Got another goat tag this year and will be trying to find this billy again. What do ya think? Is he a shooter?
http://www.monsterhuntclips.com/video/544/Big-BC-Billy
http://www.monsterhuntclips.com/video/544/Big-BC-Billy
Is He A Shooter?
- Thread starter BCBOY
- Start date
gznokes
Very Active Member
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- 1,322
BCBOY, Are you sandbagging with this question? The stuff you shoot is amazing. I'm not kissing up but your results indicate you are an impressive trophy hunter and field judger.
All that being said I think you are looking at a goat in the high 40's although very difficult to tell because of the shakey footage.
Do you have a pic of your other goat? I remember seeing one of your son. That was a great pic.
All that being said I think you are looking at a goat in the high 40's although very difficult to tell because of the shakey footage.
Do you have a pic of your other goat? I remember seeing one of your son. That was a great pic.
I've yet to kill a good goat. My one and only goat was just a 2 year old billy. I figured after 7 draws in 14 years it was time to just kill one. My son drew his first tag last year and took a younger nanny. I do know what good goats look like, and yes I do believe this goat to be a shooter. I filmed this billy in Sept of 06 while looking for a goat for my brother. If this billy is still alive, with the added 3 years of growth, he definately will be on my target list this year. But then again, it would be amazing to get my 11 year old daughter on her first goat with her Jr. Licence. In BC, Jr hunters are able to use their parent's tags. There is a good chance I might just be a guide this year and let her shoot all my tags. If I could find a goat in a doable area to get her in on it, that would be sweeter than me killing a big ol' heavy based cranker.
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bighornbob
Guest
>So how does that goat draw
>work up in BC? The
>tags aren't too hard to
>get but the goats are
>few and far between?
More then half the province has over the counter goat tags. the southern half is pretty much all on draw and for the most part your odss are less then 5:1 on getting drawn. A lot of hunts are less then 2:1 or 50% chance of being drawn.
Most places should not even have a draw as the numbers are high enough and the harvest does not justify it to be on draw. One unit, for example, that I drew 5 years in a row on my second choice gave out 64 tags this year and only 12 guys put it as their first choice. I would bet only one goat comes from that area.
For the most part 50% of the guys that get goat draws in the south dont even buy tags or even make an attempt to go. A lot of guys put in for elk or moose and throw a goat tag in case they go. Well they dont get the elk or moose draw but get the goat and dont even go.
As with populations some units have more goat then others. they all have goats it just the amount of effort that is needed to get one. The better units (tougher to draw) you can probably spot the goat froma vehicle then hike up. Most of the other areas you have to hike a good day just to maybe see one. In the south it takes a lot of knowledge of the unit to know where the goats are, not just one climb up the mountain and you will be in goats.
BHB
>work up in BC? The
>tags aren't too hard to
>get but the goats are
>few and far between?
More then half the province has over the counter goat tags. the southern half is pretty much all on draw and for the most part your odss are less then 5:1 on getting drawn. A lot of hunts are less then 2:1 or 50% chance of being drawn.
Most places should not even have a draw as the numbers are high enough and the harvest does not justify it to be on draw. One unit, for example, that I drew 5 years in a row on my second choice gave out 64 tags this year and only 12 guys put it as their first choice. I would bet only one goat comes from that area.
For the most part 50% of the guys that get goat draws in the south dont even buy tags or even make an attempt to go. A lot of guys put in for elk or moose and throw a goat tag in case they go. Well they dont get the elk or moose draw but get the goat and dont even go.
As with populations some units have more goat then others. they all have goats it just the amount of effort that is needed to get one. The better units (tougher to draw) you can probably spot the goat froma vehicle then hike up. Most of the other areas you have to hike a good day just to maybe see one. In the south it takes a lot of knowledge of the unit to know where the goats are, not just one climb up the mountain and you will be in goats.
BHB
BHB summed it up pretty good. It all depends on the unit you put in for. I just got my authorization in the mail today with this year's draw odds at 1.3:1. I believe last year this subunit was right around 2:1. The success in the units I put in for is very very poor. If you tally up all tags they let out in all the subunits combined in this Region, they range from 180-220 on any given year, depending on arial counts and nanny harvest and such. On average there is a harvest of 8-10 goats. Not all that great now is it? IMO, they should just open up the goats as GOS but there is a strong fear in the Ministry that there would be an over harvest if they take them off Limited Entry. I personally think that fear is unfounded as most hunters don't want to put in the effort to see success.
gznokes
Very Active Member
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- 1,322
This is a really interesting discussion. I had no idea thats how it worked up in BC.
I read a book called A Beast the Color of Winter by Chadwick before my ID goat hunt. It was a facinating read. He proposes a 5-10% annual harvest rate at the most in a unit. I would say that is what most of the Western United States are trying to accomplish. The result as far as I can tell is if you draw a tag you have a very good likelyhood of harvesting.
I am not asking this as a baited question but why are they giving out so many tags? It seems like they could be a little more sophisticated with their approach. Then again, maybe they feel like they are doing this with selected areas and let the other areas like you are describing be sort of an opportunity hunt.
I'd recommend that book. It was a surprisingly good read. I gained a very strong admiration for the mountain goat from it.
I read a book called A Beast the Color of Winter by Chadwick before my ID goat hunt. It was a facinating read. He proposes a 5-10% annual harvest rate at the most in a unit. I would say that is what most of the Western United States are trying to accomplish. The result as far as I can tell is if you draw a tag you have a very good likelyhood of harvesting.
I am not asking this as a baited question but why are they giving out so many tags? It seems like they could be a little more sophisticated with their approach. Then again, maybe they feel like they are doing this with selected areas and let the other areas like you are describing be sort of an opportunity hunt.
I'd recommend that book. It was a surprisingly good read. I gained a very strong admiration for the mountain goat from it.
A guy needs to look at the map to understand the tag numbers. 180-220 sounds high, but it really is a very low number considering the size of the area. Consider BC is indeed bigger than Texas in area and we only have 8 Regions. They then have broken the Regions down into management units and submanagement units. The subunits can be limited in size to 2-4 drainages. For the most part they hand out 1-6 tags per subunit. So with such low hunter success, some subunits might see 1 goat harvested every 5 years. The goats can actually range several subunits. This is a very conservative approach at management. It keeps the diehards hunting every year and it allows for opportunities for newbies just getting into goat hunting, but it sees very little harvest on the goat herds. If a diehard doesn't get drawn one year in the south, he can just head north and hunt goats GOS.
B
bighornbob
Guest
As BCBOY mentioned its not that many tags for the area. Things are managed up here way different then south of the border.
Instead of taking goat off a limited draw they just up the tags to try and get their harvest. For example Unit A has 50 goats. Say they want 5 goats harvested, so they issue 5 goat tags one year and the odds are 5:1. Well no goats are killed as no one actually tried hunting them, so the Gov. ups the number of tags. So the next year there are 7 tags and the odds have dropped to 4.5:1 and still no one hunted them and there is no harvest. So the ministry probably doubles the tags to 10-12 and odds drop to 3:1 or something. Once again no goats are killed or maybe 1 now but still well below what the Government wants so they once again increase the tags the following year and the odds drop even more. Now that the odds are close to 2:1 they may actually increase has guys see there is a 50/50 chance at getting drawn so they apply and the odds actually go up. But still maybe 1-2 goats are killed.
In the meantime there are a couple of die hard goat hunters in the unit that could hunt and kill a goat every year with no concern to the population but they cant draw a tag becuase they have crappy luck and they are pulling out their hair with frustration.
That pretty much sums up goat management in the south.
BHB
Instead of taking goat off a limited draw they just up the tags to try and get their harvest. For example Unit A has 50 goats. Say they want 5 goats harvested, so they issue 5 goat tags one year and the odds are 5:1. Well no goats are killed as no one actually tried hunting them, so the Gov. ups the number of tags. So the next year there are 7 tags and the odds have dropped to 4.5:1 and still no one hunted them and there is no harvest. So the ministry probably doubles the tags to 10-12 and odds drop to 3:1 or something. Once again no goats are killed or maybe 1 now but still well below what the Government wants so they once again increase the tags the following year and the odds drop even more. Now that the odds are close to 2:1 they may actually increase has guys see there is a 50/50 chance at getting drawn so they apply and the odds actually go up. But still maybe 1-2 goats are killed.
In the meantime there are a couple of die hard goat hunters in the unit that could hunt and kill a goat every year with no concern to the population but they cant draw a tag becuase they have crappy luck and they are pulling out their hair with frustration.
That pretty much sums up goat management in the south.
BHB
