Out of State Hunters

slamdunk · Oct 21, 2024

ColdBore · Oct 21, 2024

notdonhunting said:
Any public land?
How is the private property owners on allowing hunting?

The Game Commission owns 1.5 million acres of Game Lands, managed for hunting.

There are 2.2 million acres of state forests.

Most of the state parks that aren't in urban areas allow hunting.

And it's still possible to get permission from landowners, timber companies, etc, as leasing hasn't taken over here (yet....).

diablo · Oct 21, 2024

slamdunk said:
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You call that a stick?! It’s clearly a twig?! SMFH!

vansterdam123 · Oct 21, 2024

ktg said:
One example, odds for youth draw-only general elk are twice as good for non-residents.

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Very very rare.

Tackdriver · Oct 21, 2024

you guys are so dumb, its clearly a branch

tracker12 · Oct 21, 2024

rockroller said:
The proof is on the draw odds for my unit. I could move out of state and hunt my unit twice as much.

please share what Unit and tags you are referring to. I find it hard to believe a NR can “Draw” and tag in any unit easier than a NR.

ridgetops · Oct 21, 2024

tracker12 said:
please share what Unit and tags you are referring to. I find it hard to believe a NR can “Draw” and tag in any unit easier than a NR.

Please don't. Tracker, PM sent.

elkantlers · Oct 21, 2024

ColdBore said:
I live in PA. We offer some excellent hunting, and make it very easy and affordable for a non-resident.

$102 for a NR license, that gets you a deer and two turkeys. You can get antlerless tags for $27, and a second spring gobbler tag for $42. Bear is $37, and PA has some of the largest bears in the country. Elk is by draw, but only $250, and again, PA has some huge bulls.

I'd say that's not a bad deal for any non-resident.

Oh, and we have some pretty decent deer here too.

That's the conundrum, lots of tags but no place for most people to hunt or no tags and tons of public ground.
If you can figure out how to change that you'd be my hero.

elkassassin · Oct 21, 2024

There's One Bad Thing about A PA Hunter Coming To Utah To Hunt Bear!

First Words Out Of Their Mouths:

And I Quote:

I WILL NOT SHOOT A BLACK BEAR!

Well!

If You Won't Shoot A Black Bear You Can Turn Your Ass Around & Go Home,It's The Only Kinda Bears We Have!

LOL!

What They Are Sayin Is This:

To Be A Great White Hunter In PA You've Gotta Have A Color Phase Bear On Your Wall!

!

ColdBore said:
I live in PA. We offer some excellent hunting, and make it very easy and affordable for a non-resident.

$102 for a NR license, that gets you a deer and two turkeys. You can get antlerless tags for $27, and a second spring gobbler tag for $42. Bear is $37, and PA has some of the largest bears in the country. Elk is by draw, but only $250, and again, PA has some huge bulls.

I'd say that's not a bad deal for any non-resident.

Oh, and we have some pretty decent deer here too.

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ColdBore · Oct 21, 2024

elkantlers said:
That's the conundrum, lots of tags but no place for most people to hunt or no tags and tons of public ground.
If you can figure out how to change that you'd be my hero.

ColdBore said:
The Game Commission owns 1.5 million acres of Game Lands, managed for hunting.

There are 2.2 million acres of state forests.

Most of the state parks that aren't in urban areas allow hunting.

And it's still possible to get permission from landowners, timber companies, etc, as leasing hasn't taken over here (yet....).

Did you read my next post? Almost 4 million acres, right off the bat, and fairly easy access to a lot more.

ColdBore · Oct 21, 2024

elkassassin said:
There's One Bad Thing about A PA Hunter Coming To Utah To Hunt Bear!

First Words Out Of Their Mouths:

And I Quote:

I WILL NOT SHOOT A BLACK BEAR!

Well!

If You Won't Shoot A Black Bear You Can Turn Your Ass Around & Go Home,It's The Only Kinda Bears We Have!

LOL!

What They Are Sayin Is This:

To Be A Great White Hunter In PA You've Gotta Have A Color Phase Bear On Your Wall!

!

If you say so.

elkassassin · Oct 21, 2024

I Know So!

ColdBore said:
If you say so.

Bluehair · Oct 22, 2024

Tackdriver said:
you guys are so dumb, its clearly a branch

Constrained by your white privilege. That is the universal symbol of oppression.

Or food depending on where you’re from.

montezumarchery · Oct 22, 2024

Bluehair said:
Constrained by your white privilege. That is the universal symbol of oppression.

Or food depending on where you’re from.

Nope, its just a China made back scratcher

vansterdam123 · Oct 22, 2024

rockroller said:
The proof is on the draw odds for my unit. I could move out of state and hunt my unit twice as much.

No way. That doesn't happen except for an occasional nuance with youth tags.

Simpleton · Oct 22, 2024

vansterdam123 said:
Very very rare.

Not rare at all. The majority of general season deer tags are more easily drawn by a NR than a Resident.

Simpleton · Oct 22, 2024

vansterdam123 said:
No way. That doesn't happen except for an occasional nuance with youth tags.

Take a quick peak at the general season deer drawing odds and points report provided by the state. Even the table that shows the conglomerate draw shows that on average the odds are better for NR. This doesn't hold true for LE or OIL tags, but it most certainly does for General Season Deer.

Vanilla · Oct 22, 2024

Draw odds are a bad way of looking at it, IMO. If they only give one NR tag, but only two NRs apply, should we take away that tag simply because the two willing to apply had a 50/50 shot? I’d say no.

I think the only NRs we need to cut out are the whiny, entitled, non-appreciative ones. I’m sure AI can do a quick internet search, identify these folks, and block them from applying ever again. All others are welcome if they want to have crappy deer units overrun by millions of rude resident hunters. Utah really is a bad place. Stay away at all costs!

Simpleton · Oct 22, 2024

Vanilla said:
Draw odds are a bad way of looking at it, IMO. If they only give one NR tag, but only two NRs apply, should we take away that tag simply because the two willing to apply had a 50/50 shot? I’d say no.

I agree, draw odds on the general are a bad view of it. They should be compared at the number of points needed to draw out as general is a preference draw, not a bonus draw. Even in looking at it with this lens, the same holds true that there are many general season deer tags that a NR can hunt more frequently than that resident can.

Robiland · Oct 22, 2024

Simpleton said:
I agree, draw odds on the general are a bad view of it. They should be compared at the number of points needed to draw out as general is a preference draw, not a bonus draw. Even in looking at it with this lens, the same holds true that there are many general season deer tags that a NR can hunt more frequently than that resident can.

All that means is that the NR are smarter than you think and not enough apply because the unit may not be that good. But the Res think they want to hunt it since they've been hunting it as a family since the beginning of time. But those odds really dont mean anything comparing general odds. But if you want to look at LE, then there you go. Take the Henrys for example. NR will likely NEVER draw that unit since there is 1 or 2 tags total. The demand is too high, even for MAX point holders. But will be different for Res with Max points.

khunter · Oct 22, 2024

This thread went nowhere fast…

Simpleton · Oct 22, 2024

Robiland said:
All that means is that the NR are smarter than you think and not enough apply because the unit may not be that good. But the Res think they want to hunt it since they've been hunting it as a family since the beginning of time. But those odds really dont mean anything comparing general odds. But if you want to look at LE, then there you go. Take the Henrys for example. NR will likely NEVER draw that unit since there is 1 or 2 tags total. The demand is too high, even for MAX point holders. But will be different for Res with Max points.

I'm not complaining about it, I am just showing that @rockroller (the OP) is correct. He can correct me if I am wrong, but based on what he posted, I believe he was talking about general deer tags, not LE.

vansterdam123 · Oct 22, 2024

Simpleton said:
Not rare at all. The majority of general season deer tags are more easily drawn by a NR than a Resident.

Nowhere near the majority. A few, perhaps.

And NONE if you consider how many utah residents with lifetime licenses have general deer tags for those units every year.

rockroller · Oct 22, 2024

vansterdam123 said:
Nowhere near the majority. A few, perhaps.

And NONE if you consider how many utah residents with lifetime licenses have general deer tags for those units every year.

So your changing your tune from no way it happens to a few
Must have actually looked at stats. All I mentioned was the unit I hunt in.

vansterdam123 · Oct 22, 2024

rockroller said:
So your changing your tune from no way it happens to a few
Must have actually looked at stats. All I mentioned was the unit I hunt in.

No way, it doesn't happen. Still a valid statement as you would need to consider all the lifetime license holders to make this analysis complete.

In total, Utah is among the most NR hostile of all western draws. While interesting, this nuance doesn't change that conclusion.

Vanilla · Oct 22, 2024

vansterdam123 said:
In total, Utah is among the most NR hostile of all western draws. While interesting, this nuance doesn't change that conclusion.

I kind of call BS on this. It doesn’t really matter in the end, but I think this is just objectively wrong.

Bux n Dux · Oct 23, 2024

vansterdam123 said:
No way, it doesn't happen. Still a valid statement as you would need to consider all the lifetime license holders to make this analysis complete.

In total, Utah is among the most NR hostile of all western draws. While interesting, this nuance doesn't change that conclusion.

Not even close

slamdunk · Oct 23, 2024

vansterdam123 said:
Nowhere near the majority. A few, perhaps.

And NONE if you consider how many utah residents with lifetime licenses have general deer tags for those units every year.

No one ever considers the fact that not all Lifetime license holders even use them.
I personally work with two people who were gifted LL's as kids decades ago and neither of them even hunt anymore.

I'd like to see data on scenarios like this.

Simpleton · Oct 23, 2024

vansterdam123 said:
Nowhere near the majority. A few, perhaps.

And NONE if you consider how many utah residents with lifetime licenses have general deer tags for those units every year.

No, it is quite literally the majority. Pull up the data and see for yourself if you don't believe me.

And right around 10% off all LL are held by non-residents. Again, if you don't believe me, you are free to look up the actual data yourself.

notdonhunting · Oct 23, 2024

Simpleton, let me get this straight you believe majority of general deer permits are sold to out of staters?
Is that what you are saying?
Forgive me if I am mixed up I have not been following ths thread too close.

Robiland · Oct 23, 2024

Simpleton said:
I'm not complaining about it, I am just showing that @rockroller (the OP) is correct. He can correct me if I am wrong, but based on what he posted, I believe he was talking about general deer tags, not LE.

What I am saying is supply and demand/quality. If it is a quality unit, it will be tough to draw. Thats why there are units that NR can draw easier. Why? Because those that know, know not to apply for that unit. Lots to consider. Cost, time, travel, expense and so on. Its not worth a NR to apply for a shiddy unit. But for some, they dont care and apply anyways. They just want to hunt.

Simpleton · Oct 23, 2024

notdonhunting said:
Simpleton, let me get this straight you believe majority of general deer permits are sold to out of staters?
Is that what you are saying?
Forgive me if I am mixed up I have not been following ths thread too close.

No, that is not what I believe, nor what I am saying. I am simply saying that the actual numbers support the OP's statement:

rockroller said:
It sure doesn't seem right when out of state deer hunters are almost guaranteed a tag every year when us locals are lucky to get to hunt every three or four years in our home unit.

There are 104 different general season application options in Utah for buck deer. 57 (the majority) of them are drawn more easily by NR than a resident. 42 are drawn more easily by a resident. The remaining are equivalent.

In 2024, 3485 resident, and 345 NR obtained a tag using their LL.

In 2024, the total general season deer tags given out in the draw (not counting land owner or LL) was 43,750 Resident, 3,962 NR.

ColdBore · Oct 23, 2024

slamdunk said:
No one ever considers the fact that not all Lifetime license holders even use them.
I personally work with two people who were gifted LL's as kids decades ago and neither of them even hunt anymore.

I'd like to see data on scenarios like this.

It would probably be impossible to accurately identify, but it would be interesting.

Zach01 · Oct 23, 2024

I just got back from a general deer hunt in southern utah and had a good time. The residents were friendly and I had breakfast with some one morning. I passed a lot of young bucks and didn't find anything I wanted to shoot. The pressure was what I expected for a general unit hunt and I didn't see any unethical behavior. It made me happy to see so many familes hunting together. While it's not my style, they seemed content shooting whatever buck they came across. I'd go back, but I'd probably do the muzzy hunt instead though.

Weiserbucks · Oct 23, 2024

slamdunk said:
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That's obviously a limb.

BeDawg · Oct 24, 2024

The real reason a NR can draw some GS tags easier than a Utah resident is simple. The hunt really isn’t worth the effort to drive and spend vacation time for. I feel like 10% of tags to NR is the bottom of the barrel. Should be more like 20%.

It’s a quality issue. Make it better quality by cutting more resident tags and you will have your wish. NR draw odds will become far worse than resident draw odds.

Dangbig · Oct 24, 2024

slamdunk said:
No one ever considers the fact that not all Lifetime license holders even use them.
I personally work with two people who were gifted LL's as kids decades ago and neither of them even hunt anymore.

I'd like to see data on scenarios like this.

Same I know several

SHB · Oct 24, 2024

Mallardsx2 · Friday at 4:43 AM

vansterdam123 said:
No way, it doesn't happen. Still a valid statement as you would need to consider all the lifetime license holders to make this analysis complete.

In total, Utah is among the most NR hostile of all western draws. While interesting, this nuance doesn't change that conclusion.

North Dakota says “hold my beer”

ColdBore · 2024-10-31T07:46:00-0600

ColdBore said:
I live in PA. We offer some excellent hunting, and make it very easy and affordable for a non-resident.

$102 for a NR license, that gets you a deer and two turkeys. You can get antlerless tags for $27, and a second spring gobbler tag for $42. Bear is $37, and PA has some of the largest bears in the country. Elk is by draw, but only $250, and again, PA has some huge bulls.

I'd say that's not a bad deal for any non-resident.

Oh, and we have some pretty decent deer here too.

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