Chips Fire!

S

sageadvice

Long Time Member
Messages
11,849
Getting nasty! 35,000+ acres, moving north towards Canyon Dam, Lake Almanor, several lake front resorts, and communities. The smoke and falling ash even 20 miles away is terrible and things could easily get worse.

This could get bad!

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
Keep your cap on your head and your bathtub full, Joey!
Helpless feeling at best.
If push comes to shove, let us know if ya need any help.
 
Joey, your big problem is that the fire suppession is being done by USFS since it is in a national forest. Down here CAL-Fire is looked on as being far better in fighting forest fires and USFS is considered piss poor on supression of wildland fires in their jurisdiction.

RELH
 
RELH, guess i'll have to agree with you on which is the better agency as i don't follow that much. I will say that once the fire got going, or maybe was allowed to get going, it was going to take a lot of doing to get it out. I know that country pretty good and it is extremely rugged, remote, and steep, hardly any access, and the winds whip up pretty good in them canyons.

The mornings here are still fairly nice but by 10am or so, visibility drops way down and it's a fowl air to breath. I have a direct vent water heater and a replacement kitchen sink faucet to install over in Prattville tomorrow(today), if they'll let me in the area, so will be right in the fires path but maybe s day or two ahead of it unless they can somehow stop it.

A good rain might help!! :)

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
>Joey, your big problem is that
>the fire suppession is being
>done by USFS since it
>is in a national forest.
>Down here CAL-Fire is looked
>on as being far better
>in fighting forest fires and
>USFS is considered piss poor
>on supression of wildland fires
>in their jurisdiction.
>
>
>
>
>
> RELH
>

Really? Pretty broad Brush you're painting with there.

You have any intel on the Chips fire? Any idea where the fire started and where it got established? Do you know the hazards involved in fighting fire in the Feather River Canyon? How about the conditions of the fuels out there?

I know a few folks who have been busting their butts trying to get this fire under control. Kicking their arses everyday. Tough terrain, fuels are at near record dryness, access sucked, lots and lots of snags from a previous large fire, etc etc. There's lots and lots of fires burning across the west and California. Resources are spread thin. They're doing the best they can with what they have.

And guess what, there's CALFIRE resources on that fire too. How come they haven't put it out, if, according to you, they are better than putting out fires than the USFS?

As you can tell, touchy subject for me as I work for the USFS and I know the folks on the ground are doing everything they safely can to get a handle on things.I'm probably headed that way after my days off.
 
I got my information directly from fire fighters and a fire chief who have been involved in fighting several fires that came under USFS jurisdiction. It seems that USFS has a habit taking time to stage at the beginning of a fire which allows the fire to grow in size before a real earnest effort is applied. How long was it before USFS asked CAL-fire to assist them in fighting this fire?

Also your higher ups in USFS has a ingrained mental problem of "Let it burn" as mother nature intended until it gets out of hand and endangers structures.

As for you working for USFS, I have several retired smoke jumpers friends who used to work for USFS and express the same opinion about CAL-Fire doing a better job on fire supression then done by USFS.

I have had two wildland fires that endangered my home in the past 12 years. CAL-fire or CDF as they were called then, had the bombers over then in 15 minutes dropping fire retardant. I live next to both Tahoe and Plumas national forest, and USFS has never been able to match this fast response on fires that spring up in their jurisdiction.

I know of one local fire chief that pulled his men and equitment off a USFS fire because they were just "dicking around" at the staging center and allowing the fire to gain in size.

RELH
 
You still haven't answered my questions concerning the Chips fire, which is what we are talking about. Every fire is different.

Talking to a few guys and making your own assumptions hardly makes what you're saying true. In my experience with the agency, we don't sit around staging waiting to take action on a fire. Are all FS resources perfect? Not at all. But the same could be said for CALFIRE and Local Government.

USFS doesn't have a let burn policy. Did you know the USFS catches over 98% of the fires they initial attack? Over 98% in some tough, rugged terrain. One gets away due to heavy fuel loading, steep, rugged terrain, lack of resources available, acessibilty issues, adverse weather conditions and all of a sudden you start pontificating about how USFS is to blame! HA!!!!!

CALFIRE wouldn't of caught that thing either.

You live next to some NF land. Who has the jurisdiction on that private land next to the NF? That'd be CALFIRE. So they were doing their job protecting your home. It's in their best interest.
 
I was trying to be nice to you and not say everything. That fire that our firechief pulled his men and equitment off was the Onion Valley fire a few years back. That was in Plumas National Forest jurisdiction as is the Chips fire your are talking about.

When his firefighters reported that Plumas USFS was sitting on their thumbs at the staging area, and he heard about 13-15 USFS fire engines with firefighters were parked at the Indian Casino eating lunch, instead of making haste to the fire scene, he made the decision to bring his men and equitment back to their own area in the event an emergency should occur there and no one to handle it.

I am not bad mouthing the on the ground grunts who fight these fires, it is their leaders who seem to have a different agenda, and give the orders to the grunts who have to follow the orders given them.

Also do not tell me that I am wrong on my opinion over the forest service adminstration. I have had too many dealings with them and know that they walk to a different drum beat then the average common sense man.

I also recall the conversation I had with a USFS District Ranger who bragged to me how he had been a pot smoking hippie & driving a psychedelic VW van while attending the university in Berkley. He got his degree and went to work for USFS and the last I heard he was promoted up to a higher level to join others like him and make policy for USFS. That Idiot did not believe in any logging or hunting on FS land and instead of doing brush clearing, let mother nature and fire clean the forest as it did in the 1800's. Only problem is we have too many people and homes in the mountain regions to allow that fire to take it's course today.
Maybe you need to start asking around and see where other firefighters rank USFS on fire supression and see what your average citizen living near USFS land feel about who does a better job of fighting fires. You might get a eye opener.

RELH
 
LAST EDITED ON Aug-14-12 AT 03:15PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Aug-14-12 AT 03:11?PM (MST)

OK guy, you win. USFS should just let CALFIRE fight all the fires since we don't have a clue as to what we're doing. Thanks for trying to be nice to me. I'll sleep better.

I'm sorry you had "a" negative experience with some management folks. Most people I know in the outfit are committed to putting out a good product for the public and getting the job done, and that comes from the top, down to the folks on the ground.
 
Hey Dan, can you give us any report on the Chips fire? Do you think it will reach Canyon Dam or Highway 89 along lake Almanor?

I was working in Prattville today and they are under voluntary evacuation but heard no news of how it's going.

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
LAST EDITED ON Aug-14-12 AT 07:36PM (MST)[p]http://wlfhotlist.com/threads/28969-CA-PNF-Chips/page11

http://inciweb.org/incident/3052/

Joey here's a couple of good websites dealing with the Chips and the info you're looking for. Sounds like they are starting to make a little hay on things but they're still a little ways out from getting it. Inciweb has a wealth of info concerning road closures and evacuations.
 
Thanks Dan!

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
lol RELH......you hurt the feelers of the forrest circus.....




JB
497fc2397b939f19.jpg
 
I was the Agency Representative for CDCR on the Peak Fire which started the same day or a day before the Chips Fire. While in briefings on the Peak Fire, there was discussion of the Chips Fire. One of the problems with the Chips fire is that the Forest Service thought it would stay contained between 2 creek drainages. Didn't happen. I won't give any specifics but the 2 Agencies have different theorys on fire supression. Cal-Fire believes every fire can be put out before it reaches 10 acres. The Forest Service "manages" fires. Even a high ranking official in Cal-Fire recently told me the "10 acre or less" psyholophy probably isn't the perfect answer.

One issue with the Chips Fire is that it has burned through the "Storey" fire from approx 8-10 years ago. The Forest Service didn't allow logging immediately after that fire thus you have tons of rotting, dry fuel burning hotter than usual. The portion of the "Storey" fire that was on Sierra Pacific land (approx 3,000 acres) got logged that fall and early spring. The Forest Service had the option of allowing logging of dead timber but chose to let it rot "naturally."

Cal-Fire had a plan for the Storey fire which was to clear a 1/4 mile swath, complete with logging trucks to haul the timber out. The latest map I saw this evening shows the fire is on SRA land thus Cal-Fire can attack it. I know the Forest Service called in 5 strike teams yesterday (25 engines) from Cal-Fire with another 5 teams to deploy today. I'm not sure that happened as I was busy today but we have been sitting in Camp for the last week wondering when we were going to get on the Chips Fire.

There is a fire north of Susanville on BLM land that a Cal-Fire Captain told me this morning grew by 10,000 acres in one hour overnight. This fire is reported @ 60,000+ acres now. Supposedly it was on Skeddle Mountain. 2 of our crews were sent out to Shaffer Mountain today to clear brush on the top of the mountain as there are TV repeaters, Cell Phone repeaters, and probably emergency services repeaters on the top of Shaffer.

As far as the Forest Service or Cal-Fire not actively working on a fire, here is how they work. The Feds (Forest Service/BLM) can only work 16 hours a day. If they run over they MUST take 8 full hours off. Cal-Fire works 24 hour shifts mostly. Then the Captains get 24 hours in a motel room. I have witnessed the crews arriving late at night and not getting off the fire until 30+ hours later. The Lost Fire in Nevada was just like that. We got to the fire @ 0100 hours. They came off the fire @ 0745 hours the day after so they worked 30+ hours. Not taking side here but these are either safety rules the Agencies have or negociated terms. Personally, I'd rather do what i do than do what the Captains do. I don't ever get a motel room unless I chose to come off of the clock but in my opinion, these guys deserve it.

My 48 hours goes like this: We arrive at a fire late at night or very early in the morning. The Captains take the inmates on the fire line. We follow them to the drop off point and discuss where they'll be working. Then we try to find the shadiest spot we can for the middle of the day. We are constantly monitoring the radio in case one of the inmates becomes a problem or has a mdical issue. If this occurs, we respond and either take the inmate to the closest county jail, prison, or hospital as required. Approximately 24 hours later, the Captains come off of the fire line and we take custody. The Captains transport the inmates to a predetermined location such a a fairgrounds fire camp or one of the Conservation Camps. The Captains usually eat breakfast then go to their hotel rooms, sometimes an hour or two drive away. It's now our 24 hours with the inmates. In that time we make sure they are fed, showered, clothes washed, and medical issues taken care of. Poison oak is a huge issue on the Coast and valley foothill fires. Then dinner, then to bed. We have to count the inmates every hour in these type settings so there isn't much time for sleep. The next morning we have the Crew Carrying Vehicles restocked with ice, water and Gatorage and double lunches for the Captains and Inmates. Then after Breakfast, we turn the inmates over to the Captains, follow them to the drop off point and try to find some shade to sleep in before it gets too hot.

This work doesn't seem hard until you get home and sleep for 16-20 hours an realize how tired you were,
 
I had/have no intentions of dissing any of the Fire agencys when i started this thread, But, i have often wondered if any of those involved might not take a real aggressive approach to a fire because if it does gets going, there can and will be lots of work and O.T. Kinda like the off duty fireman going around and starting fires.

Slayer, thanks for the info!! I see a lots of eating, sleeping, and finding shade in your post but not much firefighting. Do the inmates actually get involved or as it sounds, more of a show of coverage?

Joey




"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
The 24 hours they are with the Captains they complete whatever their fire assignment is. One night on the Colfax/Auburn fire the crew cut 1600' of line downhill in very thick manzanita that was 8" in diameter, trees several feet in diameter, and tons of pison oak. 20' wide line to bare soil, 1600' long. One of the Dozer drivers got on the radio in the morning and gave them their props saying they'd done a better job than a bull dozer could. BUT earlier that day the inmates had been spread out every 30 yards along a dirt 2 track for several hours just standing there as Cal-Fire back burned uphill. The inmate's job was to ensure no burning material rolled downhill past the 2 track into the fuel below. Not taxing work but 31 inmates @ $1.00 an hour is pretty good insurance that a burning pine cone doesn't roll across a line in steep countryand start new fire below the dozer and engine resources.

On the recent Nevada fire their assignment 2 shifts in a row was to "cold trail" meaning the crews were split up and each crew was assigned a section of the fire. They would walk along the edge of the fire, scraping anything that looked like it may contain heat. Scratch it with their tool, check for heat with their hand. If their was heat, they would break up the root ball or whatever it was that was still smoldering, dragging it further into the black, away from the green. On one of those shifts the Captain's GPS said they only walked 10.1 miles. Pretty easy shift compared to normal but standing on freshly burned, black hillside, in full nomex, helmet, 40 lbs backpack, in 95-110 degree temps, and even working moderately, gets pretty hot.

The crews usually consist of a 1st saw who cuts the biggest brush with his saw, the first puller who pulls the brush away and discards it, the 2nd saw who cuts the remaining brush/trees, the 2nd puller who discards this material, the rest are pure hand tools, about 4 polaskis that cut the smaller brush, 3-4 McCleods that are now scraping soil, the a couple of shovels that are modified for the purpose. The last guy in line is the Captain's samper, basically another set of eyes for the Captain. This inmate experienced and has several fire seasons under his belt, maybe as many as 10 depending how many terms he's severed. He's actually issued a Cal-Fire radio, tells other crew members what to do, can even be assigned to go to a high point and watch the fire as a safety officer while the Captain supervises the crew.

The quality of the Captain usually determines the quality of the crew. A lot of these guys take extreme pride in what they do. And others are just there, needing to be kicked in the a$$ to motivte them.

I've watched the Saws change their chain in 30-40 seconds when they rock em while it would take me several minutes. And I've cut a lot of fire wood.

A couple of interesting assignments on both the Robber's fire and just yesterday on Shaffer Mountain it to cut the brush around the top of the mountain 40 yards or more back from the repeaters to protect them. On the Robber's assignment, the fire was advancing pretty fast, in head high brush. When the safety officer said it was time to get out of there the fire was still 300-400 yards away but you could really feel the heat even at that distance.

The inmate hand crews for Cal-Fire are the same resource the Forest Service calls their "Hot Shot" crews. I won't say they are better than the feds but we have a couple of crews that I would put up against any hot shot crew. And a couple that just barely seem to do the minimum.
 
In Cal-Fire's defense I'd like to mention that when you drive by the Indian Casino and see 15 Cal-Fire rigs parked there, they are on their down time. There are 15 more rigs on that fire as they work opposing 24 hour shifts.

Like I said earlier, on the Lost fire we rolled out of Susanville at 10 PM, got to the fire @ 1:00 AM. They got their assignment @ about 6:00 AM and worked until the next day @ 8:00 AM. Although they were only on the fire 26 hours, they had all worked the day before and blasted out of Susanville bascially at bed time, got 4+ hours of sleep on the ground and then worked their 26 hour shift. That's what you don't see. You do see them in the restraunts, motels, etc and it looks bad.
 
Califelkslayer;

Those fire rigs at the casino were not Cal-fire rigs, they were USFS rigs that had not even made it to the fire staging area yet while the USFS Admin. decided to let it burn for awhile and see what happens. This is what pissed off our local fire chief that he had to leave his community almost unprotected while USFS decided if they were going to contain the fire.

As for using inmates, they were deployed in this area on two major fires and they busted their butts trying to contain the fire. They have the respect of the citizens in this area who saw them in action.

RELH
 
Slayer, lol, OK, i feel like you set me up there! Good stuff, also, i really like what the crews have been doing along our Highways around Almanor. I see the crews out all the time and the results that they accomplish. Very nice stuff!!

42,215 acres, 20% contained with possible thunderstorms and gusty winds...

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
Joey, stay safe buddy! It looks like you started a firestorm.:)

I worked two summers as a firefighter for CDF (now Cal Fire) back in the 60's. At the end of the second year I was offered a job as a Fire Truck Driver for the next season. I turned it down because I was promised a job on a logging crew making "big bucks". I've always wondered what my life would be like today if I had taken the driving job.

The inmate crews (known as Con Crews back then) pulled the bulk of the heavy work on the fire line. Our trucks with water were for hot spots and support.

We were on a fire one evening and were being held back because borate bombers were flying and dropping their retardent. When word came down that no more planes would be flying because of darkness, I grabbed a shovel and headed up the mountain to a stump that was showering sparks into the sky. I was shoveling as hard as I could when all of a sudden a plane was on me and dumped his entire load of borate on me and the stump. I was covered by 1/4" of the wet slimy stuff. LOL

I was just a poor kid back then and I always looked forward to going out on a fire because of all the great food they served in Fire Camp. Big thick steaks was the norm. I'd never eaten that good in my life!:)

Sorry for the diversion Joey. Keep us posted on your current situation.

Eel
 
LAST EDITED ON Aug-15-12 AT 07:00PM (MST)[p]Eel, I worked in this unit (Lassen/Modoc) in 1978 at the Westwood station (Sage's hometown). And I was on the hiring list for Engineer (Probably fire truck driver when you worked) when I got hired by the Prison system. I was laid off in Oct, 1982 from the telephone company and job secruty was my prime concern. Anyways, I had an opportunity to go to work for a city fire Dept in South Sacto, Cal-Fire as a (Limited Term) or CDC. After 6 months @ the prison I told the other 2 entites no thanks not because my job was so rewarding but because of job security.

I've had fun along the way, raised a family on my salary, etc. But I have wondered a few times, "What if?" But no regrets!

Working with inmates, inside a high security prison, changes a person. Our humor is different and we are suspicious of everyone. We've been lied to by the best liars in the world a thousand times. You believe nothing you hear and only 1/2 of what you see. You ask 100 cops what is the first thing that comes to mind when you say "Little League Coach or Cub Scout leader" and the majority with say, "Child Molester." Ask 100 'normal citizens' the same question and the most popular answer will probably be, "Volunteer or good citizen."

Enough of my psyc issues. I respect all of the fire fighters, State and Federal. I agree that the Plumas National Forest will not allow you to venture more than 100 feet of an improved road this year to gather fire wood but will let 1,000s of acres burn. Doesn't make much sense when eventually homes and lives are endangered.
 
LAST EDITED ON Aug-15-12 AT 11:07PM (MST)[p]Nah........Why waste my time arguing with a cop about scout leaders and coaches. Very offensive statement.

Sold many cell phones at work there, Slayer?

Joey.......sorry for fueling the hijack.....
 
Personally? NO!

There have been a couple, now doing time in prison themselves, thankfully.

And being offended at facts is your problem, not mine. Having coached Little League myself for 4 years, and a girls youth fastpitch travel team for 5 years, I have a lot of respect for people that donate that much time for any charity. At the same time, after reading Central file and after Central file when the predator used his charity work (church, boy scouts, etc) to access his victims makes you cynical.

The system separates these types of individuals from society so easily offended types like you don't have to deal with them.

In our world there are 3 types of people; sheep, wolves and sheepdogs. And sheep have never appreciated sheepdogs. They even have a hard time distinguishing between wolves and sheepdogs. Wolves don't look for sheepdogs as victims, they hunt for sheep, avoiding the sheepdog. And when a sheepdog bites a sheep (like selling cell phones) he's worse than a wolf. I'm sure this analogy is even more offensive then my previous statement.
 
LAST EDITED ON Aug-17-12 AT 00:20AM (MST)[p]Yes, I am offended, but not the way you think. I have about 40 years of volunteer work trying to improve the lives of kids, and some "cop" paints us all as child molesters. Pretty sick, if you ask me.

According to YOUR own stats, you may in fact, be one yourself.

And as far as "a couple" of CO's being busted for serving up cell phones to inmates.....how do "a couple" distribute the 1200 cell phones and chargers confiscated in Ca prisons last year. Those 2 guys were VERY busy!!!
Hmmmm, makes you wonder, don't it?

"Ask any regular citizen and most will say all CO's are corrupt".....wasn't that sort of your quote? We watch lots of TV shows where there are bad cops.....we get cynical!

I doubt you want to be painted with that broad brush either.

And as far as "appreciating the sheepdogs".....I suspect you get a paycheck and I doubt you were drafted. Quit whining....leave if you don't feel appreciated enough.

You bet I am offended, not just for me, but the thousands of other guys, some on this site, that have given our time, resources and energy, for the betterment of American youth.

I deleted some of this, hopefully to avoid some "dirty" cop kicking my door in and planting drugs in my house..... I seen you guys do that on TV........
 
I was wrong. It is 8,700 confiscated cellphones this year......SO FAR!

Charlie Manson even had one and he gets NO visitors........see where this is going?

Yep, those "couple" guys you mentioned were very busy indeed.
 
Getting back to the Chips fire, Our Power was just turned back on after being out from mid evening on. This is about a half a dozen times now that the power has stayed off for any considerable amount of time in the past several days. Lots of Fire trucks and water tenders, a couple sirens in a hurry, not sure why the increase in activity here in Westwood this evening but there has been.

Though i feel fairly safe here at home, there is a variable set of weather circumstances that could possibly make this fire a lot more damaging and dangerous than it already is and has been. To those that may not know, this country where the fire is and it's path if allowed, is tall timber, thick brush, very steep and rugged country.

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
Wow, Joey! Be careful over there, I hope they get this under control before there is much property damage and any loss of life.

Nickman, I don't think slayers comments were intended to say that all child leaders and coaches were pedophiles, at least that is not the impression I got.

I believe his intent was to say that as CO one reads the files on inmates and the vast majority of pedophiles DO put themselves in positions of trust with children (fact) and SOME officers bridge that HUGE gap and feel like ALL coaches etc. are suspicious.

On the cell phones, probably 8650 of those were found in low level of custody housing units where things get thrown over the fence on a regular basis. Not exactly a showing example of security but also not a big deal in the grand scheme. Besides even Charley gots to keep his beotches straight!;)

Bill

Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of
ignorance, and the gospel of envy.

You have enemies? Good. That means you've
stood up for something, sometime in your life.

- Winston Churchill
 
I have a place at Lake Almanor West. At this time we have a warning but no evacuation. A change in weather would be the biggest help for the firefighters. Also we need to keep the firefighters in our prayers. I understand that a dozer operator rolled his dozer yesterday and has a head injury.
 
Hey Nick,Slayers statement is fact.Besides he was just making a point about prison.He earned that right as hes been there and knows something about it.Thanx for all your years of volunteer work but as for trying to bump yo gums about prisons and Charlie Manson you might want to spend a week or two behind the walls to better educate yourself. BH1
 
Give them hell Dan, we all know who is doing the hard work its the men and women on the hot shot crews, not the pavement queens in red
 
NICKMAN,
What makes you an expert on what "Charlie" gets. Dude you haven't a clue and You are talking out your backside.
The vast majority of cell phones inside the prison system are smuggled in by inmate visitors or are acquired through pre-arranged "drops" by dirtballs for prisoners with orwa's or orwd's (prisoners that are allowed outside the walls) to secure and smuggle inside the "secure" perimeter.
And yes I do know what I am talking about.
PS
Yes, Corrections does have some bad apples. They are fired and prosecuted (If the charges are criminal) to the fullest when the department is able to substantiate charges against them. Unfortunately any agency as large as CDC is going to have a number of bad employees. That said, the overwhelming majority of CDC employees, custody and non-custody are good people. The media and special interest groups love to throw darts at them and have swayed the publics opinion of them, blaming them for the states budget issues and anything else they can think of.

The joint agency fire camp program (CalFire/CDC) IMHO is the best program the prison system has going and I believe is the most successful of the "rehabilitation" programs as most are a joke. Many of the prisoners that are in the "camp" program are for the first time in their lives doing something worth while. Many of them take great pride in the work they do. Inmate crews have been responsible for saving lives, have been involved in rescues, body recoveries and numerous other events that put their lives in danger. They also perform other services for the state. I have talked to many CalFire employees that would tell you the inmate crews are some of the finest wild-fire firefighters anywhere.
Oh yeah, I know a little about this too.

It is normal for sheep to fear the Sheepdog even though the Sheepdog will, and often does give it's life to protect the sheep that fear him/her. Even worse, some sheep feel bad for, or side with the very wolf that preys upon them when the Sheepdogs do their job.

Any how, next time you leave Your barn, take a look around and just say Baa Baa, and know that the Sheepdog will do everything the law allows to protect you and the rest of the flock.

Norkal

"INVEST IN LEAD FOR THE TIMES AHEAD!"
 
Nickman,
Yes the Sheepdog does get paid, they work for you, the sheep. And yes they are sick, you see, they run towards the danger instead of away from it. And although they will try to avoid violence, they crave a good fight with the wolf.
You are obviously one of the sheep that has bitten off on the BS the media and special interest groups has thrown out there. Again, next time you stray away from your barn just say Baa, Baa.

Norkal

"INVEST IN LEAD FOR THE TIMES AHEAD!"
 
Thank you guys for making my point.......even if you didn't get it yourselves.....Hilarious!"

I could eat a bowl of Alphabet Soup and
sh!t a better argument than that!"
 
Nickman,
Not hate'n on you. You are fortunate to be part of the flock. We are wired different, neither is right or wrong, just different.

Norkal


"INVEST IN LEAD FOR THE TIMES AHEAD!"
 
LAST EDITED ON Aug-18-12 AT 09:58PM (MST)[p]I just got off of that fire and if you can show me an agency that can stop a fire in that terrain, with the fuels being that dry, and the winds I will gladly sign over my check. All fuel in that fire was available, the unlogged storey area burned, the new plantations burned, and areas outside the storey burned big.
As far as the inmate crews just follow the lunch wrappers and you will find them.
And do the math on a 24 hour shift over four days. Thats 48 hours on 48 off with FS 16s thats 64 hours on and 32 off.
 
Dmick33, you mentioned the garbage. Don't forget the healthy piles of unburied fecal matter they leave behind. Real professional and elite firefighters they have there........

Crew was on a fire near Ravendale about a month ago. We had a helicopter doing a recon and it noticed a spot fire about 200 feet from the main fire edge. There'd been inmates, and only inmates, on that piece of line the night before. When one of the captains reached the spot fire, he discovered it to be, you probably guessed it, GARBAGE!! Instead of packing their garbage out, they decided to burn it OUTSIDE the fire perimeter.
 
>Dmick33, you mentioned the garbage. Don't
>forget the healthy piles of
>unburied fecal matter they leave
>behind. Real professional and elite
>firefighters they have there........
>
>Crew was on a fire near
>Ravendale about a month ago.
>We had a helicopter doing
>a recon and it noticed
>a spot fire about 200
>feet from the main fire
>edge. There'd been inmates, and
>only inmates, on that piece
>of line the night before.
>When one of the captains
>reached the spot fire, he
>discovered it to be, you
>probably guessed it, GARBAGE!!
>Instead of packing their garbage
>out, they decided to burn
>it OUTSIDE the fire perimeter.
There is no excuse for that,..got to figure they aren't the sharpest arrows in the quiver being they are wards of the state,..be safe out there Dan, and thanks for the hard work.
Mike
 
Well, i was hoping to get some reports from those that have been on the fire or know guys that have. Seems this thread turned out to be more of a bitching session than fire thread. That's OK, whatever.

Me, i'm still seeing lots of smoke! :) The reports are basic, seems some of the danger has been evaded but it's, get this, not out of the woods yet. :)

I'll have company coming Thurs-Sun, hope they didn't come for the view. lol

Did i say that the fire was in thick, nasty, rough and steep country? i think i did

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
Joey the fire got extremely active today and is making some significant runs. Sorry I don't have any specifics but it sounds like its up and running.
 
Just got back up the hill from chico,...the smoke plume on this thing looks huge,..and its spread out big time,..and the one up toward redding is cooking too,..hope they can get control soon.
Hope for the best Joey...
Mike
 
you RE: Chips Fire!

Thank you again Dan.

Seems the main area of concern was the area below, East, of Butt Res. Dam. If the fire got going good in that area, it's just one ridge from the little isolated mining community of Seneca. I have several friends with homes and claims there and have been fishing up that river many times. From Seneca, it's just a few miles of almost unwalkably steep country until the bigger but still very small community of Canyon Dam and the south eastern most shores of Lk Almanor.

For you who may be wondering, i'm located just one more big ridge over, about 5 miles, but there is a lake nearby in the direction that this fire would come... if it jumped Hiway 89 by Canyon Dam.

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
LAST EDITED ON Aug-19-12 AT 08:20PM (MST)[p]I was in penvalley today and I could see the plume very easy, first time i noticed it,but it allso might of been the first time the air was clear enough to see that far.
Looks like they got a good dozer line around the east side of the fire.
 
10-4 6X7, i was thinking the same thing.

Right now we have the first little bit of afternoon sunshine i have seen since the fire started. Usually though, by noon or so, visibility gets down to half a mile at best with dark smoke shaded skys.

If the winds come in from the West, we'll get it from the fire in Lassen Park that is just North West of us. With the big fire in X-5B, seems the whole country is burning up and i'm sitting dab square in between them.

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
That map is a little old the fire has passed the south side of butte lake and will be moving towards canyon dam. Hopefully can get some good night work in as tuesdays forecast is not good.
 
Dm33, Thanks much for the report!

I just talked to a good buddy and old Boss in Chester that has a place in Seneca. He figures that the fire will be at his place tomorrow if it already hasn't burnt through the area. He has a nice, real nice, little cabin on his own acres that he built with his own milled timber and hands. He said that he had cut down a few trees around the place and cleaned up any brush. Also, the FS maybe?, came in a "jelled" his cabin so as to help it from catching on fire if/when it goes thru.

My Bud's pretty upset at the possible loss of his dream place but what's a guy to do? I sent him my prayers, hope that helps!!

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
Sage, I hope they can stop it before it reaches Seneca and your buddy doesn't lose his cabin. The southeastern flank of the fire that went around the south end of Butt Lake doesn't look good. The resourses to fight the fires are becoming thin with all of the fires we have burning.
I continue to pray that they can get a handle on this fire and get it stopped, but more than that....safety for the firefighters.
 
Dmil & Dmic, if you go back and read my posts, you'll see I never disrespected the FS or BLM, just mentioned their thought process on putting out fires, one time. And I don't think either of you will dispute that statement. I actually stood up for you guys, but I'm no expert on what you do.

I can say that when I've seen inmates defecate in the woods, they've always taken a tool with them. Can't say they actually buried anything but although parts of my job in the past has been to directly supervise a "defecation," that isn't so on a fire.

DJ, I appreciate the back up BUT people that haven't been sitting at their desk, peacefully eating their lunch and listening to a hunting story, only to be interupted by an alarm in the next building where one of their partners is getting the living crap beat out of them, will never understand. Going 0 to 60, anytime, anyplace, isn't normal for normal people. For us, we just act and think about it later.

Nick, I never said that the majority of "volunteers" are child molesters. I DID say that if you say "Boy Scout Leader" or "Little League Coach" to 100 cops, the majoritie's initial thought will be child molester. I guess you just took it that way. If you can attach a survey or study to dispute this, I'll recant the statement with a sincere apology. I welcome your comment but not you hyper-sensitivity.

Joey, sorry for the extreme sidebar, highjacking the thread. I was in Fort Bragg the last five days and fog sure beats smoke anyday.

Here's why I was there;

6328052.jpg


2666064.jpg


Not only is she beautiful, but she's smart and independant too. And a pretty good shot with a shotgun. And her husband worked 6 seasons with Cal-Fire too, so it's related to the subject at hand.
 
Brother,
Congrats! The years have gone by fast. Hard to believe she's all grown up and married.
I just got back from Emmett. Found one place of interest but we decided not to make an offer on it. Our timing is off about 10 months. The market has really shrunk in regard to what we are looking for. I shamed Pumpkin Head for you, he feels like yote doo and says hello.

Norkal

"INVEST IN LEAD FOR THE TIMES AHEAD!"
 
Slayer, Congrats on the wedding!!

OK, The last map that i seen was looking fairly current. From it, looks like Butt lake is just about burned 360. I fish that lake a bunch. Though it's not the fishery, IMO, that it was before they drained it to repair the Dam, it's still a good one and can be fished well from the shore. So, it's going to take some getting used to, being burned out. I may like it after a year or two with the new growth. I have hunted Mosquito Ridge, south of the lake, quite a few times in the past and some big bucks are known to come from there. The fire should open that country up some, one of the reasons i don't hunt there more often.

Looks like the guys are doing a good job of keeping the fire on the South side of 89 and away from the habitation areas. Right now Seneca shows as not burnt but can't see how that can keep from happening. Hopefully all the "slime" they have sprayed the Buildings with, will keep the structural damage to a minimum.

Here in Westwood, still smokey with visibility only about 1/4 to 1/2 a mile. I'm noticing shifting and gusting winds today, probably not good for the firefighters and their plight.

If any of you guys hear stuff, what's going on, a breakout, where a big buck was seen :), be sure and post it up. My Thanks.and appreciation to all the Guys and Gals fighting fire out there all over our State. Lots going on, Please be safe out there!

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
DJ, Pumpkinhead left me a f*%ked-up message but for some reason my phone didn't pick up the number so I couldn't call him back and leave him one :) Could you text me his number?

Sage/DJ, thanks for the congrats.
 
The latest report says the Fire is now 100% contained. Even yesterday as a bud and i were returning from Susanville, we could not see much more than a mile, if that, because of the smoke. This past month or so, it would have been nice to have been living and breathing elsewhere, it's been bad.

Congrats to those involved and responsible to put out and contain this fire. Because of the remoteness and extreme terrain, i didn't really believe that the fire was going to be contained as small, 75K+ acres, as it was. Great job and seems i hear of only a few injures which all considered, is amazing.

My buddy's cabin in Seneca was saved along with at least most of the other residences down there. The Fire burned all around but it didn't burn the cabins!! Great Job Firefighters and Thanks to those with concern and Info helping this thread along!!!

Joey



"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
I just returned home from the "Chips" fire. I was part of the last Incident Management Team that was there. A very difficult fire to fight in the Feather River Drainage. I know it's difficult to have smoke and congestion in the beautiful town of Chester. I would have to say that the fire burned in a very moisiac pattern and burned a lot of understory. The fire around Butt lake was a low intensity backing fire that cleaned up the down and dead material. I must say that it did burn well as it was alligned with the wind going up Ohio Valley and Clear Creek. Protecting the Senaca community was a top priority as no structures were lost there. Some of my friends on the ground did see some nice bucks out on the Sunflower Rd out to Soda Creek and the top end of Chips Creek. A few bears aswell. The country out there is STEEP and big.

Gary
 
Heard you bought a home??

Congrats!!!

Wish they had phones in Idaho so I could talk to you guys. :)

I just got back from 16 days on the Ponderosa fire. And ordered to relieve someone on the "16" fire. I'll be there tomorrow. Got the horse's blood drawn today so I can still take them to Wyoming next week, unless the Governor cancels all vacations. :-(
 
Hunter,
Yes, a little place in Emmett. You know you are welcome there any time. They have phones, it's just that the switch-board operator has a hard time with names and you have to describe the person to her. With pumpkin head that shouldn't be an issue!
Check out the YARD BUCK thread. Have you seen this guy hang'n around. I haven't seen him or the rest of the herd in about three days.

Norkal


"INVEST IN LEAD FOR THE TIMES AHEAD!"
 

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