Big Game Management - Share your opinion

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Alright, I was reading another thread where folks were debating elk management in Utah. Don Peay (SFW Lobbyist) posted a reply (http://www.monstermuleys.info/dcforum/DCForumID5/16746.html#3) that leads me to believe that he feels that managing for 100% success and having fewer hunters afield is better than mananging herds for 33% success and allowing 3 times more hunters.

So my question is, what would you rather see?

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com
 
IMO, 100% success is what they do on high fence ranches. I guess I was raised with the understanding that you go hunting, and there's a decent chance you won't get an animal. I also like to go hunting as often as possible and take my chances on whether I can be successful or not. I personally don't want to see the day when I only get to break my rifle out of the closet every 5-6 years to go deer hunting, even if it's managed for 100% success and big bucks are standing next to the road.

Don stated in that post of his that maybe other states have it wrong and Utah has it right.........
If the UDWR shares that opinion, then I'm sure the day will come when Utah mule deer are managed the same way.

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com
 
Yea Brian I read that also. Bottom line is that the rut hunt generates more $. They get 5% of the tags, so if the hunt started later they could issue MORE tags and still get their 5%. Just sell them for less.
 
Don and UDWR have it backwards.

The hardest part of hunting 400" elk in Utah is drawing the tag.

The hardest part of hunting should be the hunt, not the draw.

Grizzly
 
>IMO, 100% success is what they
>do on high fence ranches.
>I guess I was raised
>with the understanding that you
>go hunting, and there's a
>decent chance you won't get
>an animal. I also like
>to go hunting as often
>as possible and take my
>chances on whether I can
>be successful or not. I
>personally don't want to see
>the day when I only
>get to break my rifle
>out of the closet every
>5-6 years to go deer
>hunting, even if it's managed
>for 100% success and big
>bucks are standing next to
>the road.
>
>Don stated in that post of
>his that maybe other states
>have it wrong and Utah
>has it right.........
>If the UDWR shares that opinion,
>then I'm sure the day
>will come when Utah mule
>deer are managed the same
>way.
>
>Brian Latturner
>MonsterMuleys.com

I 100% agree with what you said.
 
Brian,

I agree wholeheartedly. I like to trophy hunt, but I think sometimes we as trophy hunters may get a little selfish. I have kids who are just starting to hunt. Although I have put in the time and effort to "contaminate them with the disease," it has been a struggle. Hunting just continues to get more and more complicated and other competing activities just crowd hunting out if you are not extremely dedicated to it.

Although many hunters feel this is a good thing- "if your not serious about it, get out of the way," I think it is having a negative impact on the hunting community in general. If you make hunting unrealistic for the "average joes," yes, that leaves more deer for everyone else, but it also diminishes the size of the hunting community.

One of the strengths of hunting in the past was that it was accessible to the average person. How many times did those of us who had the opportunity to hunt 30-40 years ago drag a friend or relative along and help them shoot their first deer and have their first hunting experience.

Now I realize their are complicated issues and deer numbers are extremely low, but maybe us trophy hunters ought to step back a little bit once in awhile and realize that our drive to kill the trophy buck may be influencing us to support policies which are detrimental to hunting as a whole in the long run.

I believe continuing to cut tags is one of those things. It satisfies our trophy hunting desires to "get the uncommitted" out of the way, but it may ultimately lead to the end of hunting for everybody.

Personally, I believe we have got to find a way to restore the resource. Cutting tags doesn't do that, it simply manages the current resources for a different priority while driving many people away from the lifestyle.
 
Honestly, when I read the post I could not believe that Don wrote it. It is completely contrary to how 99.9% of Utah hunters started hunting. Even in the glory days the success rates were well below 50%, even less than they are today for much of the 1980s. The UDWR sells hunters to opportunity to hunt. They do not sell a Kill permit. We all can't hunt until we fill our tag. All Western states figure unsuccessful hunters when making tag allocations- both for antlered and antlerless.

Unfortunately, the way Utah's mule deer management is being pushed, we will see higher success rates and much longerrrrr wait times to draw. And the vocal minority will never be happy-- they even complained to the Mule Deer Committee, whined at the RACs and expressed frustration to the Board about the DECLINING quality on the Henry Mtns. Unbelievable. The inches race has an unquenchable thirst.

The sad thing is the vast majority of hunters just want to hunt. Guys draw awesome elk tags and then shoot the first 6 point they see. They do not care about score and inches. I enjoy the Any Bull units, where a guy hunts and can shoot whatever he is willing to work for, be it a mature bull or a spike.
 
Our obsession with inches and score is killing our hunting priviledge. The more we obsess over inches and score the fewer tags will be available and the fewer folks will hunt. That means my son will lose interest in hunting and my future grandchildren will not even have the opportunity. We need to get the score out of management decisions. Without the necessity of killing a XXX" bull/buck the influence of the dollar will not be as strong either.

Phantom Hunter
 
Well, I'm definitely guilty of being a trophy hunter and I like big stuff a lot, but not to the point where I only get to hunt every 10 years, even if the unit is managed for me to be guaranteed an animal. It's not worth it!!!
Just the thought of managing our wildlife like a high fence operation sickens me....100% success.....you've got to be kidding me.

Can SOMEONE who supports this management practice please try to explain to me why it's good for the vast majority of sportsmen in this state?

Comments like that scare the heck out of me, because Don drives the ship in Utah and when I invision what things could look like in 20 years, it's scary.
Manage for 100% success?!?!?!?!?!?!!?

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com
 
I agree with you. I think Arizona has it right. With a lot less to work with than other states they have a great job maximizing the opportunity and trophy potential at the same time. Utah has done a good job at maximizing profits. To increase opportunity they would need to shorten seasons, change dates and or make units less accessible none of which will make tags sell for more money. A lot of people want to measure their trophy only in inches not how much effort they put into the hunt to achieve the trophy. The easier and the bigger the better. Kind of mirrors our society in general today. Scary to think what tomorrow may be like.
 
I'd rather see Don Peay go away never to be heard from again and our big game herds managed for whats best for the herds and not inches or bank accounts.

No estas en mexico ahora, entonces escoja tu basura
chancho sucio.
 
>Honestly, when I read the post
>I could not believe that
>Don wrote it. It
>is completely contrary to how
>99.9% of Utah hunters started
>hunting. Even in the
>glory days the success rates
>were well below 50%, even
>less than they are today
>for much of the 1980s.
> The UDWR sells hunters
>to opportunity to hunt.
>They do not sell a
>Kill permit. We all
>can't hunt until we fill
>our tag. All
>Western states figure unsuccessful hunters
>when making tag allocations- both
>for antlered and antlerless.
>
>Unfortunately, the way Utah's mule deer
>management is being pushed, we
>will see higher success rates
>and much longerrrrr wait times
>to draw. And the
>vocal minority will never be
>happy-- they even complained to
>the Mule Deer Committee, whined
>at the RACs and expressed
>frustration to the Board about
>the DECLINING quality on the
>Henry Mtns. Unbelievable. The
>inches race has an unquenchable
>thirst.
>
>The sad thing is the vast
>majority of hunters just want
>to hunt. Guys draw
>awesome elk tags and then
>shoot the first 6 point
>they see. They do
>not care about score and
>inches. I enjoy the
>Any Bull units, where a
>guy hunts and can shoot
>whatever he is willing to
>work for, be it a
>mature bull or a spike.
>


Well said Packout!
 
With rifle/scope combos that can reach out 1000+ yards how can there not be close to 100% success rates.

I would love to know how many wounded animals there really are. If you were to take that into account there are probably double the animals killed as there are tags that are issued. That being the case, we need to cut tags in half...
 
As long as Utah's "management train" is being conducted by Don Peay and SFW, it will continue down the path of "Trophy Management", removing the average joe hunter from the game. It leaves a real sick feeling in the pit of my stomach thinking that Utah mule deer hunting for the 95% of us who just want to go hunting may be gone in just a few short years!
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-14-10 AT 08:11PM (MST)[p]Its called hunting not killing. The hunt is worth way more to me than just killing something. Ya that's the goal and I'm not afraid to eat tag soup. I would rather be able to hunt every year and work my butt off for a chance at a big buck than hunt once every ten years.

If you want a guaranteed big buck then wait your time and put in for the pauns or the henries. They are managed for a trophy. Doing that to the whole state is rediculous!

Let's make sfw a bad memory and let the state manage them. You all say the state is only after money, they will manage for a healthy herd so they can make money. A health deer grows big antlers and everyone will be happy.

The luster of a big buck or bull is the "untouchable" status they have. If everyone starts killing them then they lose their luster then what do we have?

Manage for a healthy herd and go hunting every year.

4b1db2ac644136c4.jpg
 
I believe they manage for 100% success in Texas, and they can probably grow all the 400" bulls a guy wants for the right money....
 
justr86,
What has the state done to manage the herd correctly up to this point? They have not and did not at any time. That is the reason SFW was able to get a strong hold to begin with. What if tag numbers had not been cut and we kept pounding the deer like we where. Please! I do not agree with 100% success and I surely would like to see the SFW and MDF and any other group do more for our dwindling herds, but the state has been proven to be incompitent in managing our deer herds. They gave the power to SFW by poor mangement to start with and they are the ones that provide the high dollar tags every year. Don does not steal them! The DWR offers them and they take them.

Hell the DWR does not even rely on actual counts any more they use the simulation. Go ask the guys that hunted pronghorn on the Parker this year how accurate the simulation was for that!!!!!

There is more than one flavor of Kool Aid being served out there and I sure dont want to be in the line for the flavor you prefer.


There are not enough deer in Utah...FOR REAL.
 
I personally like Don and I do appreciate the role he plays. He and SFW really do some good stuff, but man, when I see him post that managing for 100% success is what he believes could be the answer, I worry.

Don almost always gets things his way in the end. Atleast that's how I see it. That Antelope Island hunt was one of the few things Don couldn't make happen....until this year that is. If 100% success is what he wants to see, then my belief is that he'll begin steering things that way.

I just worry that 20 years from now most mule deer hunting in Utah will be just like the elk hunting, something that only a few get to enjoy each year.

Now, you guys might think I'm nuts to think Don Peay can drive the ship here in Utah in whatever direction he wants, but he does have a track record for getting things he wants. I hope I'm wrong and that his 2 cents are worth just that, but..........??????

Don, or someone who agrees with 100% success management, let's hear from you. Maybe I'm wrong and just need to hear why that's good.

Brian Latturner
MonsterMuleys.com
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-15-10 AT 12:12PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Oct-15-10 AT 12:10?PM (MST)

In my opinion I have 100% success every year I get to go out and hunt. ITS A HUNT! NOT A SHOOT! And 100% success accounts to more dollars than Sense in this post the way I read it. I think Utah does have some work to do in making our hunts better but I think limiting hunting oppertunity will do nothing more than screw us all in the future by leaving out youth who will someday vote and run our country and its laws and if hunting is of no interest or tradition to them we are done too. As far as elk hunting I feel I have better odds of hittin the lottery than drwaing a tag in Utah, and I dont care to rub shoulders with 500 other pumpkins on a few thousand acres out there in a few of the open Bull units we have. In my mind there are several ways to make deer hunting in Utah better and people can still hunt. (1.) Stop shooting Doe's unless the habitat can absolutely not support that many deer( enough things kill doe's I.E. Snow, lions, coyotes,and cars!). (2.) Make a 3 point or better rule we still get our tag and get to hunt we just cant wack every stupid Two point that does'nt know he's in deep $#!*.(3.) Shorten the Bow season a week. (4.) Have a management hunt for the Youth the first week in November on all the Units l.E./General/L.E. (cull bucks).(5.) Make units, do away with Regions. Now all feel free to tell me Im high/stupid/Dumb/make no sense etc.. JMOP
 
Me personally. I think that general season mule deer hunting in Utah is a total joke and I am a lifetime license holder and have not even went or opened the envelope for years. I don't want to waste my time. I, personally, would rather hunt every few years and have decent to above average quality than every year and watch people bang and shoot every two point that moves. That is why I apply in all of the surrounding states and build points and continue to apply. Everyone is different and wants different things in what they experience. I think the good old days of general season deer hunting are long gone. To many things have changed and that is an entire different question in itself.
 
So when you started hunting you only hunted every couple of years and only shot big bucks. I know that when I started and gained my love for hunting. I wanted to hunt all the time if you take that away from the young hunters they will never love the hunt not the kill the way we do.
I have killed some nice animals and alot of so so animals and also tag soup. I would rather tag soup every year and be able to hunt than once every 5 or 10 years they have to cut the tag numbers not the days of hunting.
with cwmu's and all the LE units it is hard enough to hunt if you don't have alot of money. utah is turning into one big high fence high dollar hunting. we give cwmu's tags that they can hunt from sept to january then they tell us we can only hunt 4 weeks archery and 5 days muzzleloader and 3 days rifle but if you have private land then you can do what you want in the same areas. don't make scence they don't want the public to hunt just the high dollar guys. they forget how much money all of us public hunters put in the comunity. the anybull units are a joke and now they are goning to do the same with the deer
 
Don Peay wants "SOCIALIST HUNTING"....everyone gets a slice of the pie BUT you're going to have to wait years and years for the product. I and I believe MOST hard working MM'ers, prefer "CAPITALIST HUNTING"....You will get your due reward if you put in the time and effort.

Knowing I can carry a tag along with my family or friends is FAR more valuable than a once every decade crack at a monster bull or buck.
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-17-10 AT 10:14AM (MST)[p]I would like to see more opportunity for the average hunters here in Utah. We all can't hunt Wyoming, Colorado, and Nevada every year like most of you. Many of us are students, or just average guys that can get out on weekends and can't afford to hunt out of state.
The success rate on the "Any Bull" units here in Utah is terrible. Many people I know have never killed a bull in 15+ years of hunting and several have given up. There are decent spots, and some select guys do get it done every year. But most of these guys are working thier tails off to get a bull. Something that you couldn't expect a kid or grandpa to do on a hunt.
We need more opportunities for "Everyone" to enjoy hunting. Sure everyone has thier own definition of a successful hunt. But I would at least like to see an animal on a hunt to say it was successful.
The post I created about the Managment Elk hunt was just another idea to get some more tags out there. I would love to have a chance at a raghorn or small 6 point every year. I would much rather do that than wait 20 years for a 350 bull. It's fun to get out and, and it's even more fun when you know you will have a chance at bringing something home.

Managment for 100% killing success is crap! Nobody wants to wait 20 years to kill a bull.
 
Nobody wants 100% success? Then why are all the premium tags so hard to draw?

I've never heard anybody say "I went on a elk hunt and was surrounded by big bulls all day long, it was terrible! I really wanted to work my butt off on this hunt, and then eat tag soup."

The real problem is that it's impossible to turn the whole state (any state) into a 100% success rate without denying most hunters opportunity.

Even if you turned the whole state into 100% success, your next "problem" would be: "I saw over 100 bulls that would score between 390 and 400. Good bulls, but everybody shoots those these days, so I wanted something special. These idiots shooting immature 390 bulls are ruining it for the trophy hunters."

Having said that, I get the feeling that Don Peay would like to sell limited tags state wide to the few elite, and the rest of you can shoot coyotes and jackrabbits, and plant buck brush. Don Peay should probably buy a huge ranch in Texas and manage it how he sees fit.
 
Eyecrazy, Yes I grew up hunting deer every year and it was not that great. I could hardly wait to go out of state even as a teenager. Now my kids will grow up hunting turkeys rather than deer in Utah. Times change. I make it a priority to make sure that I apply in surrounding states and up my odds of having quality tags each and every year. It is a high priority for me to do so. I choose to do this and not do other things. Priorities are different for different people. My opinion is mine and yours is yours and that is what makes the world go round. Nobody is right nor is anyone wrong. We can agree to disagree and you apply where you want and I will do the same and it does not matter. I can tell you right now that I will send my boy in for every tag possible when he gets of age and he will have ample opportunities to hunt and no I am far from rich; it is a priority.
 
Even cutting tags in half is not going to fix the problem, There is 97000 hunters, they kill 40000 deer a year, you cut the hunters to 50,000 hunters they still kill 40,000 deer, you just raised the hunter success rate but did nothing for the deer.

According to the DWR it is not the bucks that determine herd size, it is doe and fawn. supposively in early 80 was some of the best fawn productions. I want to know what the predator numbers were like in the early 80, How many bear, how many lion, how many coyote, and how many bobcat? I dont know about you but I never seen a bear in the mid 80 to early 90s, and now I cant go out with out seeing 2-5 bears. to see a lion was almost un heard of, but now people see them. Trappers use to keep the woods cleaned up of predators. My grandpa was a state trapper, and he would go off for weeks trapping everything they could, and bear were not present much, very few. Mountain lion was a treat if they even seen a track, mainly caught coyote, fox, and he helped get ride of the last wolves. Predator numbers are a huge impact on the deer, weither you believe it or not.

This will make all the houndsmen happy but lets get rid of some major predators just to see if the fawn production improves, what will it hurt to thin the bear down by 50% in the state, and the lions as well.
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-17-10 AT 02:21PM (MST)[p]I think 100% managment is the only long term solution, of course it might only be 90% ,but strict managment is the only way quality can be maintained. Chute planes, web cams, 1000yd rifles, 100yd bows, hard core high tec hunters,posse hunting, ect, there is no way to maintain quality or a quality experence for hunters without strict managment going into the future, its just the way it is, were just too efficient and were getting more so all the time,there isn't enough wild country out there. Of course Im talking about whats on the horizon here, not next year. I think deer managment should be more like what the state of Nevada does, and elk should stay the same, elk are just too vulnerable in most of Utah.
 
I would like to see a reduction in tags especially on our general season units. I wish for the next five yrs. shut down one general season unit to hunting each yr open it the next yr. Units like the vernon a management hunt get rid of those monster 2 and 3 points. Maybe we could make a few archery only units as well on those units no grouse hunters and spike and cow hunters only big bull hunters. General elk I think there should be a big reduction in tags one canyon me and my buddies were in had 22 guys in orange. Wasatch Front Extended lets do a draw Everyone with an archery tag puts in online and maybe give 200 tags. For people who worry about only huntin deer every 5 to 6 yrs. look into some out of state over the counters or draws or yrs you dont draw hit the hills lookin for That 400 or 200 inch monsters set of sheds. Just my opinion doesnt mean its right but i think it would boost our quality of animals and we would have general season hunting opportunities at animals like they do in wyoming.
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-17-10 AT 07:28PM (MST)[p]I'm in the middle on this one. I really would like more opportunity to hunt, but I would like an opportunity to take a good animal as well. I don't believe we should manage our deer like our elk, we are in a mess there already.

There are those who say they would like to hunt a rag horn or small six every year. Well I hate to burst your bubble, when it comes to elk, you still would not be hunting every year or even every other. Maybe every third year you would get a chance maybe every five. I for one don't want to wait five years to draw a tag to shoot a rag horn. I would rather shoot a cow. I waited 21 years to draw an elk tag and I can say it was worth every minute of the wait.

As far as the deer go, I think part of our problem is the dedicated hunter program. No one should be able to put that much pressure on a deer herd. And lets be honest, the dwr is struggling to find projects for theses guys and most of the time they are giving out hours that were not served. Before you DH guys start on me, I was one of you once, so I've been there.

The deer hunt in Utah is a family institution. It always has been and I think it always should be. You have to keep the gerations together and give grandpa an opportuninty to sit around the campfire with those kids and tell his stories about the big bucks that got away. That is where the future of our sport lies, in the dreams of our children. You can preach all you want about buck to doe ratios and wanting to kill a trophy, but if you don't institute a management plan that includes keeping families and kids together in the mountain, this sport will die.

And you an I will still be on this website blaming eachother. Keep the kids interested and keep them coming back. They get bored with seeing no deer and they get bored if they can not draw a tag. There is somewhere in the middle that they can have both........the far left and far right are both losing propositions.
 
littlejoe all I was trying to say is yes we can put our kids in for great tags. my son and I just got back from wyoming but do you think our kids will be able to aforded it when they start their familys or are you going to keep footing the bill. I have a 17 a 21 and a 25 two fo them still live at home.
the oldest has a family but not alot of money. when I was young we servived on game it was cheeper to hunt than to buy beef at the store but that is all gone.
 
I don't know how long I will support my kids but I will as long as I can and want too. If that requires me to help them out through high school, college, etc. and they are good kids I will help them out. They don't and I won't. Life is not fair and if someone cannot afford to apply that is just a part of life. I make it a priority to have the funds to play the application game and will continue to do so. It gets more expensive by the year and will continue to do so and that is just how it is. We play the game or we don't. Yes, it is sad that the youth of today are not given the same opportunities as we were or are parents were but in other areas my kids have so many more opportunities than I ever had. Some grow, some shrink, cycle of life I guess. I just wish there was a right answer to satisfy everyone but that will never ever be the case. We could put 100 of us in a room to come up with a management plan and there would be 100 different ways and after discussing for days or weeks or months there would still be 75 different ways. Support what you believe in and do what you can is about the best current option.
 
Just a word concerning Don Peay.

As is obvious from the above posts, Don is not everyone's favorite guy, and quite frankly I don't agree with much of what he and SFW support- high dollar hunting. But...

What we as hunters need to realize is that Don Peay is not our worst enemy. In my opinion, the extreme environmentalist movement is.

Even though I don't agree with Don's vision of the future of hunting, he is a hunter, and I believe in his own way is trying to preserve that heritage- even though his ideas are much different than mine.

What we as hunters need to realize is that the very concept of hunting is very much under attack, and as big as the management issues we argue over are, they will be irrelevant if we don't win the war against the extreme environmentalists.

The war with the extreme environmentalists is a political war. Although I believe Don has padded his own priorities along the way at the expense of the average hunter, there is no one doing anywhere near what Don is doing in the war against the extreme environmentalists. And that is the war that will ultimately seal the fate of hunters one way or the other.
 
I don't think this thread is about an extreme environment, or Don Peay, its about big game management, and Utah in particular. And how that management effects the real world of Big game hunting, the people that care about the sport, and the recruitment of young hunters into the sport.
 
If you don't think the extreme environmental movement has a huge impact on the science and politics which drive the big game and habitat management which "effects the real world of Big game hunting, the people that care about the sport, and the recruitment of young hunters into the sport," you are very naive.
 
Managing for 100% success is definitely not the answer. I like big bucks and bulls as much as the next guy, but the 200"/400" mentality isn't leading our sport down a very bright path.

I have nothing personally against Don Peay, but I don't agree with the majority of what SFW does for (or to?) hunting opportunity in the state of Utah. If Don decides to reply in this thread it will undoubtedly be another novel-length "toot-toot" session about all the great things he and SFW have accomplished, and about how much time and effort he and the other SFW'ers put in for wildlife. I don't disagree for a minute that Don and his staff have done a lot of good for wildlife in the state...I also don't disagree that they all work hard.

I'm afraid of what could happen to mule deer opportunity in this state once SFW smells the blood in the water regarding trophy bucks and the dollars they can bring in. As most everyone else has mentioned, we only need to look at the elk situation for reference.
 
You can dang well bet that as long as this state allows Don to manage its wildlife, his pockets will continue to fatten and your hunting opportunity will continue to dwindle. You have to understand what drives the guy! 100 percent success simply means more money in his pocket, and less opportunity for you!

It's really very simple to understand!

Have a good one. BB
 
wstrntines
you cant be serious are you? Whats the matter you cant kill a buck on the front or you cant find a buck on the front? Either way it doesnt matter its TARD thinking!

First off the Front is not managed for trophy quality. It was created to keep pressure on the deer and keep them out of the back yards and off the roads and out of the grills of vehicles. This is why they still let you kill does on the unit.

It is by far the best unit in this state right now for quality and opportunity so why would you screw it up?

200 tags is not enough tags to keep the herd under objective!!!

making it a draw is TARD thinking at its worst!!!!

4a7d1f93337c7fd7.jpg


There are no big bucks in Utah! LOL
 
I don't believe that 100% is plausible let alone possible... They may manage for 100%, but you can never achieve that. And it's futile to try. 100% implies guarantee, which is never the case when HUNTING. Tags would need to be reduced drastically in order to attain a 100% success rate. The whole state would be like drawing the current LE units.
NOT harvesting an animal is part of hunting... I have hunted for 15 years. I have harvested 7 deer in that time. 5 rifle, 2 archery. I have not hunted rifle since 2004. So in the last 6 seasons, I have harvested 2 deer with my bow. No trophies. I have had opportunities at what I consider trophies (ie 160+") and that has made the hunts worth it- but they were no guarantee. They were a product of my hard work and skill.

I would love if general season deer units were 33% success rates. That would take out about 30,000 deer which is apparently less than are killed now?? Anyway, I want opportunity to hunt regularly, not every 10 years only. I'm too busy trying to work to think to much into this right now... Just thought I'd share a thought...


"Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!" 2 Ne. 28: 24
 
LAST EDITED ON Oct-19-10 AT 12:32PM (MST)[p]I don't think anyone mean't 100% literally, I kind of see things differently, I sometimes look at the grays river country in WY. and think, I would rather hunt once every five or ten years and have a quality memorable experence like what was available in the 1980s than hunt it every year for twenty years and have it like it is now. I think given a choice most people would prefer the three week mule deer hunt in northern Nevada once every four years, than every year for four years in the three day Northern Utah general season. I know that young people need a quality experience to hold on the the sport and become advocates for hunting, and I see a lot of kids droping out and not pursuring the sport, and thats in WY where the general hunts are leaps and bounds above Utahs. Most of the time I believe the reason is a lack of a quality adventure. Four or five trips in the general season pumpkin patch and most kids are done, one time going on a L.E. elk hunt and you may have a life long enthusiast, even if its not their tag. These are just my opinions though.
 

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