Thoughts?

So?

Let's Say JakeH's Info Is The Truth?

Let's Say The Hunter's/Shooter's Story is The Truth!

He Tried Calling The Land Owner!

He Tried Calling The DWR a Few Times!

May Not of Been a 100 Degrees!

But This Time Of Year Ain't No Time To Be F'N Around When it Comes To Meat Spoilage!

Where & When Do You Draw The Line & Say:

I'm Not Letting That Meat Spoil!

So I Guess I'll Take A Chance On The Other DipShit Turning Me In Because I Know He's Going to!

I'd Place a Wager!

If It Had Been a PISSCUTTER 2 Point?

There Probably Wouldn't Have Been a Confrontation!

There Probably Wouldn't Have Been All the IG Photography!

The Land Owner Probably Would Have Been More Reasonable!

And The DWR Might Not Of Took The Trophy 2 Point PISSCUTTER!

I'm Just Sayin:

When You've Done All You can do!

When Do Ethics kick In & You Do What You Gotta Do?
 
The great part is opening weekend and the DWR ain't answering the phone.

And, I'm sure the rest of the story is true. But private is private.

I would have tried calling the sheriff, but other than that, you just sit there and watch it rot.

Trophy hunting sure brings out the best in folks?
 
Gator said:
Dang who has the dope on if it was taken legal or not.
Lets see some prove.
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The older brother posted the story himself...readers digest version....40 yard shot on public through the shoulder & excited the neck.....2nd shot wounded buck spun and took it in the face...buck was dropped on private....older brother looked up ownership in onx and tried to contact owners then fish & game...has call logs....brothers retrieved the buck about 2 hours after trying to make contact with the owners & fish & game...another group of hunters called it in that had a confrontation with them well before sunrise on public land...brothers were there well before the other group...older gentlemen shoved younger 17 yr old brother...on video...fish & game confiscated the animal...here we are...now the investigation is on...let's see how it plays out....
 
So, with the current cell phone dynamic…(everyone has one)….they seem like they knew the other guys were watching. They are playing it tight with private property, why didn’t they video every move and narrate the blood trail and event with older gentleman?(mistake 1). And still, trespassing is trespassing. Cannot get ahold of landowner, meat spoiling or not, you don’t go over there until it is sorted out.(mistake 2).

95-100 degrees in the AM??? ?

How did the older guys get ahold of f&g cops? Something ain’t adding up…

Last thing, this scenario is always a risk when hunting private property lines. They should have done their homework on landowners and contacts long before “after the shot.” They were watching the buck for two months! This scenario of buck crossing onto private had obviously went through their minds….they had probably already committed to trespassing if this particular buck went onto private after being hit.(mistake 3).
 
BLooDTRaCKeR said:
So, with the current cell phone dynamic…(everyone has one)….they seem like they knew the other guys were watching. They are playing it tight with private property, why didn’t they video every move and narrate the blood trail and event with older gentleman?(mistake 1). And still, trespassing is trespassing. Cannot get ahold of landowner, meat spoiling or not, you don’t go over there until it is sorted out.(mistake 2).

95-100 degrees in the AM??? ?

How did the older guys get ahold of f&g cops? Something ain’t adding up…

Last thing, this scenario is always a risk when hunting private property lines. They should have done their homework on landowners and contacts long before “after the shot.” They were watching the buck for two months! This scenario of buck crossing onto private had obviously went through their minds….they had probably already committed to trespassing if this particular buck went onto private after being hit.(mistake 3).
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Pauns posted earlier there was video of them dragging it under the fence, they didn't have to get them on scene right away.

I'm Not defending or condoning anything they did, but the story the brother laid out seems easily plausible and believable.

Everyone likes to nit pick after the fact and say what they could or should have done, but thats easy to do after the fact.

Also seems like Everyone likes to assume and speculate the worst ESPECIALLY when a big deer or elk is involved. Nobody will ever give the benefit of the doubt in these kind of cases.
 
JakeH said:
Pauns posted earlier there was video of them dragging it under the fence, they didn't have to get them on scene right away.

I'm Not defending or condoning anything they did, but the story the brother laid out seems easily plausible and believable.

Everyone likes to nit pick after the fact and say what they could or should have done, but thats easy to do after the fact.

Also seems like Everyone likes to assume and speculate the worst ESPECIALLY when a big deer or elk is involved. Nobody will ever give the benefit of the doubt in these kind of cases.
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Yes, but you see my point about “hunting the line.” No matter what type of animal is involved, you had better do your research for the sake of the animal you may harvest to ensure IF that animal walks over the line, you have a way to retrieve. Otherwise why hunt a boarder to risk losing an animal or putting yourself in a bind with what to do?
 
ElmerFudd said:
One thing i don't get, if there was any possibility of going to court, why would anyone post anything about it on the internet?
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Good point!
Another thing to consider is when and where were the grip and grin pics taken.
If the buck had been laying dead on the private spoiling for a couple of hours in that heat did they take the pics on the private or after they dragged it back on to public?
All this going on while the other disgruntled hunters are watching? The kid didn’t look too worried in the pics. Didn’t take him long to post them out to the public either.
Seems to me like with all that controversy maybe he shouldn’t have been in such a hurry to get those pictures out to the public.

Another thing I don’t see in that pic is the arrow shaft where it came out. Looks to me like that shot went right through the Deers brain. Don’t see how he could have ran 400 yards then jumped the fence after that shot especially if he was already mortally wounded from the first shot. I guess it is possible though. Those Bucks are tough!
 
BLooDTRaCKeR said:
Yes, but you see my point about “hunting the line.” No matter what type of animal is involved, you had better do your research for the sake of the animal you may harvest to ensure IF that animal walks over the line, you have a way to retrieve. Otherwise why hunt a boarder to risk losing an animal or putting yourself in a bind with what to do?
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Yep they probably should have done that. But they didn't. Maybe they learned a lesson.
 
Seriously, why not remove the arrow and take the pic from another angle?

I don't leave the fletching sticking out if it's a lung shot, why leave it there for a head shot?

It's like he was proud of it, or something.

So much of this discussion never would've happened without the arrow in it's face.
 
buckhorn said:
Good point!
Another thing to consider is when and where were the grip and grin pics taken.
If the buck had been laying dead on the private spoiling for a couple of hours in that heat did they take the pics on the private or after they dragged it back on to public?
All this going on while the other disgruntled hunters are watching? The kid didn’t look too worried in the pics. Didn’t take him long to post them out to the public either.
Seems to me like with all that controversy maybe he shouldn’t have been in such a hurry to get those pictures out to the public.

Another thing I don’t see in that pic is the arrow shaft where it came out. Looks to me like that shot went right through the Deers brain. Don’t see how he could have ran 400 yards then jumped the fence after that shot especially if he was already mortally wounded from the first shot. I guess it is possible though. Those Bucks are tough!
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Look at this picture, you can see where the arrow exited under the ear, the arrow went through the eye socket and exited right under the ear. Go look at a deer skull and you can see that it wouldn't have entered the brain.

Screenshot_20220826-225722_Instagram.jpg

And that deer wasn't staged all that well it only takes a couple minutes to snap a couple pictures.

Again people doing all they can to find any fault they can.

And you guys wonder why they didn't wait until the court date to get there side out. ?
 
JakeH said:
Yep they probably should have done that. But they didn't. Maybe they learned a lesson.
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It’s a good reminder to all reading this thread to do your research before hitting these areas that have private property boundaries close by. Would be a shame to be responsible for a rotting animal because you could bot retrieve it.
 
buckhorn said:
Good point!
Another thing to consider is when and where were the grip and grin pics taken.
If the buck had been laying dead on the private spoiling for a couple of hours in that heat did they take the pics on the private or after they dragged it back on to public?
All this going on while the other disgruntled hunters are watching? The kid didn’t look too worried in the pics. Didn’t take him long to post them out to the public either.
Seems to me like with all that controversy maybe he shouldn’t have been in such a hurry to get those pictures out to the public.

Another thing I don’t see in that pic is the arrow shaft where it came out. Looks to me like that shot went right through the Deers brain. Don’t see how he could have ran 400 yards then jumped the fence after that shot especially if he was already mortally wounded from the first shot. I guess it is possible though. Those Bucks are tough!
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^^^Bingo
 
Like I've said if it all checks out I'll take back everything I've said but I feel like there is way too much baggage with this story for it to be true and obviously the f&g felt the same way if they've already confiscated the deer.
 
JakeH said:
Look at this picture, you can see where the arrow exited under the ear, the arrow went through the eye socket and exited right under the ear. Go look at a deer skull and you can see that it wouldn't have entered the brain.

View attachment 85146
And that deer wasn't staged all that well it only takes a couple minutes to snap a couple pictures.

Again people doing all they can to find any fault they can.

And you guys wonder why they didn't wait until the court date to get there side out. ?
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We also wonder why they posted pics to social media knowing things were a bit shady on the trespassing side…?
 
Yeah that initial post didn't mention anything about a confrontation or trespassing. Just all the time they put in to kill the buck. Looked like the damage control post came out after people found out about the confiscation.
 
JakeH said:
Look at this picture, you can see where the arrow exited under the ear, the arrow went through the eye socket and exited right under the ear. Go look at a deer skull and you can see that it wouldn't have entered the brain.

View attachment 85146
And that deer wasn't staged all that well it only takes a couple minutes to snap a couple pictures.

Again people doing all they can to find any fault they can.

And you guys wonder why they didn't wait until the court date to get there side out. ?
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Jake you are correct I now see the exit hole and I stand corrected on the eye shot.
If the arrow broke off just below the fletching they could have easily pulled out the remaining piece for the pic.
Another thing I personally like to do is cut out the tongue and wipe off as much blood as possible but that’s just me.
To each their own!
 
buckhorn said:
Jake you are correct I now see the exit hole and I stand corrected on the eye shot.
If the arrow broke off just below the fletching they could have easily pulled out the remaining piece for the pic.
Another thing I personally like to do is cut out the tongue and wipe off as much blood as possible but that’s just me.
To each their own!
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When you're on private property they probably didn't have much time to set the deer up for proper pictures lol
 
slamdunk said:
This is probably where it gets sticky.

If it was a finish shot, it could cause them trouble.

Time will tell.
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Slam go look a couple posts up. I posted a side picture the arrow to the head likely did nothing but blind the buck. Arrow only went through the eye socket. The buck could easily have ran off like they claim it did.

Either way, they did retrieve it from private without permission.

I got to say though if they prove that it was shot on public and then ran onto private and the land owner still has issues and wants to press charges that's pretty chicken sh!t as well. That's basically saying he wouldn't have given them permission even of they did get ahold of them.
 
JakeH said:
Slam go look a couple posts up. I posted a side picture the arrow to the head likely did nothing but blind the buck. Arrow only went through the eye socket. The buck could easily have ran off like they claim it did.

Either way, they did retrieve it from private without permission.

I got to say though if they prove that it was shot on public and then ran onto private and the land owner still has issues and wants to press charges that's pretty chicken sh!t as well. That's basically saying he wouldn't have given them permission even of they did get ahold of them.
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Ya I saw those, thanks for sharing and adding more meat to the story.

If they can prove they "tried" getting permission, I'm sure that will help their case.

The problem for them is and as in all cases, "intent" is what matters at the end of the day.

They admittedly crossed onto private without permission full well knowing it was "trespassing".
This is most likely where they will find trouble.

Trying to do the ethical thing is their strong point.
 
slamdunk said:
Ya I saw those, thanks for sharing and adding more meat to the story.

If they can prove they "tried" getting permission, I'm sure that will help their case.

The problem for them is and as in all cases, "intent" is what matters at the end of the day.

They admittedly crossed onto private without permission full well knowing it was "trespassing".
This is most likely where they will find trouble.

Trying to do the ethical thing is their strong point.
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More ethical than that, they should have had all research done ahead of time to know if landowner would cooperate, if…by the “off chance” this buck wanders onto private and dies, they can retrieve it without incident.

Why wait until Murphy’s Law takes effect to figure out plan B, C, and D?!
 
BLooDTRaCKeR said:
More ethical than that, they should have had all research done ahead of time to know if landowner would cooperate, if…by the “off chance” this buck wanders onto private and dies, they can retrieve it without incident.

Why wait until Murphy’s Law takes effect to figure out plan B, C, and D?!
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Like @JakeH is saying, everything is speculation at this point and it'll play out.
 
I don't want to it to seem like I am defending them. I really dont know any more than any one else other then what has been posted. I just hate how everyone always assumes the worst in every situation.

And I know from personal experience if you kill a big deer you best make sure you did everything by the book because someone will turn you in for something whether there is anything to turn you in for or not. Lol
 
If that would have happened in the area I used to live in Idaho the land owners would be calling for a hanging!
And the DA would be supplying the rope!
 
You guys are funny, you act like the kid broke in and stolen something . If I shot that buck on public and it ran and died on private I sure as hell wouldn’t wait around 2 hours. I’d jump that barb wire fence, grab my buck and flip those other hunters off on my way out. You would too…
 
That did happen to me. I called F&G but it was a Sunday evening and I couldn't get anybody to answer. Then I called the local sheriff, their voicemail said they were closed and to call the Highway Patrol so I did that. They forwarded my call over to a local officer who gave me permission to retrieve the deer back to public land, quarter it and cape it on public and then I could pack it back to the truck. He said I had to get it off private ASAP.

The officer was waiting for me at my truck when I got back and I showed him the video I had made of the blood trail on public land to where the deer jumped the fence and I had also taken video of my GPS showing that where I was standing was still on public land.

He congratulated me and let me on my way. He was a good dude.

I don't know what I would've done if I never got anybody to answer, I likely would've gotten the deer so it didn't waste and then reported it the next day. It's a sticky situation.
 
JPickett said:
You guys are funny, you act like the kid broke in and stolen something . If I shot that buck on public and it ran and died on private I sure as hell wouldn’t wait around 2 hours. I’d jump that barb wire fence, grab my buck and flip those other hunters off on my way out. You would too…
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I’m with you JP… all wildlife is not worth wasting…
 
BLooDTRaCKeR said:
More ethical than that, they should have had all research done ahead of time to know if landowner would cooperate, if…by the “off chance” this buck wanders onto private and dies, they can retrieve it without incident.

Why wait until Murphy’s Law takes effect to figure out plan B, C, and D?!
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If you call the landowner ahead of time and tell him you are hunting his fence line, I highly doubt you are going to permission.

Also, lets get seroius about what he was retrieving. If this kid was a meat hunter, this is not where he would have been hunting. The horns he was looking for just happened to live near private property. Same reason he was there is where the 50 year old bully was hunting the same spot.
 
hossblur said:
Anyone still denying tech in hunting needs to be limited, better be typing on an apple 2 desktop, and not a Apple iPhone, otherwise you are showing how rapidly tech increases efficiency.

This is the deer my boy killed with a muzzy last year. It's eyes are bulged out because of a .50 cal slug that hit him between the eyes, killing him instantly. It was a split second before he pulled the trigger, but turned his head in front of his chest a the same time the powder went off.

Point being, chit does indeed happen.

Bigger point, I'll assume this came off IG?

WTH are we posting deer with arrows through their eyes for? It couldn't have been pulled?

View attachment 84542
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"WTH are we posting deer with arrows through their eyes for? It couldn't have been pulled?"


Same reason you did not push this bucks bulging eyes back into socket or cover up the 5ft death crawl of blood #CSI~ Just "Thrill of the moment" Yo. Did you Post This pic on IG/FB???????????At least we know this kid is very young-n-dumb and still has a lot to learn. And you???
 
Savage110 said:
If you call the landowner ahead of time and tell him you are hunting his fence line, I highly doubt you are going to permission.

Also, lets get seroius about what he was retrieving. If this kid was a meat hunter, this is not where he would have been hunting. The horns he was looking for just happened to live near private property. Same reason he was there is where the 50 year old bully was hunting the same spot.
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Based upon your response, you live off assumptions. Use a little tact with your approach and you may get a little further with landowner. Tell him your hunting some public land in the area and if by the off chance you hit something and it runs onto his property, what are the chances of recovering it with another phone call? If he says go pound sand…then there’s your answer to the risk of hunting that buck. If he says, Yeah, call me if it happens, I’d like to confirm where the shot took place, then you have a bit more reassurance that things will work out in your favor. Not a for sure thing…just the risks with hunting the line so to speak.
 
Sooo... the follow up shot hit it in the eye!?
Unfortunately it didn't drop in it's tracks!
Buck dies on private land ?.
Get it quick, before the coyotes eat it! ?
I wonder if, he really hit it on public land?? Will/has there been an on the ground investigation by trusted agents of the state?? ?
Did the Utah Department of Natural Resources take the antlers and the meat? BbQ ?
Great buck! ??
So much jealousy! ?
Risk=Reward?!??️ Stay Tuned!
hahaha ?
"Sidenote~It's kind of cool the "Carrizo$a Young$ter$" killed it before the BULLYzzzxo... Dundun dunnnn!
 
JakeSwensen said:
Sooo... the follow up shot hit it in the eye!?
Unfortunately it didn't drop in it's tracks!
Buck dies on private land ?.
Get it quick, before the coyotes eat it! ?
I wonder if, he really hit it on public land?? Will/has there been an on the ground investigation by trusted agents of the state?? ?
Did the Utah Department of Natural Resources take the antlers and the meat? BbQ ?
Great buck! ??
So much jealousy! ?
Risk=Reward?!??️ Stay Tuned!
hahaha ?
"Sidenote~It's kind of cool the "Carrizo$a Young$ter$" killed it before the BULLYzzzxo... Dundun dunnnn!
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He said in the comments of his IG post that they took two officers over and verified the shot location.
 
Interesting thread. Generally one I hate to read for all the obvious reasons and I can't add to what's already been said.

Please post updates. I'll have a current example for my hunter ed students to hear about and ponder.
 
BLooDTRaCKeR said:
Based upon your response, you live off assumptions. Use a little tact with your approach and you may get a little further with landowner. Tell him your hunting some public land in the area and if by the off chance you hit something and it runs onto his property, what are the chances of recovering it with another phone call? If he says go pound sand…then there’s your answer to the risk of hunting that buck. If he says, Yeah, call me if it happens, I’d like to confirm where the shot took place, then you have a bit more reassurance that things will work out in your favor. Not a for sure thing…just the risks with hunting the line so to speak.
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My response was based upon my experience, not an assumption.

You would be right if we were talking whitetail eating the landowners alfalfa. Gotten permission many times and have had many pleasant interaction with landowners.

Mule deer is a different story. I have asked, and gotten responses from “stay off my f’ing property”, to “that’s why there is a fence there”.

And if the landowner didn’t know before there was a 200” deer near that corner, he sure knew after 10 people ask to trespass.

So if we are assuming things based on little to no information, I would say you hunt whitetail primarily.

Not sticking up for the kids, but I may have done the same thing they did. Or, may have watched the deer rot until G&F showed up, and used the money I would have spent on processing on ribeye steaks at the supermarket. But I do know I would show up on that glassing spot a few more times right at daylight to watch and video that 50yo try to hunt the area. Would be sweet to catch that SOB run afoul of even a minor game violation.
 
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Elk_Nuts said:
You're sounding an awful like you're the guy that kicked him off the hill. Just saying.
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Haha yeah ok. They trespassed and admitted they did. Make a better shot and that buck doesn't make it to the private. Sorry but with the amount of chit we have to deal with on my families property I have no sympathy for trespassers. Maybe people should work a little harder on respecting other peoples property. Your response makes it sound like you trespass quite a bit.
 
ORIONTHEHUNTER said:
Haha yeah ok. They trespassed and admitted they did. Make a better shot and that buck doesn't make it to the private. Sorry but with the amount of chit we have to deal with on my families property I have no sympathy for trespassers. Maybe people should work a little harder on respecting other peoples property. Your response makes it sound like you trespass quite a bit.
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Hey ORIONTHEHUNTER,

I am going to hunt the fenceline just on the public side of your family's property this season. There is a chance I may shoot a deer that could potentially jump the fence and die on your property. Is it cool if I enter your property and retrieve the animal back to the public side of the fence if I am not able to contact you by phone in real time?

I was told this was a good approach if I use a little tact with you the landowner, just on the odd chance the deer strays onto your property AFTER I shoot it.

Thanks in advance.
 
Absolutely disgusting how many “hunters” got on and supported their illegal hunting methods on the kids Instagram post giving his side of the story. He openly admitted to breaking the law and then tried to justify it as an “ethics” situation. The amount of those who were in favor of their actions was appalling. Apparently if the deer is over 200”, everyone is willing to let a few laws here and there slide. I don’t care what the reasoning laws were still broken.

Those clowns are a lawyer’s nightmare. No way he can talk them out of that now that they admitted to breaking the law. I did find several holes in his “story” and feel like some of the actual truth has been conveniently left out. Kinda strange that buck ran 400 yards after the hit, then jumped a fence and then died 30 yards after doing so. Kinda odd that the kids couldn’t get the DWR on the phone after several attempts, but the other guys didn’t seem to struggle at all getting ahold of them… anyone else ever seen a deer run that kind of distance after they caught an arrow in the face like that? Me neither.

This isn’t the first time they’ve bent the rules to kill a big deer. It’s just the first time they’ve been held accountable for it. More to come on it…
 
Sometimes the ethical thing to do is against the law, it was trespassing and thus do not fault the game wardens for confiscating the deer.

Maybe it was a poorly judged shot, too far or bad angle. Most of us have made that mistake at some point, but did we learn that tough lesson and improve not only our judgement, but also respect for the animal?

Just a bad situation.
 
BackcountryRob said:
Sometimes the ethical thing to do is against the law, it was trespassing and thus do not fault the game wardens for confiscating the deer.

Maybe it was a poorly judged shot, too far or bad angle. Most of us have made that mistake at some point, but did we learn that tough lesson and improve not only our judgement, but also respect for the animal?

Just a bad situation.
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That still doesn’t justify breaking a law. Don’t kid yourself or buy into their bullchit. None of their actions were done so with the intent of harvesting and saving any meat. Antlers was the only priority. The meat story was just to help sway people to support their unethical and illegal actions
 
D33RHNTR said:
That still doesn’t justify breaking a law. Don’t kid yourself or buy into their bullchit. None of their actions were done so with the intent of harvesting and saving any meat. Antlers was the only priority. The meat story was just to help sway people to support their unethical and illegal actions
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Again, just hilarious! I’d jump your fence if a two point I’d shot crossed it and died. I shoot it on public I’m going to retrieve it.

Where’s all the “long range guys don’t go get there wounded animal” crowd on this one? Probably the same guys that want us to believe they wouldn’t jump the fence to grab there deer. Too rich
 
I’ve always found that following the rules usually ends up in a positive outcome. Every landowner is different but I’ve had multiple experiences with game near the property line and also one or two that have made it over to the private before expiring.

Getting the landowner and law enforcement involved before hopping fences has always been the best decision.

You are much better off getting the landowner to let the game warden or you go get an animal what was legally wounded on public when they see that you didn’t duck a fence or the like before-hand.


I once killed a deer a couple hundred yards from a property line but the only way to get there and be on public the whole time was to go down then up a nasty ravine. It would have been much easier to straight-line it and cut the corner of the rancher’s place.

After he saw my tracks in the snow and verified that I hadn’t bent the rules he went and got his truck and brought my buck 3 miles back to my vehicle whole. This was also a landowner who had the reputation of being a bleep-hole—-I just figured I wouldn’t give him a reason to be one and it all worked out.
 
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Stubaby said:
I once killed a deer a couple hundred yards from a property line but the only way to get there at be on public the whole time was to go down them up a nasty ravine. It would have been much easier to straight-line it and cut the corner of the rancher’s place.
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And that was the right thing to do. Don’t trespass to get to a spot, don’t trespass to kill an animal on private property, but if you shoot it on public and it jumps the fence or crosses some property line the (wait for it cuz this is a big point here on MM) ethical thing to do is retrieve the animal you shot. Sounds like that’s what these kids did
 
Yup jpick. I have land and would be pissed if someone wounded one and it went on my place and didn’t say anything to try and get it. waste animals is not good .
 
JPickett said:
I’ll go even further and say if any property owner would rather an animal you shot rot instead of being recovered is unethical.

How bout that ?
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How bout this?

Hunter wounds a deer on public land. Dies on private property. Land owner denies retrieval.

Who’s the responsible party if the animal is left to rot.

Is it wanton waste…… if so, who gets the citation? If not, why not?
 
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2lumpy said:
How bout this?

Hunter wounds a deer on public land. Does on private property. Land owner denies retrieval.

Who’s the responsible party if the animal is left to rot.

Is it wanton waste…… if so, who gets the citation? If not, why not?
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Landowner should. The animal is not a robot or video game. Stick/shoot that thing and all sorts of scenarios are possible. If you are, as stubaby (great name by the way) outlined doing all other things the right way I don’t se how you can be liable for the direction a wild animal bleeding out it’s lungs runs. MM is real big in ethics, bout every other thread is questioning someone’s but what seems to be a common thread in them is recovering an animal is of the highest moral conviction. Until it jumps s fence then just because some a$$ hole was born 18th generation in a ranch you can’t go get it? I don’t think so
 
JPickett said:
Landowner should. The animal is not a robot or video game. Stick/shoot that thing and all sorts of scenarios are possible. If you are, as stubaby (great name by the way) outlined doing all other things the right way I don’t se how you can be liable for the direction a wild animal bleeding out it’s lungs runs. MM is real big in ethics, bout every other thread is questioning someone’s but what seems to be a common thread in them is recovering an animal is of the highest moral conviction. Until it jumps s fence then just because some a$$ hole was born 18th generation in a ranch you can’t go get it? I don’t think so
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We all have opinions……. What’s the law say? This ain’t a first ever case.
 
I'm sure they want the head more than the meat but the meat is part of the animal. (They should be concerned about it too.) living out here on the Rez, If you waste the meat that is bad medicine and if you don’t get it it will come back to get you. Your hunt will never be the same, don’t forget that.
 
Come on guys, he's not a gang banger doing a drive by shooting, he wasn't sitting behind a computer game. He does not have the wealth of knowledge of all the inernet know-it-alls, he was hunting.
They found a big buck like all the hunting pros. He managed to get 2 arrows into a buck of a lifetime after an unpleasant confrontation with a fellow hunter. I'm sure the adrenalin kicked in, I would hope so.
At 18 I shot a small buck that left a 5 foot wide blood trail. I forced myself to wait 20 minutes when I knew I should wait 30 to look for my trophy 2 point.
The hunter that he had the confrontation with may have known the game warden and had his personal phone number.
At that age it would have been impossible to let a trophy like that just lay there.
Trespassing is trespassing, I get it.
Young buck posted a pic of a bloody 2 point and a friend blowing a duck call in the background. This is a hunting site not a Disney forum. Maybe someone could teach them photo etiquette for future pics.
If it played out close to the story told I congratulate the hunter on the buck of a lifetime. Also, the land owner should congratulate him and even help him get his trophy back.
Cut him some slack until his story can be verified one way or another. If he trespassed to get his his first arrow into the buck or shot it on private ground from the beginning then the law will handle it.
If he would have saved the liver and heart would you guys cut him some slack?
Carry on.
 
neighbor kids ball came over the fence last night.

after reading this thread i knew just what to do. as he came over to grab it (he's about 8 years old) i shot him with some rock salt out of the 20 gauge, then pinned him down to the ground Gorge Floyd style until the FBI showed up. i made sure to put a maga hat on him so id be sure they took him in.

whew, thank God my property lines integrity was protected from that eminent threat. thanks MM, i'm dialed in now (y)

oh and i kept the ball
 
ORIONTHEHUNTER said:
Haha yeah ok. They trespassed and admitted they did. Make a better shot and that buck doesn't make it to the private. Sorry but with the amount of chit we have to deal with on my families property I have no sympathy for trespassers. Maybe people should work a little harder on respecting other peoples property. Your response makes it sound like you trespass quite a bit.
Click to expand...
No actually I don't. But I'll start if you want to send me an OnX pin to your property.
 
Remember that farmers can shoot deer destroying crops after they follow all the rules.
it isn't wanton waste then.
 
Gator said:
Remember that farmers can shoot deer destroying crops after they follow all the rules.
it isn't wanton waste then.
Click to expand...
Oh I remember very well.

Shooting a deer and leaving them to rot is an entirely different law, in Utah, than the wanton waste law. Now…….. the DWR might act as if it is, if the landowner denies access to the hunt to retrieve it.

However, I’ll wager there hasn’t been a court case that has challenged this specific kind of question. Trespassing….. yes, many times but the denied request to retreive a deer shot on public land that’s left to rot, by the landowner is a different cat.

I suspect the DWR would remove the deer, even it was spoiled, rather than let the landowner get charged for waste. But that’s just an assumption.

I think this actually be tried and a rule defined to protect the land owner and the hunter, and the wanton waste issue, because, one day, someday, one or the other is going to get skinned.
 
Last edited:
I suspect that the order of precedence is:

You cannot trespass (break a law) to avoid breaking another law (wanton waste).

I mean, you can, but you would still be guilty of breaking the law. I suppose you gotta decide which is worse. But I highly doubt that the game officer would target you for waste if you could not retrieve the animal.
 
HikeHunt61 said:
I suspect that the order of precedence is:

You cannot trespass (break a law) to avoid breaking another law (wanton waste).

I mean, you can, but you would still be guilty of breaking the law. I suppose you gotta decide which is worse. But I highly doubt that the game officer would target you for waste if you could not retrieve the animal.
Click to expand...
I doubt it too, for either the hunter or the land owner. But……. It’s wanton waste, if one or the other doesn’t retrieve it. Game office can but don’t target either, if no one retrieves it……. Until one day, someday, a game office does.

Then what? Who takes the fall…… the landowner or the hunter? If the hunter gets charged, his attorney will claim the landowner prevented retrieval. If the land owner gets charged, he’ll claim he never harmed the deer, so he didn’t waste anything. Court has to decide. Will that create a precedent? Will the Fish and Game fold rather than stand hard, or protect their landowner relationship?
 
Well, the landowner can have deer die on his property for all sorts of reasons, and is not required to "know" that one did.

Now if he was "informed", and then did nothing, I suppose...

But I imagine the law says it is the hunter's responsibility. Not somebody else, including a random land owner.
 
I also imagine Utah has some "all reasonable" language in their wanton waste law. Like say you shoot a deer and it dives off a cliff into a lake. IT HAPPENS. I doubt they can charge you. If you cannot find it, and two days later you run accross it, I doubt you can be charged. If it goes somewhere you cannot access, same thing.
 
HikeHunt61 said:
I also imagine Utah has some "all reasonable" language in their wanton waste law. Like say you shoot a deer and it dives off a cliff into a lake. IT HAPPENS. I doubt they can charge you. If you cannot find it, and two days later you run accross it, I doubt you can be charged. If it goes somewhere you cannot access, same thing.
Click to expand...
Okay. I guess we’ll see, one day, someway. ?
 
2lumpy said:
I doubt it too, for either the hunter or the land owner. But……. It’s wanton waste, if one or the other doesn’t retrieve it. Game office can but don’t target either, if no one retrieves it……. Until one day, someday, a game office does.

Then what? Who takes the fall…… the landowner or the hunter? If the hunter gets charged, his attorney will claim the landowner prevented retrieval. If the land owner gets charged, he’ll claim he never harmed the deer, so he didn’t waste anything. Court has to decide. Will that create a precedent? Will the Fish and Game fold rather than stand hard, or protect their landowner relationship?
Click to expand...
Correct me if I missed something here, but the kid's article claimed the owners could not be reached, therefore he chose to trespass regardless.

There is no blame on landowner whatsoever here.
 

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