Permission Granted!

S

sageadvice

Long Time Member
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11,849
Over three seasons, i'm 7 for 7 in getting permission granted to hunt when i have asked the landowner. Three times in Wyoming and 4 times here in Kali, i have gained more, if not better, places to hunt.

Why do so many believe it's so hard or can't be done?

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
Well, because most of us hunt in Utah... And in Utah, everybody and their dog hunts, and everybody and their dog wants permission to hunt everywhere...

Landowners who don't hunt, are tired of being asked, or are anti-hunting, or whatever.

I have only hunted deer on one piece of private land in my life. In 2005, a "Mr. Moneybags" spotted two large deer on the property while surveying a recently completed pipeline running through there. $10,000 later, he had the hunting rights to the property. That was a far cry from the $25 per person the old family friend charged us. My family hunted that little piece property for roughly 65 years, and then, money trumped friendship. We never saw deer large enough to spend that kind of money on. That year, we went up near the property and watched this guy's crew wheel out 5 quads and head up the mountain. We spotted a 150" 4 point on some adjacent property from a dirt road below and watched as these guys rode up near it, spotted it, shot it, and proceeded to trespass to recover it. The adjacent landowner saw this from his cabin, and tore off up the mountain and kicked them off as they were cleaning the deer. Who knows whatever happened. But the new hunters tore up the mountain with their quads and killed a buck illegally. Glad our old friend got his money's worth...

Sorry to ramble.

You must be a charismatic guy sage- congrats on the new opportunities you have acquired.


"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24
 
Being the bird hunter that I am and seeing how the best bird hunting is on private property, I knock on a lot of doors every year. I don't know the exact percentages but I would say a lot more land owners tell me yes then say no. I'm sure if I hunted Utah more I would get a lot more no's. However, I don't think I've ever asked to hunt big game on private property.


No estas en mexico ahora, entonces escoja tu basura
chancho sucio.
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-29-11 AT 10:09AM (MST)[p]I think it varies considerably in where you live and what you want to hunt. A person might let you hunt upland birds or turkies with no problem, but completely shut the door on big game. Back in the 70s my Dad had a lease on a 640 acre piece of a decent size ranch in south Texas with several other guys and they weren't paying much for it. They even had a decent cabin on the place. Along came a couple Doctors from the Houston area and they paid the rancher $10,000 cash to gain access to the majority of the ranch. Dad lost that lease and the cabin and so did several other groups that had similar sections leased on the ranch. Texas is one state where I can guarantee that there is little chance to hunt a piece of private property even for hogs without paying through the nose big time to do it. Many have waiting lists that will take years to get on a place and you may have to be a relative of an existing leasee to even have a shot at a place! The name of the game in hunting, just like most other things in our country nowadays, is MONEY. It sucks, but it will just get worse as time goes on.
 
Well Mr Sage,
Your experience if possibly the exception to the rule.

A few years ago, my brother and I called and knocked on dozens of doors to hunt whitetail in Montana. We got access to exactly one (1) place to hunt and we paid a small trespass fee.

I think most land owners have figured out how to say NO.... but in a nice way. LOL

It never hurts to ask though. We've had better luck in Wyoming than in MT. Hunting anything private in Colorado has been out of the question, in our experience.

Zeke
 
I think it depends more on the animal you want to hunt. I don't see many landowners saying yes for deer or elk, especially if it is good hunting. I know a few landowners that will let anyone hunt that asks but I wouldn't waste my time. Antelope and birds is perty easy to find a place as most lo's don't care. I've hunted a few private walk in access that has been decent. Most LO's with decent ground know $$$ can be made and people are willing to pay.
 
>Hunting
>anything private in Colorado has
>been out of the question,
>in our experience.
>
>Zeke

Yup even if they are more than an aquantance they expect to have their palms greased. I gave up asking...

Now when I lived in Northern Iowa I only had a small handful that ever tell me no. I had more land to hunt than I could possibly hunt. Southern Iowa was an entirely different story but we were still able to locate landowners willing to let us hunt.

"Courage is being scared to death but saddling
up anyway."
 
The point of my thread being that it sure doesn't hurt to ask! Granted, i am on a good long lucky streak in favor of having permission granted but anytime, you do get permission, you may be that much better off. Even if one in ten, you still get that one place extra to hunt.

I don't or won't hunt Utah anymore so have nothing to go on there except your opinions which i don't doubt. Colo, never needed private to have great hunts. Cali, Oregon, and Wyoming, private ground to hunt can help your success, often times, substantially.

If you want better places to hunt, don't let other peoples negative attempts stop you from trying!

Joey



"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
It's not worth it because hunting private can hurt your MM reputation. :) You won't be able to say DIY PUBLIC. :p
 
Sage, is this question asking audible or is it beibg asked in your head and the responce, the same? I bought the hunting rights for deer and elk on a piee oc ground here in NM for a very large sum, which is comon for the area. Come opening morning, I watched as the landowner (he was driving) his son and four others (riding in the back of the truck) came toolin in And proceeded to shoot the hell outa everything.
I drove down and asked what the hell was going on and reminded him that I had purchased the hunting rights to which his son replied "I don't give a $h!t what you bought, you can still hunt but your not telling us what to do with out property! I said okay and have a nice day. (I still had $15000 worth of elk tags on the property that I didn't see risk trouble over) Ive never leased it since even though they've asked me too...

Son
 
SOTS---Did your contract specifically state that you had sole access to the hunting rights? If it did, I would have finished the season out and then sued for breach of contract in small claims court if that son was a big plick like you stated.
 
Son said, "Sage, is this question asking audible or is it beibg asked in your head and the responce, the same?"

I don't really remember asking a question other than, "Why do so many believe it's so hard or can't be done?"

I believe my intention was more of giving advice. The Fact of what i said were true enough, i sure didn't imagine getting free permission to hunt...and i do believe what some have said here about their experiences not being so successful. Guess i've just been lucky and ran into a bunch of really nice people that haven't sold out their hunting rights to big money outfitter types! Thank God for that.

I've told it here before but My Grandpa owned and ran the largest Cow calf operation in one small region of north central California. I grew up on the Ranch and was Grandpa's right hand man. The place followed over the mountain range, ran for about 6 miles one way and two to three sections wide depending the other. Plenty of country to hunt and back then, lots of deer on the place.

Every Tom, #####, and Harry who took the time to knock on that ol ranch house door and ask permission, got permission to hunt. Not the run of the whole ranch, but given maybe a certain section to hunt where there were legal bucks to be had. I can't ever remember him saying No! It wasn't in him to say no. Now, if we caught poachers or trespassers, nobody could be meaner or quicker to call the sheriff. That's just how it was.

Most of that property is now a part of the East Bay Regional Park. They wanted it bad and once the Grandparents were gone, long ago, they got it! I moved North and had to find new places and have found them by asking. In my experiences, there are still some old time people out there willing to grant permission to hunt and i found some. Funny, but in talking to these people, it is surprising to learn how few times a year they actually get asked...

Hey, anyway, it's my tip for the day. Take it or leave it.

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
I wish there were places in Texas where you could just ask for permission. Here, if you want to hunt any good property you have to lease it for the whole year. There is no such thing as a "trespass fee" either.


HOOK 'EM!
_______________________________________

Since I am frequently asked about my religion on this site and others, I have created a profile that explains my beliefs. If you are interested in finding out more about my faith, please visit the link below:

http://mormon.org/me/6RNQ/
 
First off I was being facetious, I do believe that people go around assuming that the answer is going to be "no". I have had very good luck asking to lease ground, granted there is always money being offered but even still, I'm batting 1000. So yes Sage I agree with your post or at least I have had the same experiance.

TOPGUN, yes my lease was exclusive, I would never do anything but. No I would never seek damages, the fallout from that in rural NM where everybody is related or at least associated with one another in some way, would be more costly than what took place. I get what youre saying but from what I e seen, lawyers are the only winners in lawsuits. I don't want to run the risk of being embittered person like I've seen others do when lawyers get involved.

Son
 
Roy, Yes, Texas would be a obvious difficult place to gain permission. I'd wager though, that more guys do have their place to hunt from knocking on doors than a guy might think.

Not related so much but Politician and serious Presidential candidate Ron Paul has talked of making more western states like Texas, the land all privately owned. I'd much prefer to keep our parks, BLM, and national Forests as they are, thank you! I thought him a decent chance at the conservative nomination until he verbally dropped that bomb.

Son, Lets see some more of them big ol bucks! ;-)

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
SOTS--- I can understand where you're coming from, but I wouldn't start anything like that if a lawyer was needed because of what you mentioned. It looks like that bunch, if they pulled that on you, knew that nothing would happen against them. So much for a good old gentleman's handshake like in the old days when now even a written contract wasn't worth a hoot!

sage---If you're talking about knocking on doors in Texas it isn't going to happen. Once in a while you might find a place that allows some hunting on a daily fee basis, but most lease by the year and it can be just for the deer season or for all species of animals and birds during the legal seasons for the year. More and more places country wide are going that route at an alarming rate. Also, Ron Paul is nuts if he made that staement you mentioned!!!
 
HJB, funny you should mention that area as i did form a few lasting impressions from several "encounters" with the locals while hunting in that area. It weren't fun. But, i turned a new leaf and attitude thanks to more than a few Utah members here on his site and refuse to talk further trash about some of the folks and some of the hunting of your nice State.

Nope, i ain'ta gonna do it! :)

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
As a landowner in Texas, I think some would be very surprised if they actually went around and asked for permission to hunt even here.

The key ingredient to me would be what is going to make my life easier vs. make my life harder. If someone was going to work with me and help me plant food plots and fix fences and fun stuff like that I would be more than willing to let them hunt my place. If I think I'm going to have to try to spend my time and effort cleaning up after them or dealing with issues then I'm for sure not going to mess with it.

What you normally see is someone asking to hunt without any effort required on their part. They want to hunt over the food plots that you planted in the blind that you built and pass on does or pigs or coyotes and just shoot the biggest buck that they see.

With that said I've had about a dozen folks hunt my place for pigs at no charge and even let a couple folks hunt deer at no charge. I don't think I would ever let someone hunt my place for money. Some have been relatives, but most are just friends.

Now if I get a dozen PM's asking permission to hunt I'm probably not even going to reply to them, but if I know the person and that they are responsible I'll let them pig hunt anytime, if they help me out with some of the planting or things like that then I'll let them deer hunt. I bet there are a lot more folks like me out there than you would think.
 
TG, if i lived there, you could bet money that i'd have a place to hunt. Might not be anything fantastic but thru my plumbing contacts or maybe just some little ranch, mom and pop outfit, but i'd do it cause i like people and i'm not afraid or too proud to ask!

As far as RP, check out the vid!

http://thinkprogress.org/green/2011/10/21/349536/ron-paul-public-lands/

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-29-11 AT 02:39PM (MST)[p]Around here you will run into one of the following..
1:Being outfitted by the owner NO ACCESS WITHOUT PAYING FOR IT
2:Being leased to an outfitter by the owner NO ACCESS WITHOUT PAYING FOR IT
3:Being hunted by the family of the owner NO ACCESS
4:Enrolled in Block Management SHOT OUT after opening weekend
5:Allows anyone who asks in SHOT OUT
6:Allows hunting with a trespass fee
When outfitting and hunting is your states number one money maker nobody misses the opportunity to make an extra buck.The days of knocking on a door of a complete stranger and gaining access to a piece of ground that is worth hunting are long gone.There are a few places left I can get on only because they know my family or we have some kind of friendship going back several years but most of the good hunting has been leased out to outfitters,my own cousins wife leased out their place after he was placed in an assisted living home and wont let any of the family hunt any more,their ranch is now a wasteland that doesnt hold anywhere near the number of deer and elk it once did when the family took a very limited number each year.
Sorry forgot one...
7:Being illegally outfitted by the owner who is a POS and lets out of staters shoot game off his place for years without tags or limits until the MT F&G pulls their heads out and prosecutes them spending untold amounts of hunters funds doing a multi year investigation with the perp ending up with a suspended jail sentence and a small fine.Happens several times a year here in MT.NO ACCESS
 
npaden,
I guess that's why "fee" hunting has repalced "free" hunting. Most folks just don't have the time (or the proximity to the land) to help a landowner for a few days. It's easier for the hunter to stay at work, make some money and pay a fee.

I'm pretty lucky that most everything I like to hunt is on public land. Thank goodness I don't live in Texas.... although I'll probably hunt there some day.

Sage,
Knocking on doors does work but nothing like it did a quad of decades ago when I started hunting.

"The one constant is change"

Zeke
 
Zeke, i agree 100% Here's a link that i can relate to. :)


Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
Yeah, I can't bring myself to pay to hunt someone's land so I ended up just buying some. Not much, but enough for me anyway.

Crazy thing is that I hunted for close to 2 weeks in Wyoming and New Mexico on public land and 1 day on my own place so far this year!
 
Napedan, That's the best way but unfortunately for most of us, beyond our reach. More wisdom, not D&D...


Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
>SOTS--- I can understand where you're
>coming from, but I wouldn't
>start anything like that if
>a lawyer was needed because
>of what you mentioned.
>It looks like that bunch,
>if they pulled that on
>you, knew that nothing would
>happen against them. So
>much for a good old
>gentleman's handshake like in the
>old days when now even
>a written contract wasn't worth
>a hoot!
>
>sage---If you're talking about knocking on
>doors in Texas it isn't
>going to happen. Once
>in a while you might
>find a place that allows
>some hunting on a daily
>fee basis, but most lease
>by the year and it
>can be just for the
>deer season or for all
>species of animals and birds
>during the legal seasons for
>the year. More and
>more places country wide are
>going that route at an
>alarming rate. Also, Ron
>Paul is nuts if he
>made that staement you mentioned!!!
>


Wrong!!!!!

Maybe it is the way it is asked. You will never get anything for free, but if you bring something to the table you will get to hunt.

Time to do work Son!
 
With the very very small exception to a few tracks of publicland, private land will, on average, have by far and away the better hunting. I don't know what Ron P said or that he even said it but I will tell you this, there are large portions of "public land" that the public will never be able hunger foot on much less hunt. How many of you have looked at a map and have seen large tracks of public encapsulated by private with no public access? It's every where you look but don't be fooled that it's just sitting there idle, I garandamn T you it's being hunted and otherwise used just as if it is private by the person who has it landlocked/leased.

Just last year I leased a ranch that is approx 40,000 acres deeded but within its boundrys and largely inaccessible was an additional 40,000 acres of BLM. Guess what I never saw even one time on this ranch? You guessed it-Joe public! So rave all you want about public land but I'd becareful not to put all of your faith in that idea either. Not saying that I'm against, just saying.

Son
 
What you're saying is no news flash Son. I think most of us understand how private can cut off access to public. I also agree that private in a lot if not most cases is going to be better hunting...that's why i try to get permission! :)

I used to patrol 110 thousand acres that fronted the Ruby Mtns in Nevada back in the early 80's. Anybody could hunt the NF behind the private but very few back then would care to use the given access point 3-7 miles away over some of the roughest country around. Only once did i ever see anyone else up there in the public above the private, i had a nice 8x6 buck down, my Deputy Sheriff Uncle and i had permission to hunt the ranch in lieu of pay for our patrol duty's, and was getting that buck ready to put on my back when, much to both their and my surprise, a guide and clients on horseback came around the basin on horseback to visit and chat before moving on.

As you say, some public can be completely cut off excepting drop in helicopter hunts. Seems strides are being taken to improve access in some of these cases. Not for me as that kind of needed access is for the young guys, strong of back and leg but still, i'd much rather see being cut off, landlocked, from some public lands than to have most all of it belong to private and high dollar hunting interests. I believe Joe voter will never vote in a Guy who openly has an agenda to sell off our public lands, It's a death sentence to his campaign, IMO!

Some want to make it all public and wilderness and others want to make it all private property and what that might entail. Leave it as is i say!

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
I have found that if you are polite and up front with people they are most likely going to let you access their property.

My son shot an antelope in wyoming this year with his bow and it ran onto a piece of state ground that was surrounded by private. We happened to see the landowner to a piece of the private and asked if we could drive throught his property to get the lope. he was very nice and had no proble letting us go get the animal.
 

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