Vote in November to Ban Mountain Lion hunting!!

It’s on the Ballot to vote this November! 1st wolves now lions! Deer and Elk are next!!

Coloradan's better show up and vote! They will NOT stop.

Seems about right. I plan to vote, but I have zero hope that it won’t pass.

Colorado nurtured and catered to the leftist culture for well over a decade which encouraged more leftists to move there now the state is under leftist control.

The lesson is here is you can't keep a rattlesnake as a pet and not expect to get bit.

I would like to donate to this cause, does anyone know what organizations are putting up the biggest fight against this?

Mark,

Everyone needs to donate to CRWM

For more information and possibly some encouragement, check out this link:

The large number of non-voters in this political blow-hard state is unreal. If these peeps would get off their dam phone and vote rather than bich about the outcomes of the voting we'd be in a whole lot better position. Encourage folks to register and vote. 1 Million + eligible non-voters in Colorado.

I betting it will pass. Last I heard the vast majority of funding pouring into Save the hunt and Howl was nonresident money. Residents won’t even open their wallet you think their going to get off the ass and go vote.

thicketmaster said:

It’s on the Ballot to vote this November! 1st wolves now lions! Deer and Elk are next!!

A Big Cat Hunting Ban Would Cost Colorado More Than $60 Million, Study Shows

A new report from a non-partisan research group looks at the economic impacts that a big cat hunting ban would have on the state's economy.

www.outdoorlife.com

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Nope bears will be next. That way they have all the Apex predators protected then the deer and elk will have even more problems trying to survive.

Gjkimber45 said:

Nope bears will be next. That way they have all the Apex predators protected then the deer and elk will have even more problems trying to survive.

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Yep! And you will be called nuts for saying this. Give it 5-10 years. And give it another few years and the need for hunting will be gone. Anti hunters are way better at the long game then we are.

I had participated in a Q&A Thursday with proponents of the measure. They are starting: trophy hunting , fair chase, and lack of value to the state all based around emotions. They include the lynx in the measure too making it appear as the lynx needs protection. False advertisement and messaging which was clearly pointed out to them. Discrimination was brought to them as well against rural customs and cultures. They don't care how they win, just as long as they win and sportspersons lose.

1989Cohunter said:

Yep! And you will be called nuts for saying this. Give it 5-10 years. And give it another few years and the need for hunting will be gone. Anti hunters are way better at the long game then we are.

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Vote conservative for your Gov! They would have a lot of sway in these matters. Unfortunately, your big metropolis's (ESPECIALLY DENVER) have more sway via numbers.

That's why California is where it is, Sac, LA, Bay Area, and San Diego trump everybody else. Eff the country folks, it's all about the city folk making the rules.

A note to all the fisherman- the same groups funding the ban also would like to see the torturing on fish (catching/catch and release) to stop as they feel this is not necessary in today's world.

In just the last 6 months 42000 Illegals have been shipped to Denver alone.

Their predation of both votes and wildlife is another gift from the libs that needs to be delt with.

Tom Tancredo is a dumbass. Tell everyone you know

Udall has always been a democrat stooge.

Bluehair said:

Tom Tancredo is a dumbass. Tell everyone you know

Udall has always been a democrat stooge.

Supporters of Colorado trophy hunting ban announce bipartisan endorsements • Colorado Newsline

The organization behind a ballot initiative to ban large cat hunting in Colorado announced a slew of endorsements.

coloradonewsline.com

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What an idiot - how would they use this ban sparingly! What have they exhausted? He is an absolute idiot with his comments and support. I am so glad he is no longer representing Colorado.

Thill said:

What an idiot - how would they use this ban sparingly! What have they exhausted? He is an absolute idiot with his comments and support. I am so glad he is no longer representing Colorado.

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Yeah, and who’s shipping the hides to China? Maybe a Utah outfitter has set up a shipping company?

What about "trophy" desert bighorn sheep populations in Western Colorado. The CPW enacted regulations a few years back to increase mtn lion quotas in Western Colorado because the desert sheep population was in peril due to all of the lions in that area. What happens if lions are no longer hunted in those areas? Will the "trophy" desert sheep slowly but surely disappear from Colorado? There are a bunch of journal publications that document mortality of desert and bighorn sheep populations by lions.

Although, many predators kill bighorn sheep, only mountain lions are currently considered to be the primary proximate cause of mortality for many bighorn sheep populations.

Control of mountain lions, when mountain lion-ungulate ratios are high, might be required to protect small or endangered bighorn sheep populations, and to produce bighorn sheep for restoration efforts. © 2017 The Wildlife Society.


Once in danger of becoming extinct, the desert bighorn sheep (Ovis canadensis) have made a comeback in parts of western Colorado. A small population was reintroduced to Colorado National Monument in 1979. Over 230 sheep have been sighted and monitored across the public lands of the Grand Valley, including Colorado National Monument and the neighboring McInnis Canyons wilderness area.

Predation by mountain lions, Puma concolor, is recognized as a potentially major threat to desert bighorn sheep, Ovis canadensis nelson, populations. Although of secondary importance to disease, mountain lion predation has been implicated in reducing bighorn sheep populations in no less than 10 studies. Mountain lion predation is often thought to exacerbate the effects of disease and declining habitat quality (such as drought), but predation alone can have substantial effects when either individual mountain lions specialize in killing sheep or mountain lions switch prey when other prey (typically mule deer, Odocoileus hemionus) change in availability.

Here's an interesting New Mexico desert sheep article:



Figure 2. Population estimates of bighorn in New Mexico before and after implementation of the cougar removal program 1980-2008 (237 bighorn released 1987-2001, and 178 bighorn released 2001-2008).

Science and Hard Work, A Story About Saving Desert Bighorn Sheep in New Mexico

Elise J. GoldsteinEric M. RomingerBryan C. Bartlett

Desert bighorn sheep populations in New Mexico are on the rise, as evidenced by downlisting them from state endangered to state threatened in 2008. Historically, desert bighorn likely roamed most arid mountain ranges in southern New Mexico. Unfortunately, populations had declined significantly by the early 1990s, and by 1940only 2 populations remained. Thus began a long and ongoing effort by many individuals, organizations, and agencies, to save desert bighorn in New Mexico.

The Desert Bighorn Recovery Program

Recognizing the need for source stock to repopulate wild herds, the New Mexico Department of Game and Fish (NMDGF) started a captive breeding program at the Red Rock Wildlife Area in 1972. It has since been expanded to encompass 5 km2 of canyons, springs, and steep slopes that the bighorn population calls home. Since 1979, a total of 353 bighorn have been transplanted out of the facility and into the wild. Thanks to our friends in Arizona, an additional 74 have been transplanted from the Kofa National Wildlife Refuge, AZ.Desert bighorn were listed as a state endangered species in New Mexico in 1980. Despite transplant efforts, bighorn recovery made scant progress as numbers in the wild never exceeded 215 in the 1980s and 1990s.

Monitoring efforts in the 1990s documented that cougar predation was responsible for approximately 85% of all known-caused mortality of radio collared desert bighorn. This prompted the State Game Commission to approve a management action to remove cougars in desert bighorn range. Cougar removal was effectively implemented in autumn 2001 by contracted snaremen and houndsmen, when the statewide wild desert bighorn population was less than 170. Cougar control was conducted in the Peloncillo, Hatchet, San Andres, and Ladron mountains. In the Fra Cristobal Mountains, cougar removal intensity varied over time such that cougar control was established only rarely, resulting in a less aggressive management action. In conjunction with cougar removal, all adult bighorn transplanted to the wild were radio collared, and field biologists monitored the populations topromptly detect mortalities and facilitate cougar capture when necessary. Annual ground and/or helicopter population surveys were conducted to monitor population size.

The Program’s Impact on Cougars

Cougars are a big game animal in New Mexico, with a hunting season from October to April. Under the bighorn protection program, an average of 3.3 cougars was killed per mountain range each year. Removal occurred on less than 1% of total cougar habitat in New Mexico, and represents less than 1% of the estimated statewide population. The total number of cougars killed per management zone, including those taken specifically to protect bighorn, has been below the maximum number allowed to maintain sustainable cougar populations as established in the NMDGF Harvest Management Matrix.The

Program’s Impact on BighornMortality rates - To evaluate the impact cougar predation has had on desert bighorn populations in the New Mexico, we collected data from radiocollared bighorn from 1992-2008 and estimated mortality rates under different management regimes. Mortality data was divided into 3 time periods: 1) a period of minimum protection when few cougars were removed to protect bighorn,; 2) a period of partial protection when some cougarswere removed (Fra Cristobals only); and 3) a period of maximum protection that occurred after cougar removal resulted in no cougar predation for a minimum of 6 months, and continued as long as cougar removal efforts were implemented. The statewide desert bighorn total mortality rate decreased from 0.23 during the period of minimum protection, to 0.16 during the period of partial protection in the Fra Cristobals, to 0.10 during the period of maximum protection.

During these same periods, the statewide cougar predation rate declined from 0.17, to 0.09, to 0.05.We compared these results with a population model based on bighorn herds in NM. The model predicted that with a cougar predation rate of 0.0, none of the 5 herds would go extinct in 100 years. With a cougar predation rate of 0.05 all herds had at least a 53% chance of extinction in 94 years, and with a cougar predation rate of 0.10 all herds had a 100% chance of extinction in 26 years. Therefore, mortality risks have declined from extinction in less than 26 years, to extinction in about 26 years in the Fra Cristobals, to a 50/50 chance of extinction in the next 100 years in the other herds. For a more detailed analysis, you can access the Evaluation of an 8-year Mountain Lion Removal Management Action on

Endangered Desert Bighorn Sheep Recovery at www.wildlife.state.nm.us/conservation/bighorn/documents/lions.htmPopulation growth -The impact of cougar removal on bighorn herds can easily be seen in the accompanying graph which illustrates the constant desert bighorn population trend from 1987-2001 when cougars were not removed to protect bighorn, and the substantial increase from 2002-2008 when cougars were actively removed to protect bighorn. The cougar control program, in combination with transplants from Red Rock into the wild, resulted in the population increasing from less than 170 in 2001 to approximately 450 in 2008, and the subsequent downlisting of desert bighorn from endangered to threatened. Given the small number of listed species that recover enough to be downlisted, this is a major victory for bighorn!As bighorn populations grow large enough to sustain some cougar predation without compromising the herd, cougar removal can be reduced. However, current levels of adult losses combined with high lamb mortality limits population growth in most years, leaving the current cougar removal strategy in place.

With statewide numbers increasing, we are in the preliminary phase of considering additional bighorn hunting licenses. While implementation may still be a few seasons away, downlisting desert bighorn is the first step in increasing hunting opportunities so that sportsmen can benefit from the bighorn’s success. This, in turn will help to raise more funds, and increase public awareness concerning the need to balance science and hard work to “put more sheep on the mountain”. Figure 2. Population estimates of bighorn in New Mexico before and after implementation of the cougar removal program 1980-2008 (237 bighorn released 1987-2001, and 178 bighorn released 2001-2008).

New Mexico's desert sheep success story! Take a look at the last sentence in this article!


Background: While desert bighorn sheep currently live in the American Southwest and Mexico, there are not nearly as many as there were historically. What was once several thousand desert bighorn sheep in New Mexico, declined until they almost went extinct in the early 1900s. Commercial hunting, over-grazing, and diseases from livestock (which they have no resistance to) were the principal causes of decline. By 1955 desert bighorn sheep were only found in two separate mountain ranges in New Mexico, and by 1980 they numbered less than 100 individuals. In 1980 they were added to the state endangered species list.

Numbers went up and down over the next 20 years, rising to over 200 in the 1990s, but dropping to less than 170 by 2001. In 1999 an important decision was made that would end up saving desert bighorn sheep from disappearing in New Mexico. The Department of Game and Fish knew that cougars were the primary cause for the low numbers of desert bighorn sheep. In one study, biologists found that 85% of the radio-collared bighorn sheep biologists that died were killed by cougars. Between 1996-2002, the number of distinct, wild populations of desert bighorn sheep went from 7 to 4 following the extinction of the Alamo Hueco, Animas Mountains, and San Andres Mountains herds. Historically, desert bighorn were in at least 14 mountain ranges in central and southern New Mexico!

Something had to be done to stop the loss of more populations and possibly the complete disappearance of desert bighorn sheep from New Mexico. The decision was made to start removing some cougars from where desert bighorn sheep lived. Removal of cougars began in 1999 but successful efforts did not start until 2001. Since desert bighorn sheep were not being attacked and eaten by cougars so frequently, their numbers increased drastically. Cougars still are there in desert bighorn sheep habitat but at lower levels than would occur without predator control methods such as snaring and trapping. Cougar control is critical but is just one of many wildlife management tools used to protect desert bighorn sheep.

The sharp increase in bighorn sheep led to their down-listing to threatened status in 2008 and their removal from threatened status in 2012.

The lions have been on our local desert population for 20 years that I know of. The canyons are not favorable to running dogs.

But you are right, this will only make matters worse.

I really haven't seen much publicity or mention about lion impacts to wild sheep across Colorado. This is another major factor in favor of lion hunting.

You are right that some sheep country is rough but my guess is that if a lion can climb rocks so can dogs! Also, as our deer population across Colorado continues to drop into the toilet mtn lions concentrate on other prey. As mentioned in multiple publications, mtn lions are a nightmare to wild sheep populations. Our wild sheep populations across Colorado will likely take a major hit if lions are not hunted.

Colorado is officially becoming California. Sad!

I am little spooked right now. One of my buddies has reached out several times to Dan Gates offering to make sizeable donation amounts and Dan Gates is not returning calls or emails. My buddy has reached out to RMEF and they are helping him/me to use this money to create bumper stickers and such for distribution. It is critical we start getting this message out.

It’s already over sadly. Vote Republican

It would be great if news media could be used to spread the news about the dire consequences that the public may not be aware about if lion hunting is canned. The demise of wild sheep is one prime example of this. How many Colorado residents would like to see iconic wild sheep populations across Colorado tank? Some of the lion-human conflicts that occur in California where lion hunting has already been eliminated may be something else to educate the public about. There likely are other reasons to stop this?

My take on it is the public needs to be educated on the negative impacts via news media, bumper-stickers or other means.

Thill said:

I am little spooked right now. One of my buddies has reached out several times to Dan Gates offering to make sizeable donation amounts and Dan Gates is not returning calls or emails. My buddy has reached out to RMEF and they are helping him/me to use this money to create bumper stickers and such for distribution. It is critical we start getting this message out.

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I guess I rattled a few cages, Dan Gates just reached out to me and we had a brief discussion about what has transpired and will transpire. Now that we have a ballot number, we will start seeing some targeted announcements about defeating the ballot box biology.

There are a million logical reasons why this doesn’t make sense. Unfortunately it’s emotional/ideological issue.

A difficult argument for a guy like me to win. I end up saying things like, “well, all the immigrants will go hungry because there won’t be any more pets to eat”. I’m just not good at it.

California Mountain Lion Fatal and Nonfatal Human Attacks

Notice how many mountain lion attacks have occurred since 1990 when lion hunting was banned!

Note how many children have been attacked! All of fatal attacks have been older full-grown humans. 50/50 of the fatal attacks have been woman/men. You may also notice that in recent years a higher % of attacks have been children.

jims said:

California Mountain Lion Fatal and Nonfatal Human Attacks

Notice how many mountain lion attacks have occurred since 1990 when lion hunting was banned!

Note how many children have been attacked! All of fatal attacks have been older full-grown humans. 50/50 of the fatal attacks have been woman/men. You may also notice that in recent years a higher % of attacks have been children.

Date	Type	Attack Location	County	Victim Sex	Victim Age
March 1986	Nonfatal	Caspers Wilderness Park	Orange	Female	5 yrs.
Oct. 1986	Nonfatal	Caspers Wilderness Park	Orange	Male	6 yrs.
March 1992	Nonfatal	Gaviota State Park	Santa Barbara	Male	9 yrs.
Sept. 1993	Nonfatal	Cuyamaca State Park	San Diego	Female	10 yrs.
Apr. 1994	Fatal	Auburn State Recreation Area	El Dorado	Female	40 yrs.
Aug. 1994	Nonfatal	Mendocino County (remote)	Mendocino	Male	48 yrs.
Nonfatal	Female	48 yrs.
Dec. 1994	Fatal	Cuyamaca State Park	San Diego	Female	56 yrs.
Mar. 1995	Nonfatal	Mt. Lowe (San Gabriel Mtns.)	Los Angeles	Male	27 yrs.
Jan. 2004	Fatal	Whiting Ranch Regional Park	Orange	Male	35 yrs.
Jan. 2004	Nonfatal	Whiting Ranch Regional Park	Orange	Female	30 yrs.
June 2004	Nonfatal	Sequoia National Forest	Tulare	Female	28 yrs.
Jan. 2007	Nonfatal	Prairie Creek Redwoods State Park	Humboldt	Male	70 yrs.
Jul. 2012	Nonfatal	Confluence of Shady Creek and Yuba River	Nevada	Male	63 yrs.
Sept. 2014	Nonfatal	Cupertino	Santa Clara	Male	6 yrs.
May 2019	Nonfatal	Los Peñasquitos Canyon Preserve	San Diego	Male	4 yrs.
January 2020	Nonfatal	Whiting Ranch Wilderness Park	Orange	Male	3 yrs.
February 2020	Nonfatal	Rancho San Antonio County Park	Santa Clara	Female	6 yrs.
June 2020	Nonfatal	Blue Sky Ecological Reserve	San Diego	Male	4 yrs.
August 2021	Nonfatal	Calabasas (Santa Monica Mtns.)	Los Angeles	Male	5 yrs.
May 2022	Nonfatal	Big Bar (Trinity River)	Trinity	Female	24 yrs.
Sept. 2022	Nonfatal	Pico Canyon Park	Los Angeles	Male	7 yrs.
February 2023	Nonfatal	Half Moon Bay	San Mateo	Male	5 yrs.
Mar. 2024	!Nonfatal	El Dorado County (Remote)	El Dorado	Male	18 yrs
Mar. 2024	Fatal	El Dorado County (Remote)	El Dorado	Male	21 yrs
Sept. 2024	Nonfatal	Malibu Creek State Park	Los Angeles	Male	5 yrs

Verified Mountain Lion-Human Attacks

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This is the knowledge we need to publicize.
Thank you for sharing.

There’s a lengthy list of black bear human fatal and nonfatal reports in North America as well. I was not aware that there have been so many black bear fatalities in North America until I started diving into this.

I read a book on bears years ago. They said a Brown/Grizzly was more likely to attack you but least likely to finish it. They just wanted to show you there're the baddest thing in the woods. They said a Black Bear was least likely to attack you but if they attacked they mean to finish it. I thought that was interesting.