Dream Unit for Deer

[tracker12]

What would you classify as the dream unit for Mule deer in WY. I did not plan to do a Mule deer hut this year but hate to just put in for a point. I would like to put in for ma once in a life time draw area just in case I get luck and draw on the random. Any suggestions.

 

[pymulies]

Just buy a point

py

 

[tracker12]

Boy that was a productive post.

 

[Rambo]

>What would you classify as the
>dream unit for Mule deer
>in WY. I did
>not plan to do a
>Mule deer hut this year
>but hate to just put
>in for a point.
>I would like to put
>in for ma once in
>a life time draw area
>just in case I get
>luck and draw on the
>random. Any suggestions.

If you could hunt region G by yourself ( no other tag holders) and scout via plane all summer, that would be a "dream hunt!"


[font face="verdana" color="green"] Ni' Baolach don olcas mise...

 

[ForkWest]

Wyoming is funny that way isn't it. There really isn't one banner unit or two that's stands above all others like some of the other states.

It all depends on what type of country you want to hunt, and what type of overall texperience you want.

If you know how to hunt and DIY high country is your thing than you'll probably want to go G, but that's a gneral tag, and you'll proabaly draw. Rugged wilderness horeback and fully guided, some of the Cody area limited units. High sage, easier terrain out of your truck and a hotel, maybe 102. Late season migration/rut, maybe 128.

They're really isn't just one banner unit, say likg the Henry's of Utah or Colorado 44.

 

[tracker12]

I have hunted a lot North of Craig CO and was thinking 101 or 102. This would be a solo DIY hunt. No horses just truck and boots.

 

[30Hart]

As you have found there's isn't one in Wyoming currently like the Henry's in Utah or the Strip in Arizona...plenty of good areas but no great ones...sorry. That being said Book Bucks come out of General units in Wyoming just can't count on it.

 

[nontypical]

If your "dream" unit includes bucks that score over 200, I'd be scratching 101 and 102 off that list...

Not saying you couldn't find one. Just don't be expecting it...

 

[tracker12]

I'm slowly figuring that out. Strange since when I think CO or UT i know just where I would want to go.

 

[elks96]

101 and 102 are not very good units. Especially when you consider that the deer seasons are so early in the year! I have seen some good buckles there in the winter, but most of those good bucks if not all are traveling into the unit!

There are a couple decent buck I those units, but having hunted the, before it is not uncommon to go 2 or 3 days without turning up a deer unless you are in the sa,e few crowded spots everyone me hunts and then you never rea
Ly see any good bucks because the hunter all hit the same country!

I would look to other units for sure. The Seminoles hold some good bucks but private is tricky for sure!

 

[HiMtnHntr]

101 and 102 are not the "dream hunts" in terms of finding that 200" buck, but if you go 2-3 days without seeing a deer your not getting out much.

Honestly I'm not sure what to tell a NR with max deer points in Wyoming. Perhaps just "sorry?"

 

[Founder]

For me, I like the high country of Wyoming, but I love backpacking and I know that's not for everyone.

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com
LIKE MonsterMuleys.com on Facebook!

 

[wildfin]

I am a nr with max pts and mostly consider wyo for me a one time fun hunt, and it will most likely be 102.I've been in 102 for deer elk and ant and the largest buck I've seen In the west was there,the towns people said it was 45 in, wide but I saw it standing 30 yrds from a bull elk and I was maybe 150 from him he was not 45 wide but real close to 40 and maybe 10 x10 that was maybe 12 years ago.I still have not been there and not seen a serious supply of bucks, with the tag cuts it could help but all the roads and new pipe, wind farms it may never come back.the last time I was there was 2013 and I saw 2 buck out of at least 75 that were at least 33 to 35 wide, they were mega bucks but both 3x3, I would never believe that a giant is not in there,but I will hold out for now and hunt ant again before I apply for deer, good luck were ever you land on that monster.

 

[HuntElk4Fun_]

No dream units exist in Wyoming. It offers a little cup of tea for everyone and some great bucks will be killed but unlike other states it just flat doesn't have a dream unit.

Decide how you want to hunt, what you want experience to be and burn the points or wait for that. If you're willing to wait then do so, something could rise to the top or management could change a create a dream unit. The Henry Mtns in Utah wasn't anything special until they closed it and created the dream hunt. Some guys would die to have max points now for that but others are glad they've burned them and moved onto other things.

 

[Scotchbeard]

Sorry to dig up an old post, but they did just cut the quotas in 102 in half from 400 tags down to 200. I'm not sure if this is a permanent move or just to help it rebound from a couple bad years. Does anybody know if they are trying to turn this into a dream hunt or just help it rebound?

 

[Zeke]

The Henry Mtns
>in Utah wasn't anything special
>until they closed it and
>created the dream hunt. Some
>guys would die to have
>max points now for that
>but others are glad they've
>burned them and moved onto
>other things. \

Not true! It was a fantastic unit when it was managed for 3-point or better bucks. As soon as the F&G opened it for "any" buck, guys knew they could pop an easy one and they arrived in droves and blasted the bucks to oblivion for a couple years.... then the F&G closed it only to reopen it as a LE unit.

Yep, been there done that!

Sorry, that had nothing to do with a Wyoming dream deer unit.
Zeke

 

[mmwb]

I don't think Wyoming Game and Fish manages toward a dream hunt, or trophy hunts in general. It is more about opportunity. I expect most residents support that. Being able to hunt in God's country more often is more important to many, than getting big bone for the wall.

 

[nfh]

109 is my pick

 

[nontypical]

102 had 300 tags last year; 400 in 2013. WGFD dropped tags to 200 after finally listening to what local hunters had been trying to tell them for the last several years. So they took a helicopter ride and couldn't find any deer a couple winters ago. It's a huge step in the right direction. Give it a few years, and it should improve. 101 is much worse off than 102. 25 total tags speaks volumes about the unit.

When 102 first became a LQ unit, more than 1000 tags were offered.

Quality is down, and has been for 6-7 years. Not saying there isn't a 190+ or two there, but good luck finding one right now. Drought and predators have taken a toll after the winter of 2010-11 killed many deer to exacerbate the down turn that had already begun.

Tag numbers will be raised when deer numbers rise according to G&F.

 

[TOPGUN]

That's a shame G&F waited that long to drop tag numbers down like you mentioned. From 1000 a few years ago and now only 200 and only 25 total tags in 101 is hard to believe that it took that long for them to take action. I wonder how much it has to do with them depending on tag money to support a good share of the G&F budget. Any thoughts on that?

 

[BuzzH]

I wonder how much it has to do with them depending on tag money to support a good share of the G&F budget. Any thoughts on that?

Yeah, I think you're full of crap.

The Residents that don't draw 101 and 102 are probably picking up general tags, and the amount of NR tags not being sold with quota reductions aren't making a significant difference with a 74 million dollar a year operating budget.

Not to mention, that Wyoming quotas fluctuate more than any other Western State out there for all species, there is no way that the WYGF is putting the financial needs of the department above doing whats best for wildlife.

IMO/E, the WYGF listens to the public, outfitters, and landowners too much.

 

[TOPGUN]

> I wonder how much it
>has to do with them
>depending on tag money to
>support a good share of
>the G&F budget. Any thoughts
>on that?
>
>Yeah, I think you're full of
>crap.
>
>The Residents that don't draw 101
>and 102 are probably picking
>up general tags, and the
>amount of NR tags not
>being sold with quota reductions
>aren't making a significant difference
>with a 74 million dollar
>a year operating budget.
>
>Not to mention, that Wyoming quotas
>fluctuate more than any other
>Western State out there for
>all species, there is no
>way that the WYGF is
>putting the financial needs of
>the department above doing whats
>best for wildlife.
>
>IMO/E, the WYGF listens to the
>public, outfitters, and landowners too
>much.

Thanks for another typical response! FYI that was a question and I didn't say that was my thought, but rather what a lot of others might think caused it! Your last comment also sounds a little hypocritical when reading the paragraph immediately preceding it. Happy 4th to you and yours and thanks for your comments!

 

[BuzzH]

Its idiotic posts like yours that start unfounded rumors. Pretty ridiculous to blame, or even imply, that the GF is keeping quotas high to keep revenue up...not to mention outright irresponsible. If anything, they're keeping quotas a bit higher to keep the hunting public, outfitters, and landowners happy.

Try attending a few season setting meetings and you MAY have the first clue about what you're typing about.

For example, I asked the Saratoga biologist why they were issuing 25 doe antelope tags for unit 50, in particular since just before that he said they didn't get the recruitment they wanted. His response was, that they had "a couple landowners complaining about antelope in their alfalfa, so we can at least say we're trying to do something about it".

That has NOTHING to do with revenue and everything to do with issuing tags to keep landowners happy. That is unless you think issuing 25 doe antelope tags is going to save the GF budget.

 

[TOPGUN]

You are continuing on a rant for no reason other than who posed the question! Just because one doesn't agree with another gives no excuse to call others idiots and other name calling you're good for in almost every condescending post! If they are keeping quotas higher than the biologists want for any reason whether it's money or pleasing a certain faction, then the system is at least partially broken and that's all I was trying to get at. Thanks for hearing your end of it and I'll end it here to avoid any further hassles. Happy Holidays to everyone!

 

[440sixpack]

Landowners are bad m'kay. they have land I can't hunt and I'm jealous.

Outfitters are bad m'kay. they make money doing what I'm not good enough to do and I'm jealous.

Nonresident hunters are bad m'kay. they draw tags that should be mine and I'm jealous.


Give it a rest Buzz we're all jealous of someone. but it's never going to be you so don't try so hard.


Stay thirsty my friends

 

[jm77]

mmwb said: "I don't think Wyoming Game and Fish manages toward a dream hunt, or trophy hunts in general. It is more about opportunity. "

This is true and I believe there is no "Dream Hunt" for deer in Wyo.

The G&F, under pressure from the public, manages for two types of hunts. Both are based on the buck/doe ratio post season. Recreation areas manage for around 25-30 buck per 100 doe. Trophy or special manage for around 40. Not sure what the exact ratio, but I'm close.

Bottom line is this; in either type of deer hunt area, NO merit is given to age class of bucks. That being said, there are many areas in Wyo that hold 190+ deer. Good luck finding one!

 

[TOPGUN]

Thanks for that info. Jeff, as I didn't know that. I don't know about the question being asked about a dream hunt, but at my age I can tell you that that the hunt I'm going on down in G this Fall is my dream hunt whether I shoot a big buck or not. I'd like to just see a few bucks over 170" and if I get a chance at one, so be it. if not I know just seeing the country down there and doing it on horseback will be a thrill.

 

[BuzzH]

Jeff,

IIRC, your numbers are spot on regarding buck to doe ratios and what defines opportunity VS. trophy management.

The numbers are really similar for elk as well.

I also recall from the PVMDI, that the GF allowed the public to come up with a "definition" of trophy deer for that herd. One of the main factors used to define a "trophy" deer, that seemed strange to me, was antler width.

I wasn't real comfortable with the definition that was used...would have much rather that management focus on age structure/classes, rather than over-all buck to doe ratios, and antler width.

 

[jm77]

LAST EDITED ON Jul-04-15 AT 11:27PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Jul-04-15 AT 07:27?PM (MST)

>Jeff,
>
>IIRC, your numbers are spot on
>regarding buck to doe ratios
>and what defines opportunity VS.
>trophy management.
>
>The numbers are really similar for
>elk as well.
>
>I also recall from the PVMDI,
>that the GF allowed the
>public to come up with
>a "definition" of trophy deer
>for that herd. One of
>the main factors used to
>define a "trophy" deer, that
>seemed strange to me, was
>antler width.
>
>I wasn't real comfortable with the
>definition that was used...would have
>much rather that management focus
>on age structure/classes, rather than
>over-all buck to doe ratios,
>and antler width.

Two years ago the Wildlife Management Coordinator here asked if I had three mule deer racks he could borrow; a 160, 170 & 180 class, all typical, to use at their meeting related to what you are talking about Buzz, to help define mature bucks. I offered him to also use a 190 class, but he refused. I joked that he wouldn't take it because it raises too much expectations. He told me I was right!!

It was tough coming up with the 160 by the way!

 

[TOPGUN]

Jeff---By chance do you have any pictures of those bucks you could share with us on here? It would certainly help me getting ready for my hunt.

 

[jm77]

>Jeff---By chance do you have any
>pictures of those bucks you
>could share with us on
>here? It would certainly
>help me getting ready for
>my hunt.

170 main frame + kickers

172

176

184

182

 

[mightyhunter]

Nice bucks jm77. I agree with your comments about trophy mule deer. I believe that there are trophy mule deer bucks in many LE and General units in Wyoming. I have seen them and they have evaded me on too many occasions. Are there units or dream units where you see more trophy sized mule deer, I believe there are. Are there spots in Wyoming that are so inaccessible that a buck can grow old there? Yes. there are.

To me a trophy mule deer is one I have hunted hard for. In this part of NW Wyoming, that doesn't necessarily mean that I have scouted a buck in the preseason and taken him on the opener. Because of the migratory nature of the mule deer in NW Wyoming, you usually scout country and not a particular deer. It may be scouting a migratory path where the bucks pass at a quick trot through an opening. You may have just seconds to make your decision.

What constitutes a trophy mule deer for me may be very different from the definition for others. My criteria are the following:

1) Taken on public land. I actually avoid hunting private land and the areas surrounding private land. I don't want the hassle or the crowds.

2) I like the high country. The more rugged the better.

3) A muley buck that is at least 4-5 years old.

4) A buck with nice mass and I prefer the dark horns of a high country mule deer.

5) The number of points really doesn't matter to me. I have taken some old deer that had large frames but not many points. It used to drive me crazy when I guided in Montana when a hunter would pass a heavy 3x4 or 3x3 5 year+ old buck and later shoot a 4x4 three year old with spindly horns. The most mature buck I have ever seen in Wyoming was a 2x3 with incredible mass, spread, height and the biggest cow head I had ever seen. He was hanging by himself in an avalanche chute at just under 11,000 ft. I am sure he died of old age. The oldest buck I ever killed in Wyoming was a wide 3x4 who had no teeth and a very light cape. He was over the hill but I remember the hunt very well.

6)A trophy buck is one I harvest in an area I have scouted out for myself without input from others. Too many people want to be pointed to the exact location to take a trophy buck.

7)A trophy buck is one I take in solitude. No outfitter camps, pony soldiers or beaten trails. No nimrods running around in pumpkin suits that skyline themselves on the ridges. I like to hunt places that take me at least two to three hours on foot to get to.

8)A trophy buck is one that I drop and wonder how am I going to get this beast out of here. I have hauled a lot of deer out in the dark on my back. I remember the nastiest black eye I ever got when I face planted carrying a gnarly 3x4 buck out in the dark.

I guess for me, it is always about the experience. When I scout a new spot, I think to myself where would a mature buck hang or move through this location. I plan on finding another spot this week. I have tried twice to get into this spot only to be stopped by deadfall and cliffs. I think I have finally found a way in.

I think luck has to be a huge part of the equation. Even when you locate a trophy buck, you have to close the deal. Waiting for a better look or a better shot may cost you the deer. Figure out what you want in a trophy and be ready when the opportunity is presented. I always laugh when somebody tells me how dumb mule deer are when compared to the whitetail. That has never been my experience.

just sayin...mh

 

[oilcan]

jm77,
That's a nice collection of Buck's you have there.

 

[TOPGUN]

Thanks for the pictures Jeff and thanks for your insight MH! If I was living out there and could have a horse or two of my own I believe I'd be out every possible day searching for that dream buck up in the high country. Since I live so far away and needed a number of PPs to hunt an area where I have a good chance of seeing one, about the only way I figured I'd have that chance was going with a reputable outfitter. That's why I picked Region G this year to burn my 6PPs and it sounds like maybe with the weather helping things along that may have been a good decision to finally get er done. If the hunt doesn't get us a couple bucks to our liking, I'm sure it will still be the hunt of a lifetime for me just for the experience in that high country, as MH mentioned in his thoughts. We have also arranged to stay down there and hunt the adjacent unit DIYing it with rental horses on into the first week of October if the guided hunt from 9/21-9/25 doesn't get us what we're looking for. I just want to give it my best shot because it will probably be the only time I have left at my age for a good chance at bucks like we're talking about.

 

[jm77]

> jm77,
>That's a nice collection of Buck's
>you have there.


Yes, the wife and kids have done ok, thanks.