270 weatherby mag elk/distance gun?

J

jbear

Guest
Will the 270 weatherby mag be an effective elk gun at longer distaces 700-800 yards if loaded properly? I know members will bring up the 7mm mag or 30 calibers as better calibers. The ballistic are very similar to the 7mm mag from what I can tell but I am no expert. Something keeps drawing me back to this caliber. I also no ammo is expensive!!!
 
Will it be effective at 700-800 yards? yes it will only if you are proficient enough to put a well constructed bullet into the vitals at that range.

I would consider using the Nosler Partition bullet as the front part will still expand at the lower velocity you will incounter at that range, and the protected rear half will stay together to punch though bone at shorter ranges or distance.
Some of the other "tougher constructed" bullets have a tendency not to expand very much at a severe decrease in velocity at longer ranges.

RELH
 
Any bullet begins to tumble as its velocity drops below the speed of sound. I'm not sure what velocity you think you will get with your 270 Weatherby, but most bullets will be down around the speed of sound at somewhere near 700 yards. Obviously this depends upon ballistic coefficient, bullet weight and initial velocity. Once the bullet starts to tumble, groups are measured in multiple feet, not inches, and bullet construction matters little as you can't count on frontal impact.
All long range guns suffer from this limitation. The main reason people typically use a minimum of .30 cal bullets is to keep the projectile above the speed of sound at greater distance. As you drop the caliber, and hence bullet weight, velocity at long range drops quickly. This is why the .50 BMG is so effective at incredible range - it is still above the speed of sound at well over 1000 yards.
You can probably kill an elk with a 270 Weatherby at 800 yards, but it is beginning to be more about luck than skill, and ethics are certainly questionable. Practice with your rifle bullet combo at the above ranges, and you will quickly learn if it is possible (certain) with your set-up.
Bill
 
LMAO, Lammapacker!! He said, "Any bullet begins to tumble as its velocity drops below the speed of sound. I'm not sure what velocity you think you will get with your 270 Weatherby, but most bullets will be down around the speed of sound at somewhere near 700 yards. Obviously this depends upon ballistic coefficient, bullet weight and initial velocity. Once the bullet starts to tumble, groups are measured in multiple feet, not inches, and bullet construction matters little as you can't count on frontal impact.
All long range guns suffer from this limitation. The main reason people typically use a minimum of .30 cal bullets is to keep the projectile above the speed of sound at greater distance. As you drop the caliber, and hence bullet weight, velocity at long range drops quickly. This is why the .50 BMG is so effective at incredible range - it is still above the speed of sound at well over 1000 yards."


That whole first paragraph is classic, "i don't know what the hell i'm talking about here but if i try to sound like i do, maybe someone will believe it" :) :) :) Too funny!!

Ethics? Yes, always come into play but the OP is asking about the cartridges ability. With the correct bullets, i'd have to say yes, most bullets won't "tumble" and some will have plenty enough speed, makeup, and down range retained energy to function properly and successfully.

Would i try it? Not on bet, never!!

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-19-12 AT 09:47AM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Dec-19-12 AT 09:40?AM (MST)

I'd really consider the source of the above post by llamapacker...lots of misinformation in that.

If you're shooting a roundball, in front of black powder, out of a 30/30, the numbers posted above may jive. But I can assure you that a 270 Weatherby will not be sub-sonic at anything close to 700 yards. Nor will most other high-power rifles from the .22 centerfires to .375's.

For the record, the speed of sound is only a bit over 1125 FPS....give or take for elevation, etc.

A 140 grain .270 bullet with a BC of .496 started at a modest 3200 fps will not be subsonic until slightly over 1500 yards.

The reason that many people choose larger calibers for long range work is not because .30's stay above the speed of sound any longer. There are other reasons (good ones, high BC, sectional density, blah, blah, blah) for .30 choices. However, some of the reasons have more to do with a short pee-pee, and a general lack of knowledge regarding LR shooting, than anything else.

Assuming a solid platform, true MOA accuracy (hopefully better, but MOA will get you there). A rifleman with skills to match, as well as the ability to know if a shot of 700-800 is doable according to conditions (wind, angle, etc.)...the .270 wby is capable of it.

The weak link in the whole equation is obviously the guy working the trigger...shots like that dont (and shouldnt) happen unless you really have your chit together.
 
There is a series of videos produced by NSSF and Gunsite, I believe, showing the effects of falling below the speed of sound and bullets tumbling. Don't believe me, but I am happy to consider them the experts.
The real question for the caliber in question is how fast is the bullet going at the muzzle and the ballistic coefficient and bullet weight, to determine the velocity at distance.
The Sierra manual shows a 130 grain bullet leaving the muzzle at 3200 fps will still be traveling at 1339 fps at 1000 yards. The speed of sound is rounghly 1125-1150 fps, depending on temperature, humidity, etc. This load would not reach a subsonic speed until about 1200 yards.
If the same bullet left the muzzle at 2800 fps, according to Sierra, it will be at 1127 fps at 1000 yards, or effectively subsonic.
Now change the bullet to something with a lower BC, and the range at which the bullet becomes subsonic will be considerably less.
Lots to consider when shooting at long ranges. It appears from the Sierra manual that a 130 grain Sierra 270 bullet will be subsonic between 1000-1200 yards, depending on initial velocity. So 800 yards shouldn't be a problem if using a bullet with high ballistic coefficient. Throw in a low BC 270 bullet and you will be starting to push the envelope.
Shooting skills and ethics are a whole different discussion. The point is you need to know a lot about your specific load before answering these type of questions categorically.
Bill
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-19-12 AT 10:51PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Dec-19-12 AT 10:50?PM (MST)

Really llamapacker?

Who's going to buy a 270 wby and shoot a 130 at 2800 fps? Akin to buying a corvette and setting the governor on 45 mph.

As someone already mentioned, Nosler is coming out with a 150 AccubondLR. I'd guess 3200-3300 would be no problem for that bullet out of the wby.

I think their advertised BC is generous, but I'm sure it will be .550 or better. If I had a .270 wby, I'd be snapping some of those bullets up the minute they hit the shelf. They wont be subsonic anywhere near 1k, and thats a fact.
 
WB said, "You need to figure out how much speed will get the bullet to expand, then work back from there."

More practical wisdom in that one little sentence than Lama had in half a book...and a irrelevant to the question half a book too.

I would have liked to read Reddogs first reply to Lamma, can understand his frustration.

Thru my 270WSM, this WSM case holds very near the same volume of powder as the 270 WBY mag., i'll be shooting these 150 gr. Nosler Accubond ALR bullets at or very near 3200 FPS. BC is rated at .625. Tumbling bullets are not even a issue and i don't need to refer to "gunsite" to know that!

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-20-12 AT 11:44AM (MST)[p]The Nosler offering looks very nice. They won't hit that BC by any means but a high BC in an Accubond has a lot of us drooling. Seems to be the middle ground between the Barnes and Berger.
If I recall these should open in the 1300-1500 fps range rather than the 1800 they normally cite.
 
WBob, yeah, i figure. But even if only a true BC of .55 or .57, when you combine that with the proven deep penetrating wound channel that the Accubond is known for on game, the possibilities for longer range hunters is exciting.

I'm too old and set in my ways to start shooting at game much over 500 yards. That, 500 yards, in itself is one heck of a long ways, IMO, to be shooting at any other than targets, steel, or varmints. Though my equipment will certainly get the job done, i'm just not going to do it!

Joey


"It's all about knowing what your firearms practical limitations are and combining that with your own personal limitations!"
 
JBear
your 270 Weatherby is not all that much different from my 7mm WSM in ballistics. Yes those shots are very doable if you are capable of doing your part and you rifle is capable. It will require a top quality range finder, a wind meter (either of the last 2 should have a thermometer), and a ballistic program/tables. Developing a hand load that shoots very accurate is required. I feel you can find a factory load that will work to 400 to 500 yards, but beyond that hand loads are required for consistent long range shots. And by the way, it will require pratice.

Below target was at 719 yards shooting 168 grain Berger VLD hunting bullets. Shots were taken prone with a bi-pod (field conditions).

Llama,
do you notice any tumbling or a group measured in feet???

8270005_-_copy_-_copy.jpg
 
so with everything you mentioned above about the 270wsm do you feel it will do the job on an elk out to 800yrds? do you know what kind of energy the bullet has at that distance? My plan is to reload as you mentioned.

Have you shot your 270wsm out to 1000yrd? I would amaging the energy would not be there.
Thanks for any advice/help.
 
LAST EDITED ON Dec-20-12 AT 10:40PM (MST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Dec-20-12 AT 10:34?PM (MST)

Llamapacker said;
"I'm not sure what velocity you think you will get with your 270 Weatherby, but most bullets will be down around the speed of sound at somewhere near 700 yards"
The 270 Weatherby with the 140 gr Accubond with a more realistic BC of .495 started at 3200 which is easily obtainable is supersonic to 1600 yards at 5000 ft elevation and 60 degree temperature.
I think someone should run the ballistics on said cartridge before they spout out misinformation like this.
The 270 Weatherby with the right bullet is more than capable to take elk to 1000 yards if you are proficient enough to do the job and the rifle is capable of MOA or better accuracy.
jbear
Here ya go look it up for yourself.

Llamapacker, my 264 Win Mag with 140 gr Bergers going 3280 fps at 5000 ft elevation and 60 degrees is still supersonic at 2000 yards. { Thats 1.13 miles, not many .30's can do that.)

http://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmcard-5.1.cgi
 
The 270wsm has become my favorite caliber. Try taking a look at the matrix line of bullets. 165gr 270cal bullet is awesome. Can't wait for the 150gr nosler accubond long range either. Pushing them to 3200 will be awesome.

Imo more important than anything is knowing your rifle and practicing with it. I shoot year round and can hands down say my shooting has improved vastly. A tuned trigger is a huge improvement also.
 

Click-a-Pic ... Details & Bigger Photos

Member Gallery Photos and Videos!

Beautiful Archery Score for BIGOLMULEY
IMG_2048.jpeg
Super Cool Muley Photo
59A30748-E38F-4E64-B0F2-0508C5D38AEB.jpeg
FB_IMG_1637533828659.jpg
VideoCapture_20211114-072838.jpg
C2D9B919-EF39-48EF-AABD-029F29198A4D.jpeg
IMG_5053.jpeg
657E3824-73A8-4D49-B983-441B488AEF2F.jpeg
IMG_3167.JPG
20201003_174123.png
IMG_4459.JPG
Back
Top Bottom