Getting started in Idaho - Looking at Salmon-Pioneer Muleys

[HanktheTankSB]

LAST EDITED ON Jul-30-13 AT 11:28AM (MST)[p]Full disclosure so I don't offend anyone on here. This is my first post on this site, I'm a regular on www.theoutdoorsforum.com/forums/ but I'm looking for an out of state mule deer hunt this year and decided on Idaho. Been doing some searching and lurking the last couple of months and this seems like a good place for Idaho hunters.

Quick intro: I generally have a budget, vacation time, and family pass for one "bigger" hunt each year. Of course this is in addition to chasing deer, quail, ducks and pigs throughout the year in my local stomping grounds in Central Coast California. Last year it was two weeks in Mexico for quail and pheasant and I've done pig hunts, late season deer, backpack hunts, etc. (all in sunny So Cal). I generally hunt about 40 days a year.

So for the past few months I've been looking into an out of state mule deer hunt. Based on the research I've done through state websites, forums like this and a stack of hunting magazines I've accumulated over the years, it seemed that Idaho fit my criteria, mainly because you can get an OTC tag with pretty good success rates. Two friends and I applied for a controlled hunt but didn't get drawn so it's OTC for us.

From the stats on Idaho's website (which by the way is impressive compared to what I've seen in CA) I found the Salmon-Pioneer area to have good success without huge crowds. I'd prefer to get away from the crowds but don't have horses to pack in so depending on weather we'd either hike in and spike camp or day hunt from truck camp. Looking at areas 36A, 36B and 37 specifically and still trying to comprehend the terrain from GoogleEarth and the maps on Idaho's website. I'm having a hard time determining if the roads in these areas are year round, but if so, it seems that they have a decent amount, without crisscrossing the whole unit, that we can drive to within a day's hike of decent hunting areas.

Is it wise for an Idaho first timer to DIY? Camp vs. hotels vs. packing in? If you are traveling from CA, do you plan on being there opening day vs watching the weather as we can do for hunts closer to home? This may be less of a point since the areas I'm looking at have only 2 week seasons and we're planning on hunting 7 days.

After scouring some of the archives on here I realize some posters are very apprehensive about sharing any info to a newcomer, I understand and I won't be offended if you don't respond. I'm not looking for your hunting spots, just hoping for a couple opinions, maybe some tips so that we make sure we enjoy our hunt, stay safe, see some deer, and if we're lucky take home some venison.

Here's my lab and I at the end of a great quail hunt with my wife last year.

 

[dreaminbouthuntin]

Here is a question:

If you are just wanting Venison, why not hunt the whitetail doe hunts or archery?
Why hunt units like the Lemhi for a meat buck when they are in short supply anyway?
You could wait until November and hunt the short range weapon for whitetails if you just want venison.

The central mountains is not where I would go if I'm looking for meat.
Several reasons.

1. Mule Deer numbers are hurting due to OTC hunts and wolves.

2. Its the toughest country to hunt in Idaho IMO. Its pretty though, dang pretty.

3. Grab a couple wolf tags while your at it. You want to help the deer and elk up there?? Shoot a damn wolf.

4. There are better tags towards N. Idaho for Whitetails for meat.

Word to the wise, is rough country. Dang rough. The roads are pretty crappy as well. Especially when wet. That clay ground is like snot when it gets wet. Rocks are plenty too, 10 ply tires are a must unless you want to chance a blow out.

Another thing to think about is the fires from last year drove hundreds of hunters out of neighboring units and pushed them into the Lemhi. Expect the same this year until the units recover. Those units you mentioned saw terrible fires last year. They didnt stop burning until the snow hit.

I just dont get why someone would shoot a forky if your just wanting meat. There are units where you can shoot a doe for meat. Doe's taste way better.

Personally, I go to Wyoming for deer meat. Hunt whitetail doe's. They have alot of units where it's unlimited whitetail doe tags for close to 3 months.

I try to do my part as well as I can to help the deer and elk herds in Idaho by being selective where I hunt and what I hunt.

I have hunted that country for 20 years. However the last 6 I have not hunted deer due to the lack of Muleys. If fish and game cant figure it out, I'll do my part and not shoot one up there.
Too many doe's fawns arent making it through the first year. Blame it on over hunting and the wolves.

Yes, there are alot of wolves up there. They went MIA for 3 years after fish and game took out a pack of ten, but the have moved back in and are making their presence known. Well known.

Good luck on whatever you choose. Watch the weather, it will change in a heartbeat. One minute sunny and 60, the next it could snow. Prepare accordingly.

 

[brdhuntr]

Hank to answer some of your'e questions yes the country is pretty rough,but still very huntable. Like has been said it is pretty breath taking and you have a fair chance at killing a wolf.It is also mostly all goverment land,and should'nt have many tresspassing issues except in the lowlands.Definately alot of areas to camp with tenting or trailering.I would bring quads, but check the trail closures,and it looks like you are in shape to handle the country, i would get some extra gym time in,and work on your'e leg strength,and cardio. I would invest in a good pack, i use the Eberestock J-134,they can pack a boned deer,and i use mine mainly for Elk. The elevation can be 6-9000 feet and coming from sea level takes getting used to.As you know the harvest in those units ranged from 30 to 40%, and coming from a state where the average is about 8% on a good year you should'nt have any problem getting game. Challis is a decent small town that has clean rooms and fair food if you need to clean up. Good luck and good hunting!!

 

[HanktheTankSB]

dreaminbouthuntin - thanks for the info about the fires and the hunters moving around, good points. My hunting partner was suppose to call the biologist and get that kind of info so this is news to me and very relevant.

As far as meat goes, whitetail hunting really hasn't been on my radar since I really dig the muley country and appreciate the opportunity to hunt for a mature muley buck. All the hunting shows where a guy shoots a WT from a tree has skewed my impression.

I hear you about the mule deer numbers hurting. IMHO one of the best contributions our party can do is by purchasing 3 more NR deer tags, licenses, wolf tags, and other local costs, and continuing to contribute to conservation efforts (I do my part year round). And if it works out, count us in as continuing to do so for years to come.

That being said, we haven't inked anything yet, so if numbers/habitat dictate otherwise, we'll look at other units in Idaho. Still trying to stay away from the big crowds.

We will definitely have wolf tags (can take the hint at only $30 a pop!) and would love the opportunity to harvest a wolf.

 

[HanktheTankSB]

brdhuntr - the Idaho website is awesome, one reason is they show units property ownership (very detailed). I'm used to "slumming" it on CA public land, I think ID public land will be a big step up. One guy I'm going with has actually vacationed in ID a bit and has us pumped up for some great scenery and land.

I have a quad but the other guys don't so I think we'll leave it behind and stick to hiking, but who knows. Been running 25 miles per week to get in shape for this and to keep my shorthair sane in the offseason.

There are a couple items on my shopping list, a pack is #1. I have backpack hunted some in CA, but you can imagine a much lighter camp/meat. Think 90 degree temps...

Thanks for the info.

 

[brdhuntr]

Yeah sounds like you guys will not really need a quad,you should be able to pack your'e meat out with no problem. I would definately always try to hunt up hill if possible,and not do what my son in law and i did last year and shoot two Bulls down hill! That was a pack but alot of memories. Also i would have you're guns sighted for 300 yds. That can be some long shots,and alot different that probably what you are used to. We hunt unit 48 and 49 for Deer and Elk,which is the same terrain,and we find that 300 yards is about right. I was raised in the central valley,and remember hunting the central coast Paso Robles area for Blacktails and Bandtails when the limit was 8 birds! I've lived in Boise for 42 years,and love it..

 

[dreaminbouthuntin]

>dreaminbouthuntin - thanks for the info
>about the fires and the
>hunters moving around, good points.
> My hunting partner was
>suppose to call the biologist
>and get that kind of
>info so this is news
>to me and very relevant.
>
>
>As far as meat goes, whitetail
>hunting really hasn't been on
>my radar since I really
>dig the muley country and
>appreciate the opportunity to hunt
>for a mature muley buck.
> All the hunting shows
>where a guy shoots a
>WT from a tree has
>skewed my impression.
>
>I hear you about the mule
>deer numbers hurting. IMHO one
>of the best contributions our
>party can do is by
>purchasing 3 more NR deer
>tags, licenses, wolf tags, and
>other local costs, and continuing
>to contribute to conservation efforts
>(I do my part year
>round). And if it
>works out, count us in
>as continuing to do so
>for years to come.
>
>That being said, we haven't inked
>anything yet, so if numbers/habitat
>dictate otherwise, we'll look at
>other units in Idaho.
>Still trying to stay away
>from the big crowds.
>
>We will definitely have wolf tags
>(can take the hint at
>only $30 a pop!) and
>would love the opportunity to
>harvest a wolf.

i'm not sure what gave you the impression we hunt from tree stands. out west, we dont. we hunt them just like muleys and in the same country.
you're talking about hunting the central mountains.. but there are alot of whitetail, way more than muleys in the same area.
if i were you, i'd hunt the whitetails in the central mountains. look closer at the success rates. they dont distinguish the two species in the hunt success rates.
the success your seeing lies with the white tail in those units.

the 4 point or larger bucks... all whitetails. no mulies are recorded in the success because none were harvested.

fish and game is fudging the numbers and adding both species together.

not trying to rain on your parade, just stating some cold facts about the numbers. in the Pashimori valley, there are alot of whitetail you hunt just like mule deer.

no tree stands, out in the mountains. this isnt the east.

 

[brdhuntr]

>>dreaminbouthuntin - thanks for the info
>>about the fires and the
>>hunters moving around, good points.
>> My hunting partner was
>>suppose to call the biologist
>>and get that kind of
>>info so this is news
>>to me and very relevant.
>>
>>
>>As far as meat goes, whitetail
>>hunting really hasn't been on
>>my radar since I really
>>dig the muley country and
>>appreciate the opportunity to hunt
>>for a mature muley buck.
>> All the hunting shows
>>where a guy shoots a
>>WT from a tree has
>>skewed my impression.
>>
>>I hear you about the mule
>>deer numbers hurting. IMHO one
>>of the best contributions our
>>party can do is by
>>purchasing 3 more NR deer
>>tags, licenses, wolf tags, and
>>other local costs, and continuing
>>to contribute to conservation efforts
>>(I do my part year
>>round). And if it
>>works out, count us in
>>as continuing to do so
>>for years to come.
>>
>>That being said, we haven't inked
>>anything yet, so if numbers/habitat
>>dictate otherwise, we'll look at
>>other units in Idaho.
>>Still trying to stay away
>>from the big crowds.
>>
>>We will definitely have wolf tags
>>(can take the hint at
>>only $30 a pop!) and
>>would love the opportunity to
>>harvest a wolf.
>
>i'm not sure what gave you
>the impression we hunt from
>tree stands. out west, we
>dont. we hunt them just
>like muleys and in the
>same country.
>you're talking about hunting the central
>mountains.. but there are alot
>of whitetail, way more than
>muleys in the same area.
>
>if i were you, i'd hunt
>the whitetails in the central
>mountains. look closer at the
>success rates. they dont distinguish
>the two species in the
>hunt success rates.
>the success your seeing lies with
>the white tail in those
>units.
>
>the 4 point or larger bucks...
>all whitetails. no mulies are
>recorded in the success because
>none were harvested.
>
>fish and game is fudging the
>numbers and adding both species
>together.
>
>not trying to rain on your
>parade, just stating some cold
>facts about the numbers. in
>the Pashimori valley, there are
>alot of whitetail you hunt
>just like mule deer.
>
>no tree stands, out in the
>mountains. this isnt the east.
>


I would get on the IDF&G web site and check the harvest numbers. The percentages are broken down for both species,and you can determine which unit has the most Mulies. Most of the Whitetails are found on private property,and yes you hunt them like Mulies. Good luck..

 

[HanktheTankSB]

I understand the western whitetails aren't hunted from tree stands, like I said, the typical shows you see on cable taint the picture. If I end up swarmed with whitetails in the "muley country" I'd be happy to drop the hammer on one.

When I was poking around the IDFG website stats earlier in the year the whitetail percentages in these areas were low, for areas 36A and 36B the % of WT to total averaged 4.7% between 2009 & 2011. I just rechecked the IDFG stats and 2012 numbers show 21.7 and 10.3!! Big change!

I did a lot of reviewing the stats for the GMAs and my criteria was low hunter numbers, low WT %, good success rates and %4/5pts. Then I eliminated the wilderness areas since we are without horses or mules and looked for areas that had a good majority of public land. That's how I came up with these areas, but they're not set in stone and I'm all ears!

It seems like there are better areas near Boise for mule deer but it just seems like you're dealing with a lot of crowds in those areas.