitedwildlifecooperative.org
 
Nadda! If you want to keep SFW, get rid of the whole leadership group and start over. 1st by putting the North American Model for Wildlife management up on your mission statement.

I wanted to take a scalp,but the kill was not mine.
 
Nay for this guy. But Roy will delete my vote soooooooo......

"When you are dead, you don't know that
you are dead. It is difficult only for the
others. It is the same when you are
stupid"
 
how many of the "nay's" attended the expo at anytime?


Mntman

"Hunting is where you prove yourself"


Let me guess, you drive a 1 ton with oak trees for smoke stacks, 12" lift kit and 40" tires to pull a single place lawn mower trailer?
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-27-14 AT 06:45AM (MST)[p]>how many of the "nay's" attended
>the expo at anytime?
>
>
>Mntman
>
>"Hunting is where you prove yourself"
>
>
>
>Let me guess, you drive a
>1 ton with oak trees
>for smoke stacks, 12" lift
>kit and 40" tires to
>pull a single place lawn
>mower trailer?


Yea I attended the first few but haven't been in years. I imagine it's the same ole same ole.
What's your point?
Are you starting another pole?
 
>how many of the "nay's" attended
>the expo at anytime?
>
>
>Mntman
>

I attend, and I'm a "nay".

If RMEF wins the Convention Tag bid in 2016 and the tags end up going to a different show (ISE or similar)... who will attend the Expo? Anybody think it would keep the same attendance?

The SFW Banquets and Expo attendance are largely NOT in support of SFW, it is for the chance to get the very tags that people are upset with SFW for taking in the first place.

If any SFW supporters want to claim that banquets and conventions aren't almost entirely dependent on these tags, I challenge you to run your banquets/conventions without them and watch the attendance over a couple of years.

If they really wanted top dollar for the tags, they would post them on eBay where the market is larger and everybody has a chance to bid regardless of their geographic location (like all the big-money guys back east or down south that have never heard of SFW). You want to do something for wildlife by raising top dollar... there it is. eBay them up, or do like Jicarilla and do mail-in sealed silent bid.

Selling/Auctioning/Raffling public property (tags) is the means that SFW (RMEF,MDF, etc...) uses to raise money elsewhere (banquet seats, membership fees, gun raffles, etc...). It is the carrot that is dangled in front of all of us, that sadly becomes bigger and bigger each year as we get hungrier and hungrier to hunt the areas that the rich guys hunt every fall.

Grizzly
 
Really, really REALLY good question deerlove. I think we'd all be stunned how many would.

Rational for buying an anti-huntig PETA fund raiser, raffling hunting tags.

1. I can jump to the front of the line, I don't care who gets the money or what they do with it.

2. They're public tags, I'm getting my share, regardless.

3. Hunting will be gone soon anyway, get what you can, from who ever you can, now, before it's too late.

4. I'd support anybody as long as it's not SFW, those jerks need to go.

5. Ya, somebodies going to draw'em, if you guys all stay home, better chance for me.

6. I don't know the first thing about PETA, but if they are selling tags raffles for 5 bucks, I'm in.

7. If they got naked women there, I'm going, regardless.

8. I'm just going to see the naked women, I'm not buying any of there damn welfare tags, I just like to talk to sexy women with they're clothes off. Can you touch'em?

9. Do they let kids in? Geez!

10. Sure, PETA's a family org.

11. I'm just going to meet a couple of buddies from out of State than wanted to see naked women, I never look myself. I hate PETA, those greedy, anti-hunt pucks but the guys asked me to go with'em, so......you know, you guys all know me, I'll "lend a hand where ever I can".

DC
 
>The SFW "problem" is very similar
>to the wolf "problem"
>
>Do we all wish they had
>never come? You betcha, but
>they are here to stay.
>that's a FACT.
>
>Sure, SFW takes tags, nobody said
>they don't. But so does
>cars, coyotes, greedy ranchers, and
>stupid redneck hunters. That's a
>FACT.
>
>You should put as much energy
>into managing SFW as you
>do whining about something that
>is here to stay. And
>that's a FACT!
>
>Eel

Well sweet, then maybe I can get $300,000 to get rid of them like their pal BGF?


"The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun"
 
SFW needs carrots too and they'll dance for'em. It takes carrots, if that's the language were going to use, to build highway fences, enclose aspen groves, transplant deer, grow/buy upland game/ fly to Washington DC, and Show Low Arizona.

State of Utah/Salt Lake County reaches for carrots too, they could hire advertising firms, an PAY"EM OFF with public tax carrots that people from Vernal, St. George, Logan, etc pay into the State every year, to hold out in front of people to come to State Salt Lake City to go to a music concert, ski, see the museums. Why the hell would the Governor and the Major they do that, with your tax carrots.....................................what the hell does a bunch of skiers in Cottonwood Canyon do for Payson, Brigham, or Blanding?

Salt Lake County is using SFW as the carrot to bring sportsmen to Salt Lake City to spend their carrots. You think Salt Lake City and the Gateway Mall gives a sh!t if the women in town for the Expo gives a sh!t if she's from Cedar City, Utah or Cedar Rapids. Iowa? To the State and to Salt Lake Country and it's business it's no difference who brings the carrots to town, it's State resources being used by the State, to raise carrots, that all, eventually go back to the State in the form of taxes.

I know all about the North American Wildlife Conservation Act, love it, thank God for Roosevelt. Beyond that, we agree (most of us) wildlife belongs to the State. Another reason to be thankful. States protect, nurture, husband, grow, reduce, wildlife populations, it's there duty and responsibility. They can and will hire which ever advertising agency they choice to bring skiers to town and they will hire who they choice to bring sportsmen to town, and they pay with State resource according to the degree with which they do the job they've been hired to do. If the States want to use "it's" big game tags as the carrot to drive SFW or any other "agency" THEY WILL DO IT. If they want any other agency rather than SFW THEY WILL DO IT. It's the State's resource, be it tax revenue from you and I or big game tag that you and I collectively own, as citizens of the State in which we live.

You and I and WW know, these social media forums are just pissing in the wind and the wind's blowing toward each of us, me include, and all we're doing is getting piss all over ourselves.

Listen, this Utah Governor didn't start the Expo, he wasn't the first Governor to sign off on the concept and then sign the contract, so we can't say that he is the only idiot on Capital Hill, can we. (Personally I voted for Orlean Walker but in retrospect I really like Herbert and what he's done. I like him a hell of a lot more than I liked Huntsman, the thinly veiled Democrat (imo), that signed the contract for the first 5 years of the Expo.)

Here the bottom line friends and foes, "votes count". deerlove, you do get my point, yes?

If you want to end the Expo and settle for just the other great event, the International Sportsmen's Expo, your going to have to "un-elect" the majority of the Utah Legislature, and good luck with that. Like I said (when I missed your point deerlove), sportsmen will give their hard earned carrots to PETA, OR ANY BODY ELSE for a chance to go to the head of the line. Why do people bet on horses or on 21 or on a seven or an eleven, or buy a chance on an Idaho, non-raffle, big game tag. Could it be fricking, fracking.........human nature, to want to get to the head of the damn line? You find it confusing that businessmen, politicians, house wives, ghetto dwellers, millionaires don't get it? Come on, take off the veil for crying out loud. Actually, you folks do get it, ya just don't like the advertising agent the State hired.

Now.....I look in the mirror and I see what I think is a man of principal. What I'm say is, "I don't have a hell of a lot of trouble sleeping at night, for the things I've done or not done". I'm absolutely sure you, hawkeye, ww, hossburr, and others sleep just as peacefully. I watched a HBO movie called the Hatfields and McCoys a year or two ago. I still can't get the lessons I learned from that movie out of my head. It was, and I'm sure by design, a deadly lesson in the conflict between Principles and Pragmatics. One family, actual one man of "Principle at all cost" and one man of "Pragmatism above all" living together, and not so well I might add. As a principled man, or so I thought, I learned a lot about myself and human nature from that movie. It was a life changer for me and explained a hell of a lot of internal conflicts I've had to deal with, in the nature give and take, in my life. To get my point, you might take occasion to watch it.

Peace to your heart and mind deerlove, maybe someday we'll get to share a camp fire. Won't mind that a'tall.

DC
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-27-14 AT 05:19PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Feb-27-14 AT 05:16?PM (MST)

2lumpy, sorry to say it but your like the 20th person trying to defend the same thing in the past decade. Your rational is a sinking ship. I respect you but do you ever once stop and think that if the opinions and polls are so lopsided that maybe, just maybe you should wonder why and stop, look, listen, and ponder? You are definitly entitled to your opinion, but your the one who started all these recent threads like SFW, good??
BTW, I have been asked in the past to meet buddies at the EXPO. My response is that I would never set foot in that place and live with that hypocricy.
BTW again, the poll on a not so UT based hunting sight is really shaping up for SFW....
http://onyourownadventures.com/hunttalk/showthread.php?t=258202
 
Schmaltz,
Wave of a wand and SFW is gone tomorrow. Please tell me how the sportsman of UT or in general are better. Serious question and with the " bad" you are fixing please include how the confirmed good will be covered.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-27-14 AT 07:52PM (MST)[p]I don't have that much time but I will make it simple as possible. Go read all the old threads where this has been talked about over and over. If if you think that is a smart ass answer it is not because like I said, if a poll was placed here 7 years ago the outcome would be a lot different but guys wised up to the real truth. These topics and "interweb bantering" has educated more than the majority here and if not for the "interweb bantering" there would not be the huge change in opinion.
It seems that you are a minority of opinions and I doubt with a lopsided poll result the majority is wrong.
I am not doing the footwork for you, we have archived threads for that.
I had to stop being involved in these topics and the real truth is it was stressing me out way too much. I am glad others kept on going.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-27-14 AT 10:04PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Feb-27-14 AT 09:27?PM (MST)

I have watched and read and researched. That's why I ask the question. There is no group out there to pick up the ball and run for sportsman. It's just a fact. Set aside the interweb banter and look at actual real life facts.

ie, 1.4 million dollars donated to SFW on the Saturday night of the banquet. Was this person a fool? Only a fool would donate 1.4 million dollars to a sinking ship organization. Those that truly know, know. They understand and are will to continue to give support. Again I'll take true results over interweb banter and polls.

As far as footwork. Well I've been involved in this fight way way way further back then 7 years. To see the big picture you really need to go back many years before the SFW was even a thought. Many years before Don himself had an intrest in wildlife.
 
A confusing and frustrating place to be on any issue that is of great concern to you is to "know not, that you know not"?



A revealing example might be WW's poll, it's heavily Nay, very few Yeas. Yet...........if you read many of the other posts, on other threads throughout the MM forum you see supporters of SFW commenting on various discussions, yet.....................look closely now, very few have voted Yae or Nay on this poll.

Why do think that might be?

Changed their minds about SFW a few minutes ago? Embarrassed? Missed seeing the poll? Timid? Think the poll is rigged and maybe some guys are voting twice or three time, or even ten? Their friends of Nays and don't want to offend a friend? Afraid they'll be on a loosing team?

I'll ask the question again, why did more guys supporting SFW, this week on MM, not vote in this poll?

I haven't voted.

I'll give you until tomorrow morning to think about..................then, the old "know it all" will let you in on the dirty little secret.

Hint...........SFW leadership didn't call me and ask me not to vote.

Night, night.

DC
 
>Oh this should be good....


***Yep, and perhaps when we get schooled again by him or his son they will also tell us why a similar poll on a non Utah site with people from all over the country voting is showing 143 Nays to 5 Yeas. It couldn't be because people all over the country are finally figuring out that the DKP/BB hierarchy are only interested in wealth tags and lining their pockets with taxpayer welfare money! Naw, couldn't be!
 
Lumpy, let me respectfully ask this question.

SFW was the only group to pick up the option
Two ball and push it down the field. All the other
Groups opposed your proposal.

If SFW had been vocal in opposition of your proposal
Would you still be in support of SFW??

We all have our agenda we want pushed, if we didn't
We wouldn't have 10,000 different special interest groups.




"The future is large scale auction tags.
The majority of the tags should go up
for auction anually. It MIGHT even be
good to allow second sales of auction
tags as in outfitters purchasing tags
and then re-selling them to the public."
TRISTATE 8/17/2012
 
143 Nay to 5 Yea from all over the county, not that is impressive. Yet here at the home front, where SFW has the highest concentration of Nay'er we have less than half that many. I'll ask again, who can this be?

In as much as I'm sure you're all waiting, with baited breath, I'm sure, for someone to unlock the dirty little secret, I'll hang my head, saddened that you, "know not that you know not, leave my self self defecating sarcasm out of it and spill the beans.

SFW members do not care about this poll or which ever poll voted 143 to 5. In the first place 99% of them have no idea there is a poll and secondly, the less than 1% that do aren't going to play the straw poll game in a stacked deck. Know this, SFW members aren't nearly as angry, frustrated, seeking destruction or vengence of the Nay Sayers as you all are of SFW. We just don't hate ya.

The dirty little secret is SFW is trying to preserve and improve sport hunting and fishing for everyone. You can de-nigh it, call for investigations, organize opposition, shout it until you throats fall out, my goodness, you can even eventually neutralize and destroy SFW and believe you've saved hunting and fishing for generation of the majority of sportsmen and their posterity but that will not change the fact that SFW is not now, nor ever has been about taking the opportunity to hunt away from the majority of hunter or fisherman and giving it to the wealthy. It is simply not true.

SFW members will not likely be participating in anti-SFW polls. Think about it beyond your frustration or anger.

I've got to run now, we're looking at opening up so more acres here in Sevier County this morning so, YOU can hunt more pheasants, in less crowded fields this fall.

DC
 
Real quick WW, then I got to run, people waiting.

SFW did oppose Unit Management in 1993, again in 2010 (or when ever it was we started the movement) because SFW leadership we're certain it had no possiblity of passing the Wildlife Board. In 2010 SFW was not opposed to it as they'd been in 1993, but they believed it was a waste of time and energy. I came to SFW after 1993, in spite of being very pissed off at them in 1993, I stayed with them in 2010, during the pre-Unit Management planning and organizing stage, without SFW's participation. SFW supported Unit Management in the RAC meeting later in the process, when it looked like it was gaining support.

Would I have left SFW had they opposed it again in 2010? I would have been discourage and frustrated but I don't think I would a have left the group like I did the RMEF last year when they did what they did. Deer prosperity is really, really important to me and I don't have a lot of years left to see it turn around. Who knows for sure, but I don't think I would have left because by 2010 I had learned a lot more about the mission and intent SFW has for all hunting and fishing, not just deer. I am a believer in the concept they are using to give sportsmen power and influence in the community. I believe every thing we do is controlled by politics and if SFW can influence politics by influencing politicians, we protect hunting and fishing more surely than any thing else we can do.

Later,
DC
 
It sure is nice to see a person who is so passionate in what they are doing. It's also rather funny that the person can't see the forest for the trees like 99.9% of the people who have looked at the lack of transparency of the leadership who won't even say how many members the organization has or where all the money taken in goes. Several people at the top of SFW/BGF, and you know who they are, are laughing their azzes off all the way to the bank when they see naive people such as yourself doing all the great work you do while they sit back and watch the money roll in from what was was taken from taxpayers. They weren't content with the tag welfare given them and now have hoodwinked your Legislature into giving them $600,000 of the general taxpayers monies with nary a thing done in return other than some worthless BS paperwork stating how they've kept the wolf out of Utah, LOL! Wow, if you believe in an organization that is as secretive as the Mafia, I feel very sorry for you and your son!
 
Topgun,
LMAO. Absolutely no reason to feel sorry for us. Top, you are not even in the forest let alone seeing the trees. You love to jump into any interweb drama. Things that you really have no true insight into. You have proven this over and over again here on MM. I'm not gonna jump on board and call you names and attack you like many many many others have done. It's of no true value to do that. I'm just going to suggest you not worry about 2lumpy or myself. I promise in the real world and in reality we are completely ok and content, just fighting for a better future for wildlife.
 
>Topgun,
>LMAO. Absolutely no reason to
>feel sorry for us.
>Top, you are not even
>in the forest let alone
>seeing the trees. You
>love to jump into any
>interweb drama. Things that
>you really have no true
>insight into. You have
>proven this over and over
>again here on MM.
>I'm not gonna jump on
>board and call you names
>and attack you like many
>many many others have done.
> It's of no true
>value to do that.
>I'm just going to suggest
>you not worry about 2lumpy
>or myself. I promise in
>the real world and in
>reality we are completely ok
>and content, just fighting for
>a better future for wildlife.
>

***Not jumping in any more than anyone else and your reading comprehension is again lacking because the only thing I stated I feel sorry for you guys is how naive you are in the way the SFW hierarchy has hoodwinked you and your Dad, Birdman, and others into doing all the great work you do while they use methods that 99.9% of us can see through and don't care the least bit for! Hey, if you agree with tag grabs and now also bilking the citizens out of hundreds of thousands of dollars on the "wolf scheme", then go for it, but please know that it appears you're in the vast minority in Utah and everywhere else where SFW has tried to get it's foot in the door and is being told to take a hike because of that kind of baloney! Peace Bro, and please know that the fight is not with or about you or anyone else out in the field doing the work for that wildlife you speak about!
 
Nay!! for SFW and CWMU Program. Hunting was never supposed to be a play ground for the rich to get their way. Hunting should be a great tradition for all.
 
Topgun, It is interesting that you feel sorry for me and others about not seeing the way the SFW hierarchy has hoodwinked us. I feel just the opposite. I am glad to be involved in different processes that are going on in SFW. Glad that I can participated in all that I want. I have seen both sides of the road and like where I am. To give you an idea how wrong some of the things that are being said on here, did you know that BGF and SFW are to totally different groups but do work together. The $300,000 dollars goes straight to BGF. Non to SFW. The Natural Resources head thinks it is great what they are doing. So does the majority of the State legislators. That is why the program continues. What is interesting is how many people from out of state ask how to get SFW involved in their states. Do I feel SFW will expand? no question it will. Do I think that other states will grow in the tag situation that Utah has? I think in the near future they will. I know there are meetings that go on asking Utah how the system works. It has had a positive effect on Utah. SFW is growing and expanding in many aspects of hunting and fishing. All in my mind are on the positive.
You mentioned that money in SFW goes to line pockets of the leaders. I know that they get paid for what they do. It is not as much as everyone thinks. It is a tuff situation to be in. They do a lot of traveling around the state keeping up with what is going on and adding their representation of SFW. Too me it is always in a positive way. I have not been ask to leave when the subject of money comes up and I have been at the meeting. I do not vote, have no say, just a person who is interested in what is going on. At the meetings around I see lots of non members of SFW in attendance trying to learn more. I see other groups joining in with SFW in working to get things done in this state of Utah. Great positive work. Now I do not expect you or anyone else to believe me. If I hated an organization as much as many on MM do I would probably do the same. I may look into it more before I draw my conclusion but I believe my conclusion I have drawn about SFW is a positive one. I have decided not to try to argue with anyone anymore as it proves nothing. I believe it creates more of a negative attitude than a positive attitude. Now all can say what you want. Will not hurt me or offend me. A simple discussion is all that is needed.
 
Those from other states are tripping over themselves trying to duplicate SFW? Try reading the WY ID or AZ forums.
 
Thanks for the reply DC.



"The future is large scale auction tags.
The majority of the tags should go up
for auction anually. It MIGHT even be
good to allow second sales of auction
tags as in outfitters purchasing tags
and then re-selling them to the public."
TRISTATE 8/17/2012
 
One quick reply to the myth that SFW, isn't
Reducing opportunity.

I go back to the DPeay days of "grow a bigger pie"
Philosophy. I've seen the elk pie grow to conflict
In some areas, I've seen and heard "if you just want to
Kill a bull go to Colorado" truth in all of this. I've also
Watched cow elk get whacked by the THOUSANDS
To stockpile bulls.

I've seen SFW flat out end AR-301 and support
The myth of archer overcrowding in our southern
Units.

The fact is SFW HAS reduced hunter opportunity
With no basis on biological need to do so.

As I've said before, I do appreciate what a guy
Like Troy is trying to accomplish, but damn, I want
To make sure that SFW stove is cold before I
Burn myself again.


"The future is large scale auction tags.
The majority of the tags should go up
for auction anually. It MIGHT even be
good to allow second sales of auction
tags as in outfitters purchasing tags
and then re-selling them to the public."
TRISTATE 8/17/2012
 
Deerlove,
Again I believe you're confusing interweb banter and ranting with reality. Those that are truly making the decisions and pertanet are not spending time on the interweb. They are passing laws and such. They are talking to others that pass laws and such. They are looking for ideas, growth and improvement. Searching for better ways to solve problems they are trying to solve.
 
The are very few people tripping over themselves here in az that want anything to do with the 2 mile long lists associated with utah's model i can assure you. I know almost everyone in the hunting world here from the top down in az personally, and haven't heard 1 person talk about wanting this model here, this is a fact!!! There might be a few with tons of cash looking to exploit this new theology, but it's strictly selfishness driven. Most people with tons of cash here are still against this bologna, and think it's a bad idea also. Please try not to make it seem like arizona has a bunch of people wishing this would come true here, cause that's a bold face lie. If anyone wants to check the theory out that arizona is way against this, just look at the reactions to when these groups came here 2 years ago, there was almost a lynching involved. It was nice to see a state stand up for the majority here in az, and be able to recognize a giant scam when it came our way. I guess only time will tell if utah's infection will spread, but the only reason it could spread would be directly proportional to the greed of the people trying to push such an infection.
 
LAST EDITED ON Feb-28-14 AT 01:57PM (MST)[p]I wish there was an antibiotic available for a serious greed infection, and a lack of common sense. I would gladly pay for these groups to be disinfected.......I hope that this thread and any other thread that pertains to utah's infection and the groups associated with the infection stay at the top of the general hunting catagory every day on mm. There's only one way to get the word out and that's to keep it in front of everyone evry day all day. The minute these threads go away is the minute the wolves will be back at our door here in arizona. Keep up the negativity guys, cause it's a good kind of negativity in this situation. Let everyone decide for themselves, even the one's that are still lost. The people need to see these arguments, at minimum to keep informed about the ever changing look of the snake we are dealing with. Just cause the snake has round pupils doesn't mean it's not poisonous!!!
 
Oh....gotcha I didn't realize you were talking about that interweb forum. That makes all the difference. Lol.
 
Deerlove, you can take Idaho off your'e list. Seems like every year a so called " SPORTSMANS " group comes to Boise,and wants to have a " FUNDRAISER" to help the WILDLIFE. The attendence is usually minimal at best, because we are close enough Utah to see what has happened there,and we are not going to auction off our tags, so a group of Elitist can hunt!!!
 

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