A
APBT
Guest
My email - Minus the pictures,
Lately, Others on forums have been wanting a new and an improved Powerbelt that does not have the hollow point, or holds together with heavy powder charges, Ect. The New Platinum does offer better penetration and the bullet does hold up a lot better than bullets that weigh close to the same But, I did a little testing with the 245g Hollow Point Powerbelt and what i used was a screw that fit inside the HP tightly, Marked it flush and cut the screw flat. It basically was an home made Steel tipped Powerbelt.
What i would like to have is either a Powerbelt with a Steel/Brass/Copper tipped Aerotip, BUT, it can NOT have a smooth shaft! It must have the swirls on the shaft, so as the lead starts to mushroom, it will grip these, form tighty to the shaft and continue to push through the intended target. I also would like to have these in the popular, lighter powerbelts that we all like.
If we can't get a steel/brass/copper tipped reinforced Powerbelt, Lets atl east take a look at some Flat nosed Powerbelts that at this time, are only offered in the 444 grain weight!
80g Pyrodex Select, 245g Steel tipped flat nose @ 58 yards into wet sand.
270 grain Powerbelt Platinum with 100g Pyrodex Select "Left side", 110 grains Pyrodex Select "right side" @ 58 yards into wet sand.
Thats a huge difference with only 10 grains of powder. Now how would bullet have looked if the 3 Pellet load Magnum Shooters shot a deer at 20 or 30 yards? This is the range where these bullets are commonly shot by Hunters back East.
I am seeing people on a lot of hunting forums say, You know, if they would get rid of that huge hole in the bullet that weakens them, or reinforce them, I would buy them! Until then, I wont touch them.
I've used plenty of the Hollow Points and Aerotips,'114 of the HP's and AT's as a matter of fact" The aerotips are a step up but they still require a maximum charge of 80 grains Pyrodex Select to keep them from coming apart on closer range shots of 20 to 40 yards.
I was thinking that if you Offered a sturdier bullets such as a lighter weight Flatnose Powerbelt, You would have a lot more happier customers, And without a doubt, more customers!
A couple Options that the public would like,
Lighter weight Flatnose Powerbelt " Only Offered in 444 grain as of now"
3 choices here,
A Steel, Copper Or brass Aerotip that the public can buy in a box of, lets say 50 count, that Allows them to buy their Hollow Point Powerbelts and Buy these Optional Accessories that Will reinforce the bullet and hold it together.
I hope those pictures work for you as it shows a huge improvement in how the bullet holds together.
the 245 HP And the Aerotip simply just pancake out with my 80 grain Pyrodex Select charge. Any more Powder and they come right apart.
Surprisingly, those 245g AT/HP's driven with 80g PS, Still pancake the exact same way at distances from 58,70,100 And even 150 yards!
It is important that they have the "Reinforcer's" that fit into the Hollow Point have the Threads so the lead grips these and holds together as the bullet comes into contact with flesh/bone
What most new Muzzle Loader hunters do not realize is that the 150grain '3 pellet' load was never intended for short distance shooting, It has always been for the hunter who needs to reach out to the longer 150+ ranges. Sadly, This is not a very big topic thats brought up by the guys with the Known, professional names.
Instead, These big names such as Randy Wakeman, Toby Bridges,only slam the powerbelt bullet rather than properly teach the importance of picking the right bullet and charge for the hunting situation that you will be in.
I hope I have brought some news to your attention and hope that it will be look in to. All of us Powerbelt Hunters are wanting new, improved Powerbelts that will help us improve our confidence in the field and never make us have that nasty thought of "What if"...
Thank You for your time and I do hope to get an response back. A lot of us Powerbelt Hunters will be counting on you guys to step up to our needs.
Jonathan
Response from Powerbelt Bullets,
Congratulations Jon!
You are absolutely right! You have just duplicated a couple of our
own tests and came up with the same results. Now all you have to do is
convince 99.9 % of the shooters that a flat point bullet will out
perform a Hollow Point and a speer pointed bullet because they have
about 40 years of magazine articles, paid writers and misconceptions
that tell them different, and the fact is 99.9 % of the shooters won't
buy them!!!!
Believe me, I spent a good solid year trying to get a good lighter
weight Flat Point on the shelves and the bottom line is....yep, your
right but no one will buy them. After a lot of market research on my
part I discovered that the rep's. were right. As the director of of R&D
here at Power Belt I had to come up with a 'pointed' bullet that would
perform like a flat point bullet. Thus we have the Platinum.
We have over 40 different bullets to choose from and there is a
bullet that will perform great for any given situation there is not and
never has been one bullet that fit's all situations. Usually a
complaint
comes from the wrong bullet for the job or the wrong powder charge for
the situation. You are right about the mag loads at close ranges and we
spend many hours informing hunters that a maximum load is not needed
and
not suggested for taking deer at ranges under 140 yards, no matter what
bullet. But when the distance may be from 30 yards out to 200 yards
then
the Platinum is the way to go with a magnum load.
Let me give a run down on suggested bullets and loads or specific
situation which produce excellent results.
Deer 160 lbs and less
140 yards and under ---100 grain charge, 245 gr. A.T. or 295 gr.
H.P.
150 to 200 yards -------150 grain charge, 270 gr. Platinum
Deer 180 to 200 + lbs
140 yards and under--- 100 grain charge, 295 gr. A.T. or 348 gr.
H.P.
150 to 200 yards ------150 grain charge, 300 gr. Platinum
The Hollow Point bullets are designed to deliver a lot of shock and
trauma, will have about 60% bullet weight retention, depending on
powder
charge, shot placement and distance.
The regular Aero Tip will achieve much better penetration as the
tip
of the bullet will push in and then expand and will have 80 to 90%
bullet weight retention.
The Platinums have a reduced ogive which gives it a higher B.C. for
better long range accuracy and also to control expansion with hotter
loads at close ranges. bullet weight retention is 90 +%. Again all %'s
are subject to powder charge, shot place ment and distance.
A few notes: The bigger the game the bigger the bullet. A big heavy
Hollow Point can be very effective for shock trauma and penetration,
the
extra lead in the base will allow the tip to expand radically while
still retaining enough weight to drive it through. The Aero Tip bullets
have a very specific material that is used in the tips that help to
control the expansion, it is not just a 'plastic' tip.
Now, if you can get about 2 million other shooters to buy into the
Flat Point concept for a deer bullet we'll be all over that, along with
all the other bullet mfg's. Unfortunately, the shooters, as a mass
majority, want light weight, fast, flat shooting, pointed bullets that
act like a big slow flat point bullet when it hit's.
We are continually striving to perfect our bullets and all options
are on the table. In the end the question comes down to this....Could
we
make it? and Should we make it? This is where R&D and sales have to
work
very closely together.
Thank you for your information, we appreciate your interest and
concerns.
Dan Hall
R&D / TECH. DEPT.
Guys, Lets get some emails to Dan and get some new and improved bullets out there!
[email protected]
www.GandersPowerbeltForu.Powerguild.net
Lately, Others on forums have been wanting a new and an improved Powerbelt that does not have the hollow point, or holds together with heavy powder charges, Ect. The New Platinum does offer better penetration and the bullet does hold up a lot better than bullets that weigh close to the same But, I did a little testing with the 245g Hollow Point Powerbelt and what i used was a screw that fit inside the HP tightly, Marked it flush and cut the screw flat. It basically was an home made Steel tipped Powerbelt.
What i would like to have is either a Powerbelt with a Steel/Brass/Copper tipped Aerotip, BUT, it can NOT have a smooth shaft! It must have the swirls on the shaft, so as the lead starts to mushroom, it will grip these, form tighty to the shaft and continue to push through the intended target. I also would like to have these in the popular, lighter powerbelts that we all like.
If we can't get a steel/brass/copper tipped reinforced Powerbelt, Lets atl east take a look at some Flat nosed Powerbelts that at this time, are only offered in the 444 grain weight!
80g Pyrodex Select, 245g Steel tipped flat nose @ 58 yards into wet sand.
270 grain Powerbelt Platinum with 100g Pyrodex Select "Left side", 110 grains Pyrodex Select "right side" @ 58 yards into wet sand.
Thats a huge difference with only 10 grains of powder. Now how would bullet have looked if the 3 Pellet load Magnum Shooters shot a deer at 20 or 30 yards? This is the range where these bullets are commonly shot by Hunters back East.
I am seeing people on a lot of hunting forums say, You know, if they would get rid of that huge hole in the bullet that weakens them, or reinforce them, I would buy them! Until then, I wont touch them.
I've used plenty of the Hollow Points and Aerotips,'114 of the HP's and AT's as a matter of fact" The aerotips are a step up but they still require a maximum charge of 80 grains Pyrodex Select to keep them from coming apart on closer range shots of 20 to 40 yards.
I was thinking that if you Offered a sturdier bullets such as a lighter weight Flatnose Powerbelt, You would have a lot more happier customers, And without a doubt, more customers!
A couple Options that the public would like,
Lighter weight Flatnose Powerbelt " Only Offered in 444 grain as of now"
3 choices here,
A Steel, Copper Or brass Aerotip that the public can buy in a box of, lets say 50 count, that Allows them to buy their Hollow Point Powerbelts and Buy these Optional Accessories that Will reinforce the bullet and hold it together.
I hope those pictures work for you as it shows a huge improvement in how the bullet holds together.
the 245 HP And the Aerotip simply just pancake out with my 80 grain Pyrodex Select charge. Any more Powder and they come right apart.
Surprisingly, those 245g AT/HP's driven with 80g PS, Still pancake the exact same way at distances from 58,70,100 And even 150 yards!
It is important that they have the "Reinforcer's" that fit into the Hollow Point have the Threads so the lead grips these and holds together as the bullet comes into contact with flesh/bone
What most new Muzzle Loader hunters do not realize is that the 150grain '3 pellet' load was never intended for short distance shooting, It has always been for the hunter who needs to reach out to the longer 150+ ranges. Sadly, This is not a very big topic thats brought up by the guys with the Known, professional names.
Instead, These big names such as Randy Wakeman, Toby Bridges,only slam the powerbelt bullet rather than properly teach the importance of picking the right bullet and charge for the hunting situation that you will be in.
I hope I have brought some news to your attention and hope that it will be look in to. All of us Powerbelt Hunters are wanting new, improved Powerbelts that will help us improve our confidence in the field and never make us have that nasty thought of "What if"...
Thank You for your time and I do hope to get an response back. A lot of us Powerbelt Hunters will be counting on you guys to step up to our needs.
Jonathan
Response from Powerbelt Bullets,
Congratulations Jon!
You are absolutely right! You have just duplicated a couple of our
own tests and came up with the same results. Now all you have to do is
convince 99.9 % of the shooters that a flat point bullet will out
perform a Hollow Point and a speer pointed bullet because they have
about 40 years of magazine articles, paid writers and misconceptions
that tell them different, and the fact is 99.9 % of the shooters won't
buy them!!!!
Believe me, I spent a good solid year trying to get a good lighter
weight Flat Point on the shelves and the bottom line is....yep, your
right but no one will buy them. After a lot of market research on my
part I discovered that the rep's. were right. As the director of of R&D
here at Power Belt I had to come up with a 'pointed' bullet that would
perform like a flat point bullet. Thus we have the Platinum.
We have over 40 different bullets to choose from and there is a
bullet that will perform great for any given situation there is not and
never has been one bullet that fit's all situations. Usually a
complaint
comes from the wrong bullet for the job or the wrong powder charge for
the situation. You are right about the mag loads at close ranges and we
spend many hours informing hunters that a maximum load is not needed
and
not suggested for taking deer at ranges under 140 yards, no matter what
bullet. But when the distance may be from 30 yards out to 200 yards
then
the Platinum is the way to go with a magnum load.
Let me give a run down on suggested bullets and loads or specific
situation which produce excellent results.
Deer 160 lbs and less
140 yards and under ---100 grain charge, 245 gr. A.T. or 295 gr.
H.P.
150 to 200 yards -------150 grain charge, 270 gr. Platinum
Deer 180 to 200 + lbs
140 yards and under--- 100 grain charge, 295 gr. A.T. or 348 gr.
H.P.
150 to 200 yards ------150 grain charge, 300 gr. Platinum
The Hollow Point bullets are designed to deliver a lot of shock and
trauma, will have about 60% bullet weight retention, depending on
powder
charge, shot placement and distance.
The regular Aero Tip will achieve much better penetration as the
tip
of the bullet will push in and then expand and will have 80 to 90%
bullet weight retention.
The Platinums have a reduced ogive which gives it a higher B.C. for
better long range accuracy and also to control expansion with hotter
loads at close ranges. bullet weight retention is 90 +%. Again all %'s
are subject to powder charge, shot place ment and distance.
A few notes: The bigger the game the bigger the bullet. A big heavy
Hollow Point can be very effective for shock trauma and penetration,
the
extra lead in the base will allow the tip to expand radically while
still retaining enough weight to drive it through. The Aero Tip bullets
have a very specific material that is used in the tips that help to
control the expansion, it is not just a 'plastic' tip.
Now, if you can get about 2 million other shooters to buy into the
Flat Point concept for a deer bullet we'll be all over that, along with
all the other bullet mfg's. Unfortunately, the shooters, as a mass
majority, want light weight, fast, flat shooting, pointed bullets that
act like a big slow flat point bullet when it hit's.
We are continually striving to perfect our bullets and all options
are on the table. In the end the question comes down to this....Could
we
make it? and Should we make it? This is where R&D and sales have to
work
very closely together.
Thank you for your information, we appreciate your interest and
concerns.
Dan Hall
R&D / TECH. DEPT.
Guys, Lets get some emails to Dan and get some new and improved bullets out there!
[email protected]
www.GandersPowerbeltForu.Powerguild.net
