mnhunter102
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Looking at building a new mule deer and pronghorn gun, have my eye on the 6mm Creedmoor. Anyone have some good success? And your favorite ribs through it?
I disagree. I’d rather have somebody that shoots a 243 very well than someone who’s trigger shy, shooting a 300 win mag. I bet you $100 bill. You wouldn’t see a bit difference in wounding loss. A poorly shot and wounded elk with a 300 win mag is still going to be poorly shot and wounded. Larger cartridges do not make up for poor shots.Yes, and W.D. Bell killed over 1,000 elephants with a 7x57 mauser. That doesn't mean it is the best choice for today's elephant hunters.
I acknowledged just about anything will kill. The 6 Creed is not the best choice for large game, which seems hard to dispute.
I use the ELDX and have had excellent results on lighter game. I know that every year thousands of animals are culled with 22LR. That doesn't mean it is some magically new great hunting round.
We are not talking about some poor native trying to find one gun that "works" in all scenarios. Match the round to the game you are after seems like sound advice in every case. Most of us on these forums can afford at least a couple rifles.
Proving that you can kill with ANY cartridge is hardly convincing. Let the masses start using a cartridge not well suited to the task at hand and you will see wounding rates sky rocket.
Bill
Couldn't have said it better myself. You can use it to effectively kill an elk or big muley buck, even at longer ranges but there are better choices out there.I love my 6 Creed, and use it for antelope and Coues deer. I'm not sure why anyone would want to use it for elk. Mule deer maybe, but not the big old bucks. And yes, I know it will kill, but it is definitely light for the larger animals, and there are much better choices available.
I will restrict mine to shooting animals weighing under 250 pounds or so, and know the results will be fantastic.
Bill
I completely agree that somebody shooting a 243 is much better than someone with a 300 win who is "trigger shy." It still doesn't make a 243 or 6mm Creed a better choice for elk than a 300 win. I've shot deer with everything from a 223 rem to a 338 lapua. With a well placed shot, at a reasonable range for that cartridge/bullet, deer and elk will die quickly from either cartridge.I disagree. I’d rather have somebody that shoots a 243 very well than someone who’s trigger shy, shooting a 300 win mag. I bet you $100 bill. You wouldn’t see a bit difference in wounding loss. A poorly shot and wounded elk with a 300 win mag is still going to be poorly shot and wounded. Larger cartridges do not make up for poor shots.
I would stay away from the outdated advice of using a tough bullet in an 6CM and use something like a Nosler ballistic tip, 108 ELDM, 105 or 108 berger.
Trigger warning alert: if you don’t like the 6Creedmoor’s stay away from Rokslide in the thread of people shooting everything from moose, elk, deer, bear, and antelope with a 223 with a 77 TMK. Again bullet choice matters
Are your whities this big?I don’t have too much experience with whitetail, but why do people differentiate between calibers that are good for whitetail and calibers that are good for muleys? Seems like a mature whitetail can be big bodied too, but many say a 243/6mm is great for whitetail but a little small for mule deer.
Granted most of my whitetail and muley experience is in western Kansas. They are close enough it doesn’t matter. Killed many with .308, .243, 22-250, and .223 out to 500ishI don’t have too much experience with whitetail, but why do people differentiate between calibers that are good for whitetail and calibers that are good for muleys? Seems like a mature whitetail can be big bodied too, but many say a 243/6mm is great for whitetail but a little small for mule deer.
Nice buck. I don’t know how much that deer weighs or the difference in hide thickness and bone density compared to a mature whitetail. Again I am not to familiar with whitetail but I do understand they are vastly different in Saskatchewan as compared to coues in Arizona. I’ve never really seen anything that has made me believe mule deer can take being shot better than mature whitetail. A good shot is a good shot and a bad shot is a bad shot. I just think thousands of big mule deer have been shot and killed with a .243 shooting 85gr in a slow twist barrel just fine. Great buck but I would be confident it would have died just fine with a 6mm 105hyb. And I still love my 300win
A big northern whitetail buck is no different than a big mule deer buck. Most whitetail bucks killed in the US are significantly smaller than a mature mule deer buck and the shot distance is also considerably closer on most whitetail bucks.Nice buck. I don’t know how much that deer weighs or the difference in hide thickness and bone density compared to a mature whitetail. Again I am not to familiar with whitetail but I do understand they are vastly different in Saskatchewan as compared to coues in Arizona. I’ve never really seen anything that has made me believe mule deer can take being shot better than mature whitetail. A good shot is a good shot and a bad shot is a bad shot. I just think thousands of big mule deer have been shot and killed with a .243 shooting 85gr in a slow twist barrel just fine. Great buck but I would be confident it would have died just fine with a 6mm 105hyb. And I still love my 300win
Oh lord here we go. Not only are elk shoulders bulletproof, mule deer’s are to now,A big northern whitetail buck is no different than a big mule deer buck. Most whitetail bucks killed in the US are significantly smaller than a mature mule deer buck and the shot distance is also considerably closer on most whitetail bucks.
Comparing a Coues whitetail to a mule deer buck is like comparing a coyote to a wolf. There is is a significant difference in size.
I've shot a big mule deer buck in the shoulder with a 243. It lacked the penetration. I had to walk up to it and shoot it again. If I had shot it with my 300 win mag, it would have been dead shortly after the first shot.
I was just using it as an example of why the 243 or 6mm Creed may not be the best choice for large mule deer bucks. You can absolutely kill deer or elk with a 243 win or 6mm Creed. Many of us just prefer something a little larger because a larger cartridge will make a difference.Oh lord here we go. Not only are elk shoulders bulletproof, mule deer’s are to now,
???
I'm sure it works well. If I was in Australia culling wild burros, I would also choose a gun that is more enjoyable to shoot. While target practicing, I can enjoy shooting 100+ rounds from my 6mm Creed but have never had the desire to shoot 100+ rounds from my 300 win or 338 lapua in a single day.I know a guy that dumps wild burros with a 243. Supposedly the corelockts hammer them out to 400 yards.
We can all agree that a 6.5 Creed is the best choice for 1000 yard shots at elephants. The real debate in this thread is if a 6mm Creed is a good idea for 900 yard shots on elk.Does this mean the 6.5 Creedmoor has been knocked of its pedestal by the 6 Creedmoor?
Totally agree that shot placement is more important than caliber. A grizzly bear was killed in Alaska with a 22 LR. I'm not packing a 22 LR in bear country when I have better choices.I actually agree with you and littlebighorn. Bigger guns give you more wiggle room for error. I guess my point is I think bullet selection and shot placement is probably more important than caliber. I shot a muley with my 300 last year and had to shoot him again as he hobbled away because I made a poor shot. A friend of mine had a big bodied muley shot with a 243 with a 105 Berger over 500 yards and it was dead before it hit the ground.
I guess it kind of depends. There are people that I don’t think it’s a good idea when they take 100 yards shots a with a 300 WM.I was just using it as an example of why the 243 or 6mm Creed may not be the best choice for large mule deer bucks. You can absolutely kill deer or elk with a 243 win or 6mm Creed. Many of us just prefer something a little larger because a larger cartridge will make a difference.
You also typed "Killed many with .308, .243, 22-250, and .223 out to 500ish" Are you seriously saying a 223 for 500 yards at a deer is a good idea?
For a 500 yard shot on a big muley buck or big whitetail buck, would you rather have a 223 or a 308?
Your friend doesn't understand ballistics. And Rokslide is the last place I'd get info from. mtmuleyI will also say I don’t enjoy recoil. Maybe that makes me a Sally or weenie, I don’t know, but I would much rather be able to take my 308, 243, 6CM out and burn through 50 rounds of practice ammo in a day and hopefully become better at shooting, reading wind, etc then shoot less and hope the larger cartridge makes up for the lack of practice.
Maybe if I had an identical set up, I could practice with one and hunt with the other I would feel differently.
I have a friend who always wants to shoot a deer farther and further every year. He started out with an 7RM, then 300 win mag, that wasn’t enough so now he has a 338 Lapua. Wants to shoot a deer at 1000 yards. I don’t think that’s a good idea, for multiple reasons. Increasing cartridge size has not made him any better of a shooter. In fact, I will say the opposite.
You’re correct he doesn’t.Your friend doesn't understand ballistics. And Rokslide is the last place I'd get info from. mtmuley
Well said! LolOk only one more, your dream celeb… he, she, them… never know anymore…#?️?. No more on that…?. You can pick, you have a 4” whatever it is you use. Might work ?. Or a 12” you betcha. I apologize in an advance but whyyyyy! I can start a fire with flint n steel, but I have a torch in the corner. I’d use the torch if it was down to the nitty gritty.
Yep me. I don't hide behind a different username on any site. Some how I can't log on on to RS. Haven't been able to for a long time. Also haven't cared enough to figure out why. mtmuleyYou’re correct he doesn’t.
This you? Being a member on rokslide isn’t something to be ashamed about. LolView attachment 113209
I completely agree that somebody shooting a 243 is much better than someone with a 300 win who is "trigger shy." It still doesn't make a 243 or 6mm Creed a better choice for elk than a 300 win. I've shot deer with everything from a 223 rem to a 338 lapua. With a well placed shot, at a reasonable range for that cartridge/bullet, deer and elk will die quickly from either cartridge.
Long range shooting should only be done with larger cartridges. Small cartridges just can't maintain energy/velocity at longer ranges. Unless you can shoot 1/2 MOA at an elk under field conditions, you shouldn't even consider a 6mm creed for elk at 900 yards. 900 is also beyond the limit for reliable bullet expansion for most bullets/barrel/load combinations for a 6mm creed.
Yep. mtmuleyHere is my hash but honest opinion. If you have to ask on an online forum about if a cartridge is 'enough' for a certain animal or distance, you probably need way more experience and practice.
You betcha!Does this mean the 6.5 Creedmoor has been knocked of its pedestal by the 6 Creedmoor?
If you cant handle the recoil of 6.5cm you need to take up archeryTo your question of whether or not the 6mm creedmoor has made the 6.5 creedmoor obsolete. My bias and the supporting data says yes:
Running the balistics calculator on Hornady shows that Hornady's factory match ammo for the 6.5 CM and 6 CM result in near identical balistics, with both exhibiting effective ranges of roughly 800 - 850 yards at realistic Utah hunting elevations (~7,500) and weather scenrios.
If the 2 calibers do exactly the same thing from a terminal balistic standpoint, but one of them does it with 10% less felt recoil, wouldn't the one that does it with less recoil be the logical winner? Again, less recoil = better hit rate.
The one downside to the 6CM relative to the 6.5 CM is a shorter barrel life (~1500 rounds) given the wildat nature of the caliber. On the flip side though, it can more easily be loaded hot (if you are a reloader) to push the effective range out past the 6.5CM
I do shoot archery, but man shooting accurate rifles that don’t recoil is too much fun, spotting your own impacts is another added benefit! To each there own for sureIf you cant handle the recoil of 6.5cm you need to take up archery
First) Its an undeniable fact that less recoil = improved hit rates.If you cant handle the recoil of 6.5cm you need to take up archery
You getting 2950 with factory ammo or hand loads? That is fantastic! Yep I have a 20” and a 16” 6.5 and they are 650 and 525 yard rifles which is plenty far but they don’t have the juice to cause reliable expansion past thatFirst) Its an undeniable fact that less recoil = improved hit rates.
Second) the primary reason I’ve seen people choose the 6mm creed over the 6.5 creed is you can run shorter barrel lengths (for ease of use with a surpressor). I’m running 21” barrel on my 6mm creed and still pushing 2950” fps out the barrel. it’s an ~800 yard elk/deer gun with zero recoil, hearing safe, and compact even with 7” surpressor.
6.5 creed loses most long range capability with anything less than 24” barrel its a slow round to begin with unlike the 6mm creed that can be ran upwards or over of 3100 without pressure signs.
Author makes valid points. All 6CM is is a 243-AI. Yet really ever since the advent of the .308 or any of the older calibers one could make the argument that most calibers in the last 40 years have become redundant, and therefore by his logic unnecessary. Dude gives off big time FUDD vibes, also the match bullet argument isn’t a good one to make. Eld m while kept at adequate velocity are devastating very very similar to eld-X a “hunting bullet”An Official Journal Of The NRA | Alternative Ammo: .243 Winchester vs. 6mm Creedmoor
Contributor Dennis Bradley compares the .243 Winchester and 6mm Creedmoor, in an effort to dispel a few popular myths surrounding the "inherent accuracy" of certain cartridges.www.americanhunter.org
Interesting article on the comparison between 243 and 6cm.
I bet you are a Rokslider aren't you? Just a hunch. mtmuleyAuthor makes valid points. All 6CM is is a 243-AI. Yet really ever since the advent of the .308 or any of the older calibers one could make the argument that most calibers in the last 40 years have become redundant, and therefore by his logic unnecessary. Dude gives off big time FUDD vibes, also the match bullet argument isn’t a good one to make. Eld m while kept at adequate velocity are devastating very very similar to eld-X a “hunting bullet”
I bet you are a Rokslider aren't you? Just a hunch. mtmuley
Figured. Easy to spot. mtmuleyGuilty as charged
Fixed it for you.hunttalk is for the Newberg knob gobblers
Kinda like Roksliders knob gobble Ryan Avery and all his dumb ****. mtmuleyFixed it for you.
Will this kill a bull at 900yds?I’ve only had mine for a year. Took 2 whitetails with it. Both using 108 ELDM. I wouldn’t hesitate to use it for mule deer and plan on taking it to NM for elk this year.
I plan on using ELDM’s or 105 Berger’s
I think he was trolling… but your not wrongDepends on his muzzle velocity and atmospheric conditions. May want to consider a move up to a 6 PRC to gain that extra 150 fps depending on the inputs noted above.
A 6 Creed is 100% an elk killer out to roughy 1900 fps. Myself and clients are in double digit elk kills now with a 6 Creed using a combination of match style bullets (108 Berger EOL, 109 GAP ELDM, 108 ELDM). All died in seconds, including the long range kills. Bullet placement/accuracy was improved, the shooters were all able to spot impact and retain the elk in the crosshairs through the shot and reload process, wound channels were devestating, and not one did I think would have “died faster” with a bigger caliber.
This will surely ruffle some feathers but a a heavy for caliber, modern, match-style 6mm bullet makes a more devastating wound channel than a 7mm mono-style bullet.