Horn Blocking, New hunters causing old problems

[RedNeckJedi]

New hunters - causing old problems.


This September I found myself in the Grips of an archery elk hunt in the great state of Idaho. I awoke at O-dark: 30 to pack my happy a-- up the mountain. I saw 13 bulls and 35 cows the first morning. The setup on this one particular five point was spectacular. I had the wind, I had the elevation and I had all day to sit and wait for him to bed down. As this was the first part of September, they weren't talking yet. I was forced to revert to spot and stock methods.
As the 8:00 sun shown across my binoculars I began to watch as the five point look down trough the Quakes and then up through the Junipers. The moo-cows were as thick as fleas. So I thought, ?perhaps that is what he is looking at?. NOT the case. In the next 15 min. I watched as the five point gradually started a nervous tap dance. I could see it in his body posture. He wanted out of there. And out of there he went. Slinking up, up, up and over the ridge. With my morning hunt ruined I sat and watched the basin. It didn't take long for an Idaho archery hunter to come crashing up through the basin with the wind to his back. I had the drop on that five point, but the five point certainly had the drop on that Idaho hunter.
I was ?horn blocked? many times all by Idaho archery hunters. I don't mind sharing, but please don't be stupid. Do it right or don't do it at all. That's not to say that all Idaho hunters are as dumb as a post. 99% of California hunters do just as crappy as Idaho hunters. The mega-mart masses are destroying the fun of hunting for the few of us who are really serious. Whatever state you are in, please use your head from now on.


Sincerely
This California archery hunter
RNJ

 

[TCR1]

Balance

I understand your frustration. However, it is just important that new hunters be recruited into the field. Not everyone was fortunate enough to have parents who taught them to hunt as they grew up. I think it is commendable that a guy would pick up an endeavor as difficult as archery hunting and go try to learn on his own. It will take him quite a few mistakes before he gets it (understetement of the year?). I know that I was within striking range several times this year on great animals. I made some mistakes and have no elk to show for it, but I would consider myself a pretty good hunter. Tough lesson, but its about hunting. Next year I will be far better and maybe even have an elk/deer/bear to show for it. maybe not, but then I will have learned more and increased my odds for the following year.

Anyway, I hope you have better luck throughout the rest of the year and into next season.

 

[RedNeckJedi]

RE: Balance

Very true,
But new hunters should not be cutting their teeth on such a thing as archery elk. There are plenty of forgiving forken horns, does and other assorted small game to learn on.

 

[hornaddiction]

RE: Balance

Public land is free for everyone to use and learn on! Maybe you should hunt private property.

Horn

 

[rost495]

RE: Balance

Horn

You are true on the uses of public lands. Unfortunately in this day and age no one cares or has responsibility it seems.

I started bowhunting 25 years ago almost. I would not have dared to take on a big trophy till I had it down on small game etc..... Start at the bottom of the ladder like everyone else.

I'm not saying that a doe is less important than a 300 class bull, but I am.

Example of my own this fall. Had a spot picked out for deer, talked at length with a biologist only to find that the elk were extremely thick there. I chose to go somewhere else. Why pursue a deer and possibly ruin some hunter with an almost 800 dollar elk tag. I choose to hunt where there were less elk on purpose then.

To me thats ethics and responsibility. Things you don't often learn at mart marts or anywhere today. A crying shame actually.

Repectfully submitted, Jeff

 

[hornaddiction]

RE: Balance

>Horn
>
>You are true on the uses
>of public lands. Unfortunately
>in this day and age
>no one cares or has
>responsibility it seems.
>
>I started bowhunting 25 years ago
>almost. I would not
>have dared to take on
>a big trophy till I
>had it down on small
>game etc..... Start at the
>bottom of the ladder like
>everyone else.
>
>I'm not saying that a doe
>is less important than a
>300 class bull, but I
>am.
>
>Example of my own this fall.
> Had a spot picked
>out for deer, talked at
>length with a biologist only
>to find that the elk
>were extremely thick there.
>I chose to go somewhere
>else. Why pursue a
>deer and possibly ruin some
>hunter with an almost 800
>dollar elk tag. I
>choose to hunt where there
>were less elk on purpose
>then.
>
>To me thats ethics and responsibility.
> Things you don't often
>learn at mart marts or
>anywhere today. A crying
>shame actually.
>
>Repectfully submitted, Jeff



I couldnt agree with you more Jeff, but the problem I see with the above post is. Just because a hunter makes a mistake doesnt mean he is a greenhorn! And who says it was a mistake where I come from the wind changes everytime that you turn around. So maybe that hunter was headed to the special spot that he picked out not even knowing the other hunter was there. The wind could of been at his face and then suddenly changed direction! Its not that hunters job to find out where everyone is hunting on public land. I have had millions of hunters walk past me while I have been hunting and sure it makes me mad.But then I relize thats the chance you take on public ground. I am not trying to piss anyone off but I think people jump to the wrong conclusion before they know all the facts!

Horn

 

[rost495]

RE: Balance

Horn

Touche~ You are too right. I am still aggravated with those that bust up the hill creating much noise and scaring everything around. And I think that was what we were talking about. The general ignorance of most folks nowdays. And that can breed stupidity that passes itself on seemingly.

Anyway one flaw of the internet is that you cannot impose inflection to the conversation. It has no color and is just black and white. What I read into things or try to type into things just may or may not come across- wrong or right.

So on counts I say we are probably both right in certain circumstances.

Which reminds me of the hunt last week. Seemed like I could walk all 4 points of the compass and regardless how much I jockeyed the only wind I could semi rely on was regular thermals. And with the hot/cold/sunny/rainy/etc.. weather the thermals were predictable, but definitely not on a set schedule. Yep way too much wind at my neck no matter how hard I tried. Guess its why the book deer decided to live where he was!

Regards, Jeff

 

[supersider34]

RE: Balance

I hunt in a canyon that have not seen anyone else in since I have hunted it. This year I found 8 guys from out of state hunting in it that have never hunted elk before. 2 of them have and I called them into to me. I went to there camp and talked with them so we all could work the canyon together. I gave them all the info I knew about this canyon even though I gave out my secrets on where they bed and where they go. I wanted to be on the same page with them. It was a much easier hunt with them so we where not working each other. Why get mad at someone for trying to learn a new sport. They where a great bunch of guys. 2 will be coming back to hunt with me next year. So to condemn some guys for hunting then I guess no one will ever take up elk hunting as you have to start somewhere.

 

[BOHNTR]

RE: Balance

supersider34:

Good post, I agree! We ALL started at one point. If one must absolutely be away from people then hike deeper in the woods or learn to use them to your advantage. JMO

BOHNTR )))---------->

 

[TCR1]

First year myself

Well this was my first year archery hunting elk also. I half-heartedly hunted for mulies in wyoming about 3 years ago, and took an archery antelope there 5 years ago, but that was my only big game success with a bow. I hunted whitetail with a bow for 4 years in Pennsylvania previous to that. That is not to say I didn't have opportunities on animals, but they were always of the wrong sex. Does with buck tags usually.

This year, I picked an area, used maps, applied for an either sex license, poured over maps, and then trusted my instincts. I am what some of you like ot refer to as a "weekend warrior". That means that I only was able to hunt weekends. But, in the 3 days I was actually able to hunt this year, I was able to set up and had shot opportunities on 6 different elk. Granted, if any of you had been in my place, there would be a huge 6x6 at your taxadermists shop, but hey, maybe he'll be bigger next year (not that he would fit on any of my walls anyway). I know I will be far better, though!

Oh, by the way, I didn't see anyone else hunting that area I was in until the last day I hunted. Another two hunters were in the area. 1 guy had tagged out earlier and his buddy took off after an elk. I talked to him for a while on the main trail and he said he would keep calling on the trail. His help gave me the shot at that huge monster. You never know much about a person until you talk to them. I only wish I could have thanked him for the expereince afterward.

 

[GoJuRyuGoDan]

LAST EDITED ON Oct-21-04 AT 08:22AM (MST)[p]It is a difficult problem ,yes,one of the reasons I travel far to avoid crowds, but I cannot always do that.
I have had more Elk sneaks ruined by friggin Mule Dear Does , than hunters of any origin.
I avoid machines and the roads/trails that they travel. and yet there is it seems always something to work around/into the equation.
One case in my recent hunt , I snuk (sneaked?)
over 2 miles , was closing on a 6x6 , noticed every elk, dear , and coyote looking across the coulee, they spotted 2 hunters and a truck for me,a mile away, these guys were going away so no problem,I thought, so I closed in , wind in my favor, got to under 20 yards, arrow nocked, locked and loaded, so what happened ?
The bull instead of staying where he was came towards me, in cover I couldn't shoot through, all I could clearly see was horns and eyes. BUSTED.
whose fault? ............no fault.
It doesn't always go the way you need it to.Thats hunting!!
Accept your dissapointments as part of the sport and privlige of hunting, learn from your mistakes, forgive the locals that didn't know you were on the bull of your life time, they may have been sneaking of one of their own.
If you need success all the time take up a less challenging persuit!
B

 

[rost495]

Not everything has a fault. I agree. I just hoped that this brought to the surface the fact that there are lots of mart mart hunters running around without a clue.

I don't need to harvest to have a good hunt. Your hunt would have made me happy. What I hate to see is that everytime I get going on something, there are folks that think hunting is just blindly walking, covering as much ground as they can.

I"ll bite my tongue though.

 

[kicker]

Hell i'm an idaho native and i never ever hunt unless the wind is in my face! I also take a survey of the area i plan to hunt to make sure that there are no other hunters within 1 mile of me. Also if the elk aren't bugling yet i stay at home so as not to accidentaly spook an out of state hunters five point. Not all idaho hunters are dumb enough to do what that hunter did, but sometimes you will run into blatant bad hunting ethics. Sorry you had such an upsetting run in while in our state. Good luck next time!!!

p.s. I find that posting signs at the base of canyons that say, "this is mine to hunt today-stay out!" work really well. Unless of course those idahoans can't read.

 

[frkybugleboy]

>
>p.s. I find that posting signs
>at the base of canyons
>that say, "this is mine
>to hunt today-stay out!" work
>really well. Unless of course
>those idahoans can't read.


Hey Kicker,

Why stop there? I would post signs around the entire unit claiming hunting grounds! In fact, why not just purchase every tag available for the unit you wish to claim. Better yet, if you spot and tag your animal you wish to hunt early in the year mark it with a big sign saying "DO NOT SHOOT, THIS IS KICKER'S BULL". Ethics in laying claim to a canyon and telling people to stay out? hmmmm, good luck with that if your hunting public land. Don't get me wrong, If I see a 4wheeler or some indication of other hunters in an area I will always back out and go to plan B. But a sign telling people to "stay out" is a bit arrogant. Several times I have been working a good bull and in seamingly perfect position when some other hunter gets up wind a messes it up. Nothing you can do about it but move on and have fun! Thats just part of hunting on public land anymore.

 

[Smiley]

for the few
>of us who are really
>serious.
If you were "really serious" do you really think you would have had an unexperienced hunter interfearing with you , after all you must have been 4-5 miles in if you are real serious, maybe he was busting ass to try to get ahead of his elk that he had put months of scouting into .
And then to try to implie that all it was all Idaho archery hunters , now if I took your mentality I would be thinking it was just another californicator up on the mountain thinking it was his mountain since he brought his left coast bucks to poor old Idaho .
Come to think of it since I have been in Idaho and hunted a certain farmers ground 4 of the last 6 years has led to a Californian resident shooting atleast one of his cows .
So I ask is it something taught to all you guys from Cali .
I dont think so .