Horn mass vs longer points

Aceman · Mar 17, 2020

What are you thoughts on how much mass may take away from the score of a bull. Assume that a 7x8 bull with 52 inches of main beam and 65+ inches of mass. Since the mass is only measured on 4 places of each beam is the rest of the mass not counted wasted. Sounds like maybe if less mass and if it was redistributed to longer point length would give a much better score. The bull gross scored 363 3/8 .

Shadow · Mar 17, 2020

Length trumps mass all day long for the reasons you just gave but there's something about a heavy bull that I think makes a score just a number.

yoteduster · Mar 17, 2020

I agree with shadow I'll take mass and Palmation any day

jims · Mar 17, 2020

If you are looking for better score in antlered game (elk and deer) a larger proportion of the score is tine length than mass. This is totally opposite to horned game (sheep, mtn goat, and antelope). Obviously additional mass adds to a score....I always figure that heavier mass in antlered game is a bonus.

antlerradar · Mar 18, 2020

There is no guaranty that if the bull had less mass that the points would be longer other than slightly longer points dew to a lower base line.

SDBugler · Mar 18, 2020

Jims summed it up pretty well.

A couple comments to add. Mass in the main beams helps but mass in the tines does nothing for score. Also, thick tines makes them look shorter. A good example - I almost passed up the bull in my signature picture. I didn't have a real good look at his rack as he was behind some trees but at first I thought he was just an average bull because of he just "looked like" a standard 310 - 315 bull. This is one of the few animals that grew as I walked up on him and realized that his mass made him "proportionally" look smaller than the 350 class bull he was (if he wasn't broken).

I agree with your comment though about bulls with lots of mass giving up some potential score. A bull can only put so much "material" into his rack. if that material goes into creating mass and webbing rather than beam & tine length, then the score will be compromised. But each bull is unique in his own way regardless of what a score sheet says.

buckhorn · Mar 18, 2020

Here’s a pic of my best bull.
It’s a good example of how tine length means more to score than mass.
He doesn’t have a lot of mass but he still officially scores 381 gross and 375 net.

buckhorn · Mar 18, 2020

Same bull, different angle

mickeyelk · Mar 19, 2020

Nice bull!

rutnbuck · Mar 20, 2020

You can never make up points in Mass vs horn length. However mass is way cool. I have a bull with a 80 in of mass. Didn't score that well due to short tine length. But he is a monster.

buckhorn · Mar 20, 2020

rutnbuck said:
You can never make up points in Mass vs horn length. However mass is way cool. I have a bull with a 80 in of mass. Didn't score that well due to short tine length. But he is a monster.

Love to see some pics if you have any?

Bluehair · Mar 20, 2020

What he ^ said.

rutnbuck · Mar 20, 2020

buckhorn said:
Love to see some pics if you have any?

53 wide 62 main beams

Aceman · Mar 21, 2020

Nice bull - would like to see some more pictures of bulls with a lot of mass - think I read somewhere where the average mass on big bulls was around 55-60 inches -

cmbbulldog · Mar 21, 2020

cmbbulldog · Mar 21, 2020

On the above.... if you take mass measurement between the G4 and G5... assuming the G4 comes off the main beam, there is 80 inches of mass.

Vanilla · Mar 21, 2020

Can I have both, please?

txhunter58 · Mar 22, 2020

Lets look at this another way. You have two bulls that both score 350. Which bull would I rather have on my wall. Longer thin tines or shorter tines and more mass? I will take the mass any day.

But as stated, at a distance, it is hard to tell how good an above average mass bull really is. Up close (on my wall) I like mass.

Adventurewriter · Mar 22, 2020

Always thoughts the have it backwards mass means everything in Pronghorns and little in deer and elk scoring...when I think visually it is the opposite... other than general brackets I'm done with scoring a bad ass animal....and or experience is just that I don't need little tick's on a tape tell me that

Focoelkman · Mar 23, 2020

cmbbulldog said:
On the above.... if you take mass measurement between the G4 and G5... assuming the G4 comes off the main beam, there is 80 inches of mass.

That is super impressive.

BrowningRage · May 7, 2020

As some have said, this is why a B&C Score is just a number. If we wanted to measure trophies by the "size" of their antlers, we should dip them in water and they should be score on some sort of cubic inches of water or something. Then its all about the amount of bone on their head.

An antler that has a full inch more of mass at each measurement spot may only add 8" to your B&C score, but it adds a lot of weight and would displace a lot more liquid, giving it a much higher amount of bone.

Food for Thought.

nripepi · May 7, 2020

When Mr. Boone and Mr. Crockett developed this score sheet

, they should have had 6 mass measurements. Add one between G1 and the base and then one between G5 and G6. If it doesn't have a G6, just do the half way distance....that would make things much more equitable between mass and length. B&C is all about the length if you have antlers.

nripepi · May 7, 2020

While we are discussing this, what happens on the 8th tines of an 8X8 elk that come off the beam just like the other points at the end? Do they take away from the score when scored as a typical?

marley · May 7, 2020

65 “ of mass

buckhorn · May 7, 2020

marley said:
View attachment 6455
65 “ of mass

marley
Wow!
Whenever I see a pic on here of a giant Bull Elk or Buck Mule Deer chances are your name is going to be next to it.
I am impressed with your success!
You are very good with your Killshot set ups as well.

cosmic_cowboy · May 9, 2020

I Love mass but the first thing well maybe second thing I look at is the length of the 3ds.... most 6 point bulls with long 3ds will score well. As you can see from pics above they all have exceptional 3ds.

khunter · May 13, 2020

65 inches of mass on 50 inch beams. Mass was a sizeable chunk of 363 gross score.

I was happy with this bull on a tag bought off leftover list day before season. First pic was from a mile plus away and there was no question if he was one to put in a great effort for..