Youth hunting

Should youth be guaranteed a tag the first year there eligible?

  • Yes

    Votes: 14 22.6%

  • No

    Votes: 48 77.4%
  • Total voters
    62
My son is 13 and has a ton of opportunity. We live in east coast now but he was born in Utah and we have lived in Colorado, NV, WY and TX. My job has us moving way too much.

He got his first elk last year, shot his first buck a couple year ago. He has been on four elk hunts (he had the tag on one) three mule deer hunts numerous whitetail hunts and a public water draw hunt for alligators. He has a great elk tag this year in Colorado. There are really almost unlimited opportunities for youth hunters out west. He will hunt elk and bear in Colorado this year and then be back out west to hunt elk in NM with me. We had to withdraw him from Wyoming so that he didn’t have too many tags this year. I am all for youth opportunity but in reality, opportunity is not prohibiting youth from hunting every year. Most states offer discounts for NR youth and the draw odds are almost 100%. If the OP is still looking for his kid…There are leftover tags for antelope in WY.

Beat of luck to everybody this year. Hope you and your kids have a great year. There is plenty of opportunity out there for everybody…including youth hunters.
 
Utah400Elk said:
My son is 13 and has a ton of opportunity. We live in east coast now but he was born in Utah and we have lived in Colorado, NV, WY and TX. My job has us moving way too much.

He got his first elk last year, shot his first buck a couple year ago. He has been on four elk hunts (he had the tag on one) three mule deer hunts numerous whitetail hunts and a public water draw hunt for alligators. He has a great elk tag this year in Colorado. There are really almost unlimited opportunities for youth hunters out west. He will hunt elk and bear in Colorado this year and then be back out west to hunt elk in NM with me. We had to withdraw him from Wyoming so that he didn’t have too many tags this year. I am all for youth opportunity but in reality, opportunity is not prohibiting youth from hunting every year. Most states offer discounts for NR youth and the draw odds are almost 100%. If the OP is still looking for his kid…There are leftover tags for antelope in WY.

Beat of luck to everybody this year. Hope you and your kids have a great year. There is plenty of opportunity out there for everybody…including youth hunters.
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What you describe was exactly my point several posts ago.

In order to have that kind of opportunity, you need both time and money to make it happen. Definitely not accusing you or blaming anything on you. Most people don't have both and your son has been very fortunate.

When someone is limited to hunting their state, in an area where long weekend hunts are their reality, it would be nice to have a few more opportunities than what are commonly offered. Duck hunting is no substitute for a deer or elk hunt.

And for those two jokers earlier on, not talking about myself, again...
 
roadrunner said:
What you describe was exactly my point several posts ago.

In order to have that kind of opportunity, you need both time and money to make it happen. Definitely not accusing you or blaming anything on you. Most people don't have both and your son has been very fortunate.

When someone is limited to hunting their state, in an area where long weekend hunts are their reality, it would be nice to have a few more opportunities than what are commonly offered. Duck hunting is no substitute for a deer or elk hunt.

And for those two jokers earlier on, not talking about myself, again...
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So you’re saying make more money so you can get more time off? Couldn’t agree more. Also since the OP is in UT most those youth opportunities can be had on the weekends.
 
He took his first elk in Utah and neither money or vacation time had anything to do with his opportunity. I put a ton of time into scouting in Utah and his success was a direct result of years of scouting and hunting the area. Many of the hunts he has enjoyed have been day hunts or long weekend hunts. I lived in Utah for over 20 years and never had a hard time finding animals to chase.

The real question would be…is this about opportunity or opportunity at coveted LE tags? The deer hunting opportunities in Utah are quickly disappearing but there are a lot of options for elk and antlerless tags. The out of state hunts are a little more money for the youth tags and a little more gas from Utah but can still be done for a few hundred dollars and a couple extra hours drive.

I hope everybody has a great season.
 
Utah400Elk said:
He took his first elk in Utah and neither money or vacation time had anything to do with his opportunity. I put a ton of time into scouting in Utah and his success was a direct result of years of scouting and hunting the area. Many of the hunts he has enjoyed have been day hunts or long weekend hunts. I lived in Utah for over 20 years and never had a hard time finding animals to chase.

The real question would be…is this about opportunity or opportunity at coveted LE tags? The deer hunting opportunities in Utah are quickly disappearing but there are a lot of options for elk and antlerless tags. The out of state hunts are a little more money for the youth tags and a little more gas from Utah but can still be done for a few hundred dollars and a couple extra hours drive.

I hope everybody has a great season.
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Troll!!!! Didn’t you read the OP? His friends kid hasn’t had a tag in 3 years!
 
Utah400Elk said:
He took his first elk in Utah and neither money or vacation time had anything to do with his opportunity. I put a ton of time into scouting in Utah and his success was a direct result of years of scouting and hunting the area. Many of the hunts he has enjoyed have been day hunts or long weekend hunts. I lived in Utah for over 20 years and never had a hard time finding animals to chase.

The real question would be…is this about opportunity or opportunity at coveted LE tags? The deer hunting opportunities in Utah are quickly disappearing but there are a lot of options for elk and antlerless tags. The out of state hunts are a little more money for the youth tags and a little more gas from Utah but can still be done for a few hundred dollars and a couple extra hours drive.

I hope everybody has a great season.
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But you had the time invested. Some people can't swing that. The whole premise to this thread is opportunity in general and not specific to UT. The other states always mentioned require both time and money. And, because some people can't swing the invested time others will say "how is that may problem". Well, it's not and nobody ever said it was. The point is, not everyone's situation is the same so it's not a cut and dry solution of if you want to do it you can make it happen.

It's opportunity in general, not necessarily coveted tags. When things develop some humor is when "grown-ups" cry about decreased opportunity for them at the expense of increased opportunity for youth.
 
Yep let’s change the system for the lowest common denominator. If your kid isnt hunting big game every fall it’s no ones fault but your own. That’s it’s, no need to change the system.
 
I’ll say it again, in UTAH, which is where the OP lives…

-20% general deer tags reserved for you in drawing
-OTC archery general deer tags available every year for youth
-OTC UNLIMITED youth GS any bull elk tags
-OTC spike tags (unlimited quota for archery)
-youth early draw any bull tags
-20% antlerless permits reserved for you in drawing
-OTC antlerless control and private lands tags
-adult permit mentor program for youth

That’s just for big game. We also have…

-youth upland hunts throughout the state
-OTC general youth turkey season, then a regular season for them
-20% draw turkey permits reserved for youth
-OTC fall turkey tags that are valid for 5 MONTHS
-youth waterfowl hunt
-dove, quail, chukar, pheasant, rabbit and many other species you can hunt to fill in the gaps.

if your kid isn’t hunting EVERY weekend from august to February, that’s the PARENTS fault.

and to the dude saying a duck hunt doesn’t measure up to a deer hunt, you’ve obviously ever experienced a real barrel burner on ducks. I’ve yet to take a kid on one of those hunts that couldn’t wait to do it again. It’s not the same as shooting a deer, but to say it doesn’t compare, isn’t even close to an accurate statement, especially in the eyes of a kid who wants to see action and have a good time. That’s all the kid cares about
 
To each their own. If a person can’t swing time to invest in their own interest than what will more opportunity do for them? I learned the areas I know while working on minimum wage jobs… Most of the time multiple jobs.

For me, the best part of hunting is the adventure of the hunt. I love the scouting, hiking, glassing and camping. With each passing year I learned a little more. I understand time constraints as well as anybody. What I don’t understand is how more opportunity would help (there is plenty now) if they can’t swing the time anyway.

I guess I am turning into an old grumpy bastard because I don’t understand the issue. I am very fortunate to have a healthy son who loves to hunt with me. As long as he is willing, I will find the opportunity for us to enjoy our hunts.
 
The youth get tired easily. We should have a late season hunt on the winter range where they are guaranteed success. Also kids get cold easily so they can shoot from the warmth of a pickup truck.
 
OP - pm me,! Enough BS.My daughter is putting in for the second draw here in Colorado. Youth get preference : lots of great tags!!! Like they have preference points. It’s a first here. Was a bit mad I didn’t draw my antelope but there are two tags in the list so hope she draws - this is cool.

If you draw I’ll be happy to take ya.
Never liked that youth do not have a separate season here really either, only waterfowl which is like a week?, but make the most of what ya got man!

Do your best and have fun with your kid!
 
Utah400Elk said:
To each their own. If a person can’t swing time to invest in their own interest than what will more opportunity do for them? I learned the areas I know while working on minimum wage jobs… Most of the time multiple jobs.

For me, the best part of hunting is the adventure of the hunt. I love the scouting, hiking, glassing and camping. With each passing year I learned a little more. I understand time constraints as well as anybody. What I don’t understand is how more opportunity would help (there is plenty now) if they can’t swing the time anyway.

I guess I am turning into an old grumpy bastard because I don’t understand the issue. I am very fortunate to have a healthy son who loves to hunt with me. As long as he is willing, I will find the opportunity for us to enjoy our hunts.
Click to expand...

Yes. There is opportunity. Yes. You can have a tag in your pocket for the sake of having a tag in your pocket.

What is the point, or desire, to choice LE hunt opportunities? If just any opportunity is sufficient, there is no need for a prime LE hunt that can produce 200"+ mule deer.

The same reason people pursue those opportunities are the same reasons a youth wants a good hunt experience, I've heard them say it before.

If just any hunt opportunity isn't good enough for everyone what good do choice LE hunt opportunities do for anyone?

By the way, SS! in your corner as a cheerleader isn't worth much...
 
roadrunner said:
Yes. There is opportunity. Yes. You can have a tag in your pocket for the sake of having a tag in your pocket.

What is the point, or desire, to choice LE hunt opportunities? If just any opportunity is sufficient, there is no need for a prime LE hunt that can produce 200"+ mule deer.

The same reason people pursue those opportunities are the same reasons a youth wants a good hunt experience, I've heard them say it before.

If just any hunt opportunity isn't good enough for everyone what good do choice LE hunt opportunities do for anyone?

By the way, SS! in your corner as a cheerleader isn't worth much...
Click to expand...
?‍? we know you’re old RR but damn didn’t think you lost your marbles. Next you will be like “ what are marbles?” “Does one truly have marbles”

Stop trying to make this some deep wanna be spiritual BS.

There’s already too many hunters out there. We don’t need to do anything to season structures or tag allocation to recruit youth. All it does is gets a few snowflakes some animals that they don’t appreciate and never will.

I know in your world RR you’re a liberal and want everyone to have a trophy. You want to take from those that have and give to those that do not. It’s the way you D’s roll. No thanks!!!
 
I am not looking for cheerleaders but he is right on this one. I am simply stating there is plenty of youth opportunity which was what the OP started this thread for.

In reading this thread, it looks like OP was able to draw a tag and his son was not lucky this year. It looks like he would like his son to have the same opportunity. They could have applied as a party and guaranteed that if one of them drew, they would have both drawn. FWIW…I have seen 200 + inch mule deer in OTC units and 380 class bulls. They are few and far between but they are available. There are trophy class mule deer along the Wasatch every year that is open to youth hunters.

I prefer LE tags, and I have had more than my share. They are definitely a much better experience and I do think the odds are stacked against youth for the coveted LE tags. It’s not a “fair” system. To me, a random draws like NM and WY elk, deer and lope are the only fair system. Last time I drew a NM tag was 2001 and It started two days after 9/11. I have had a 20 year dry spell for elk in NM. If youth don’t want to hunt if they can’t have 200+ inch mule deer then there is nothing that can be done for them. I will probably never draw a sheep tag. I have been trying for almost 30 years. I will probably leave this place with a crap ton of points in multiple states without ever having a sheep tag. I don’t think we need to make more opportunity for AARP members (not one yet but much closer to that than 21).

It’s not my game but I will continue to play. However, I have had a ton of memorable hunts along the way.
 
Last edited:
Utah400Elk said:
I am not looking for cheerleaders but he is right on this one. I am simply stating there is plenty of youth opportunity which was what the OP started this thread for.

In reading this thread, it looks like OP was able to draw a tag and his son was not lucky this year. It looks like he would like his son to have the same opportunity. They could have applied as a party and guaranteed that if one of them drew, they would have both drawn. FWIW…I have seen 200 + inch mule deer in OTC units and 380 class bulls. They are few and far between but they are available. There are trophy class mule deer along the Wasatch every year that is open to youth hunters.

I prefer LE tags, and I have had more than my share. They are definitely a much better experience and I do think the odds are stacked against youth for the coveted LE tags. It’s not a “fair” system. To me, a random draws like NM and WY elk, deer and lope are the only fair system. Last time I drew a NM tag was 2001 and It started two days after 9/11. I have had a 20 year dry spell for elk in NM. If youth don’t want to hunt if they can’t have 200+ inch mule deer then there is nothing that can be done for them. I will probably never draw a sheep tag. I have been trying for almost 30 years. I will probably leave this place with a crap ton of points in multiple states without ever having a sheep tag. I don’t think the need to make more opportunity for AARP members (not one yet but much closer to that than 21).

It’s not my game but I will continue to play. However, I have had a ton of memorable hunts along the way.
Click to expand...
I agree, if a youth only wants trophy quality animals on trophy quality hunts, their "mentor" is the bigger child of the two and failed them miserably.

Back in the day, a hunt was just a hunt. There were very few prized hunts and most people didn't get wrapped up in them. Along comes publications touting trophy importance and that was followed by flat brim glory photos. Now only LE trophy quality hunts are most important, the hunting industry is centered around it, including management in some cases, and youth hunts are all the average opportunity hunts we used to normally do all the time.

The question is should youth be guarenteed a tag? No different than an adult thinking they are entitled because they're older, have been hunting longer, have more points, more time, the list goes on.

SS! isn't right on much of anything...
 
roadrunner said:
I agree, if a youth only wants trophy quality animals on trophy quality hunts, their "mentor" is the bigger child of the two and failed them miserably.

Back in the day, a hunt was just a hunt. There were very few prized hunts and most people didn't get wrapped up in them. Along comes publications touting trophy importance and that was followed by flat brim glory photos. Now only LE trophy quality hunts are most important, the hunting industry is centered around it, including management in some cases, and youth hunts are all the average opportunity hunts we used to normally do all the time.

The question is should youth be guarenteed a tag? No different than an adult thinking they are entitled because they're older, have been hunting longer, have more points, more time, the list goes on.

SS! isn't right on much of anything...
Click to expand...
What a bunch of BS. Time for the people at the old folks home to take you from the keyboard to the big window to look outside. You’re living in la la land that’s for sure..
 
Utah400Elk said:
My son is 13 and has a ton of opportunity. We live in east coast now but he was born in Utah and we have lived in Colorado, NV, WY and TX. My job has us moving way too much.

He got his first elk last year, shot his first buck a couple year ago. He has been on four elk hunts (he had the tag on one) three mule deer hunts numerous whitetail hunts and a public water draw hunt for alligators. He has a great elk tag this year in Colorado. There are really almost unlimited opportunities for youth hunters out west. He will hunt elk and bear in Colorado this year and then be back out west to hunt elk in NM with me. We had to withdraw him from Wyoming so that he didn’t have too many tags this year. I am all for youth opportunity but in reality, opportunity is not prohibiting youth from hunting every year. Most states offer discounts for NR youth and the draw odds are almost 100%. If the OP is still looking for his kid…There are leftover tags for antelope in WY.

Beat of luck to everybody this year. Hope you and your kids have a great year. There is plenty of opportunity out there for everybody…including youth hunters.
Click to expand...
You guys are missing the point I’m not bit**in about him never being able to hunt I’m talking strictly about THE FIRST YEAR for big game! He’s been on numerous hunts and shot ducks turkey and plenty of small game. And as far as everyone saying he/me are feeling entitled and all that BS how many of you hop on here bit**in about how many UN’s you got every year come result time ?
 
Muleman1 said:
You guys are missing the point I’m not bit**in about him never being able to hunt I’m talking strictly about THE FIRST YEAR for big game! He’s been on numerous hunts and shot ducks turkey and plenty of small game. And as far as everyone saying he/me are feeling entitled and all that BS how many of you hop on here bit**in about how many UN’s you got every year come result time ?
Click to expand...
You’re right.
 
Muleman1 said:
You guys are missing the point I’m not bit**in about him never being able to hunt I’m talking strictly about THE FIRST YEAR for big game! He’s been on numerous hunts and shot ducks turkey and plenty of small game. And as far as everyone saying he/me are feeling entitled and all that BS how many of you hop on here bit**in about how many UN’s you got every year come result time ?
Click to expand...
OTC youth archery deer tag for the unit of your choice and OTC any bull OR spike tag for the weapon(s) of your choice… PROBLEM SOLVED!

all that in addition to YOU mentoring YOUR permit to him. PROBLEM SOLVED!
 
hossblur said:
Hunting is maintained by grey hairs to support grey hairs.

I'm 47.

At 14 in Utah I got a statewide, 3 weapon deer tags by going with my dad to Sunset Sports Thursday before the opener.

I got an open bull tag, from the same Sunset Sports.

There was no points scheme. And when it did start, a guy could put in for all species, across the board.

There were few if any outfitters locking up corn fields, wetlands or MTN ground. Weren't CWMU either.

You generally bought a Lions club or other fundraiser pass that allowed you to hunt pheasants anywhere with that color sign.

You accessed said property by riding your bike through town with your shotgun, or by having it in your back window at school.

I now have a son.

47% success rate for Manti rifle tag.
3% for an elk tag same unit.

He will never draw the sheep he applied for.

Pheasant hunting is dead. Any field a goose would look at is locked up to guides. Most of Northern Utah is CWMU.

Let's not even mention the current zero .22 or .410 so IF a kid could plink, he can't.

So we say "end points, make it equal across the board", and the grey hairs squeal

Guarantee a kid a tag, the grey hairs squeal.

Those same grey hairs would NEVER have hung around 3years at the start hoping for a tag.
Click to expand...
Hey Hoss I hate to break this to you but you say "Grey Hairs" at 47 you are in the same demographic as us.... I'll even bet you have grey hair at 47.......
Maybe not a boomer but close enough
 
DeerHunter53 said:
Hey Hoss I hate to break this to you but you say "Grey Hairs" at 47 you are in the same demographic as us.... I'll even bet you have grey hair at 47.......
Maybe not a boomer but close enough
Click to expand...


Never denied I was, but I was a kid when the points started
 
Guys ask me why I have a lot of points in different states, well it’s because I gave up my hunting to take my kids hunting with every chance I can find. I still get to hunt, just not three months a year, my wife started hunting when the girls became of age. I will sacrifice my hunting again this year for the reason my oldest daughter drew a Moose Tag. Idaho has been good to my kids. Here’s just a few of my favorite pics of them.
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Muleman1,

Can you please clarify so that I can understand your post. Do you think youth hunters should be guaranteed a general season deer tag, a LE tag, or just a tag the first year they apply?
 
Utah400Elk said:
Muleman1,

Can you please clarify so that I can understand your post. Do you think youth hunters should be guaranteed a general season deer tag, a LE tag, or just a tag the first year they apply?
Click to expand...
Just a general deer tag, or elk tag first year. In utah youth elk tags are available for youth but I’m talking about multiple states for youth
 
There are usually leftover elk tags in the other states. My son picked up a great tag with no points and will have a phenomenal hunt. It’s not a great bull tag but cow in the rut with muzzleloader will be awesome!
 

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