Arrow Weight

Am I overthinking? Over the last two years I've shot a deer and an elk with my bow and essentially the same set up. (elk was with fixed blade, deer was expandable) The elk I shot at 18 yards and he didn't go 20 yards before he tipped over dead. The deer I shot at 40 and he died within 60 yards. Neither shot was a pass through.

29 inch draw 70 lbs 418 grains with 100 gr broadhead.

Obviously, the set up has worked and I cannot complain one bit about the results. But I can't help but question if I should increase arrow weight slightly. Even if it's just a 125 gr broadhead instead? Or am I overthinking and "if it ain't broke don't fix it"?

That little bit of change, won’t make any real difference. I would focus on 2 things first:

1. Perfect arrow flight- Bare shaft perfect coming off the bow, and then fletch. Tuning fletched arrows can hide imperfections.

2. A Razor sharp, structurally sound broadhead. The better the steel quality, the better they will retain an edge and perform. These are not cheap BTW. $100 for 3 is a good starting point.

Wife’s setup is 52# 25.5dl 408 TAW. She uses a 125 fixed BH. Her bull last year was at 25 yards quarter to and she buried the arrow to the fletching. He made it 50ish yards before he was down and done. Her December mule deer 28 yards quarter to and complete pass through. He made it 30 yards before he kart wheeled end tumbled 375 yards down the mountain.

$100+ for 3 broadheads is not needed in my opinion. Nothing against guys that want to blow their money on Iron Will type broadheads, but any good fixed head will kill anything you want to kill if you hit them right. I've never spent over $30 for a pack of broadheads, and never spent over $75 on a dozen arrow shafts. I've also never had an issue on flight, penetration etc. It boggles my mind that guys think they have to shoot an arrow setup that costs $60-$70 a pop to kill, but to each their own.

If you're setup kills and you're confident in it I say stick with it. I shoot between 470-480 grain arrow for everything I hunt. I shoot a 70lb 29" 8 year old bow. When I miss, it's on me, the shot I chose to shoot etc. but not on my equipment. I will say I'm not a fan of mechs. That's my .02 cents.....which doesn't mean squat.

Don't overthink arrow weight. The internet is full of guys that swear you need a 750 grain arrow but it's more hype than anything. I also run 418 grain arrows. I'm shooting 292 fps. Bow shoots very flat and fast while still having enough kinetic energy and momentum to kill any animal in North America. A difference of 2 or 3 yards can be a game changer in archery so going too heavy can really cost you because that 2 or 3 yard difference is even greater when your arrow weighs a ton.

Make sure your arrows are flying properly and that your bow is tuned. Practice often and focus on proper shooting technique. If you can have a little Front of Center set up on your arrow it will help with penetration, but no need to get crazy with FOC either.

You'd don't need $30 per head broadheads. QAD Exodus are very affordable, tough, fly great, and as deadly as any head ever built. Mechanicals also do a fantastic job and are very very deadly.

There is so much marketing hype and over tinkering going on in the industry that it is crazy. Really all you need is a bow that fits you well, good form, practice and patience enough to take good ethical shots and you'll be fine. About 90% of an animal is a place you don't want to put an arrow. Practice and focus on being able to hit that 10% of the animal that is fatal. Most modern bows and arrows in that 10% will kill every animal every time.

We shoot FMJ340 566gr. Total arrow weight heads are G5 Striker 100gr total pass on bull elk at 40yds….shoot same as field points past 70yds.

Respectfully, you also don’t need a $1200 Bow, but it would probably be much better quality than a $400 bow…… Good gear isn’t cheap, and yes, top of the heap broadheads, made from top shelf steel, are expensive. Is it necessary, probably not always, but they are better.

El Gringo said:

Respectfully, you also don’t need a $1200 Bow, but it would probably be much better quality than a $400 bow…… Good gear isn’t cheap, and yes, top of the heap broadheads, made from top shelf steel, are expensive. Is it necessary, probably not always, but they are better.

Click to expand...

I like a good friendly debate. This year's $1200 bow will be $700-$800 next year. So because it's a year old is it obsolete? What if the new technology is actually harder to shoot, less brace height, not as forgiving? Does it mean the $1200 is "better" than last years bow, because it costs more? What if I shoot a 5 year old $400 bow better than the flagship $1200 bow? Which one is "better"?

What if my Exodus, Slicktrick, Muzzy, Ramcat, broadheads fly better, penetrate better, and have killed faster than my buddies Iron Will heads? Are the Iron Will's still better because they cost more, or are made of higher grade steel?

Have the animals died "deader" with your "better" equipment than the animals I've killed with good equipment? If I manufactured a broadhead with the most expensive steel in the universe, marketed it to be the "best" and sold a 3 pack for $1500, would you buy them? Help me understand what "better" means.

Bigwiffy said:

I like a good friendly debate. This year's $1200 bow will be $700-$800 next year. So because it's a year old is it obsolete? What if the new technology is actually harder to shoot, less brace height, not as forgiving? Does it mean the $1200 is "better" than last years bow, because it costs more? What if I shoot a 5 year old $400 bow better than the flagship $1200 bow? Which one is "better"?

What if my Exodus, Slicktrick, Muzzy, Ramcat, broadheads fly better, penetrate better, and have killed faster than my buddies Iron Will heads? Are the Iron Will's still better because they cost more, or are made of higher grade steel?

Have the animals died "deader" with your "better" equipment than the animals I've killed with good equipment? If I manufactured a broadhead with the most expensive steel in the universe, marketed it to be the "best" and sold a 3 pack for $1500, would you buy them? Help me understand what "better" means.

Click to expand...

You’re right….

El Gringo said:

You’re right….

Click to expand...

Haha nah, I agree with you. Was just hoping for a good debate. Bored this time of year.

I do believe in buying the best you can afford and I shoot a very expensive set up, but I don't believe that most expensive is always the best. Often times it is, but not always. I've seen lots of people shooting very expensive gear extremely poorly while others are shooting older setups very accurately and consistently.

My point to him was mainly that he does not "have" to run $30 per head broadheads to be deadly. If you have enough kinetic energy and momentum with your setup it will kill very effectively with all kinds of broadheads. Lots of great heads out there. Some are super expensive while others aren't. If you can afford them and they shoot good out of your bow go ahead and shoot the Iron Will heads. But if G5 Montecs do the same, go ahead and shoot them. They will absolutely kill time and time again.

shoot what has worked unless you want to try and improve..
I had to get an all new setup due to shoulder and elbow issues so im currently shooting 60#.. I had recently built a 495 gr arrow set up and after a week of hunting spent another small fortune building 441 gr setup! I may go lighter next season?) I did this after shooting in camp watching great arrow flight but shot at 30 with my 20 pin by accident and that forced me to see how much drop I had ! prior to this set up ive run70# and about 425gr and harvested 15 bulls and only one shot over 25 yards and that was 30+ ! due to shoulder issues I can't shoot frequently and decided a faster arrow will help my confidence with shooting more accurately at distances 40 and in. I don't a have a pin beyond 40... ive seen what can happen inside 40 and refuse to shoot beyond... making solid shot choices with confident placement is more important than arrow weight... if you wanna buy my heavy set up ill make you a great deal

For elk we shoot 560gr arrows total pass throughs at 40 yds shooting 56# draw weight, need to go heavier arrows…

Debates such as what's been mentioned will go on forever. Fixed vs Mech, light vs heavy arrows, FOC, etc... The bottom line is, understanding your equipment's limitations as well as your own personal and then being disciplined enough to stay within those limits. In order to be effective at killing an elk the arrow must have enough Kinetic energy to penetrate into the vitals from whatever angle you're shooting the animal at. Unless you get real lucky and hit a main artery you need to take out the heart, lungs, liver, diaphragm, or any combination. Quickest is heart or double lungs. Single lung, good luck. Hit liver only and you have a long waiting game.
Some people prefer a heavy arrow set-up such as 500+, that's totally fine, however, unless your shoot an 80lb bow your sacrificing a lot of speed with those heavy arrows.
I feel there's a balance to be struck between speed and arrow weight. Obviously the faster the bow shoots the flatter the trajectory which results in a larger margin of error in judging yardage. 5 yards can make a big difference when you're shooting out to 50-60 yards with a slower trajectory. You can't always get a range on an animal unless your absolutely disciplined enough to say you're never going to shoot at an animal unless you've verified the range.
Over the past few years I messed around with arrow weight a bit. I used to shoot a 438gr arrow, I then went to a 453gr arrow, and my current set-up is at 478gr. It has been interesting to see the difference in my pin gaps, I shoot a 5 pin slider. With my current set-up my pins are spaced from 20 to 60 yards with very little difference in the gapping. With my previous set-up at 438gr the pins between 20 & 30 were very tight, from there the gaps began to get larger between distances out to 60. This is a function of lost energy as the arrow travels down range. So what this has told me is the heavier arrow maintains more of it's energy at longer distances. Higher energy equals more penetration. So using a set-up that provides as much Kinetic energy as possible while still keeping a balance between speed and arrow weight is where we should try to be. What is the right number to target for kinetic energy, I'm not sure, some varying opinions on this. There are several places online such as arrow manufactures that provide a kinetic energy calculator. Kinetic energy is a function of arrow weight and speed.
I feel the type of broadhead you want to shoot plays a factor on what your total arrow weight should be. I will say this if you're going to shoot a mechanical or hybrid style broadhead at elk, my opinion is you should absolutely have a set-up that leans to the higher side for kinetic energy, I'm thinking somewhere in the 75ft/lbs plus but a part of that equation is a heavier arrow to maintain the energy downrange, unless you restrict yourself to very close shots, heavier being in the 450+gr.
My current set-up is 70#, 478gr, 29" arrow, speed 272, 78ft/lbs, 125gr Evolution Hyde broadhead.
I shot a bull this year at 50 yards. The bull was slightly quartered away. Arrow entered on an angle near the back of the ribs, took out both lungs and was poking the skin outward on the opposite side just behind the shoulder but did not poke thru the hide. Massive wound channel. Elk went 100ish yards.
I've shot many other elk with varying combinations of arrow weight. All my set-ups have shot over 270fps. In my younger days I used a light arrow, I'm talking 390gr because I like the speed I was getting, however, I quickly learned that I was sacrificing penetration, so I went back to a 438gr arrow and immediately had far greater results.
These are my opinions based off my 36 years of archery elk hunting so take it for what it's worth.

trophyhunter said:

We shoot FMJ340 566gr. Total arrow weight heads are G5 Striker 100gr total pass on bull elk at 40yds….shoot same as field points past 70yds.

Click to expand...

we....lol....siamese twins again.....

Last 2 bulls were killed with 500gr arrows. One was a full pass through at 72yrds, and all arrows on this yrs bull were pass through at 32yrds. However, the first arrow the bull was broadside, and the arrow hit 4" behind the leg and turn 90 degrees. It exited out his rear end. How that happened is a mystery to me. I am meticulous on tuning, paper tuning, sharpening broadheads, and have a titanium outsert, with a titanium collar on the front of my Rip TKO's. The 150gr Valkyrie BloodEagles are still sharp afterwards. I would have argued that I have considered every possibility to create the best arrow combo, to be as lethal as possible. And I wouldn't change anything after the fact. I even shot it out of an 80lb bow, (284fps). But I couldn't have predicted the results.
Both bulls both died within sight, and it ended quickly. This yrs bull didn't act like he knew he was hit. So things worked out in my favor. But I've got friends that shot 374" bull with a 50lb bow, Iron Will broadhead, and a 440gr total arrow weight.
All I do know, it that we need to be meticulous and have a setup that can hopefully make up the difference when everything doesn't go as planned. I'm comfortable with this set up, and will probably keep it. But I like the conversations, and subscribe to Dan Stattons belief to "always be tinkering".
Hopefully we can help influence others take another look at thier set up. It doesn't have to be done my way, but I think we owe it to the animals to give the best we have in preparation...

My last bull elk, at 32 yards, took a pass thru with a 424 gr arrow, shot from a 64# compound. Heavy enough arrow for me.

Tank said:

Last 2 bulls were killed with 500gr arrows. One was a full pass through at 72yrds, and all arrows on this yrs bull were pass through at 32yrds. However, the first arrow the bull was broadside, and the arrow hit 4" behind the leg and turn 90 degrees. It exited out his rear end. How that happened is a mystery to me. I am meticulous on tuning, paper tuning, sharpening broadheads, and have a titanium outsert, with a titanium collar on the front of my Rip TKO's. The 150gr Valkyrie BloodEagles are still sharp afterwards. I would have argued that I have considered every possibility to create the best arrow combo, to be as lethal as possible. And I wouldn't change anything after the fact. I even shot it out of an 80lb bow, (284fps). But I couldn't have predicted the results.
Both bulls both died within sight, and it ended quickly. This yrs bull didn't act like he knew he was hit. So things worked out in my favor. But I've got friends that shot 374" bull with a 50lb bow, Iron Will broadhead, and a 440gr total arrow weight.
All I do know, it that we need to be meticulous and have a setup that can hopefully make up the difference when everything doesn't go as planned. I'm comfortable with this set up, and will probably keep it. But I like the conversations, and subscribe to Dan Stattons belief to "always be tinkering".
Hopefully we can help influence others take another look at thier set up. It doesn't have to be done my way, but I think we owe it to the animals to give the best we have in preparation...

Click to expand...

I shot a small bull with my longbow at 15 yards and had the same experience as you... only I had piles of blood the first 50 yards then pin pricks all day to find him bedded in super thick aspen grove came back next morning and found him another 75 yards from his bed.. also shot another small bull at 15 yards 4" behind the shoulder with 70# fixed blade 430 grn. set up he ran out to 100 yards and the arrow was sticking out the other side by the fletching 5"behind that shoulder... he proceed to wander into the only shade within 50 yards and laid there for a few hours while I snuck in and put a couple more in him... its amazing what can happen even on what appeasr to be perfect shots!